New to this forum Am I or not??

[Zita123]

I am bipolar but lately I have trouble with 2 voices in my head.. a good one and a bad one.
When I am saying my prayers at night, the other voice in my hea is yelling and swearing and showing me pics of sexual things.. Is this how it is or could this just be satan trying to stop me from praying??
Zita

 

[Ssarl]

This sounds awfully similar, I'm afraid.
Opinion remains divided as to the source of this. Doctors would say it's a fault in your brain causing hallucinations and perscribe drugs. Some more spiritual inclined would suggest demonic opression.

To be frank, I do not believe the doctors I dealt with had the faintest clue what they were on about... yet praying for this worked, and in Jesus' name I was set free from my tormentors. I found it very difficult to pray myself because of all the distraction this obviously caused, but I asked for help from some Christians at my university and church, including a service where many gathered in prayer for my healing... and after about four months it was gone. By this stage, the drugs had succeeded in giving me tremors and making me vaguely stoned.

So, me... I believe you need Jesus. I pray that you will find this release.

 

[Zita123]

Your not on any kind of meds now? After I wrote this thread yesterday, I looked this up and printed out the " answer " of what this illness is. It really does sound alot like me. I do pray alot and have others praying for me . This does help!! But, Now I don't know if anything about GOD telling me to tell people things are true??
Oh well, I guess I'll pray on that too!!
Thanks for caring, GOD BLESS!!
Zita

This sounds awfully similar, I'm afraid.
Opinion remains divided as to the source of this. Doctors would say it's a fault in your brain causing hallucinations and perscribe drugs. Some more spiritual inclined would suggest demonic opression.

To be frank, I do not believe the doctors I dealt with had the faintest clue what they were on about... yet praying for this worked, and in Jesus' name I was set free from my tormentors. I found it very difficult to pray myself because of all the distraction this obviously caused, but I asked for help from some Christians at my university and church, including a service where many gathered in prayer for my healing... and after about four months it was gone. By this stage, the drugs had succeeded in giving me tremors and making me vaguely stoned.

So, me... I believe you need Jesus. I pray that you will find this release.

 

[BohemianChris]

Find an atypical antipsychotic that works for you and be glad the voices are gone.

Best,
Chris

 

[Shannonkish]

I would be hard pressed to say that this isn't schizophrenia. Many psychological disorders can be accompanied with hallucinations (auditory or visual). While schizophrenia is one of those disorders, simply having auditory hallucinations does not mean that it is schizophrenia.

Since you mentioned no other symptoms, I would say this is not schizophrenia.

The following is the Diagnostis criteria, from the DSM IV, for schizophrenia. This can be found here. (The DSM-IV is the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, 4th edition. Psychiatrists and Psychologists use this manual to diagnose any and all psychological disorders.)

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]A. Characteristic symptoms: Two (or more) of the following, each present for a significant portion of time during a 1-month period (or less if successfully treated): [/size][/font]

• [font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]delusions [/size][/font]
• [font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]hallucinations [/size][/font]
• [font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]disorganized speech (e.g., frequent derailment or incoherence) [/size][/font]
• [font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]grossly disorganized or catatonic behavior [/size][/font]
• [font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]negative symptoms, i.e., affective flattening, alogia, or avolition [/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Note: Only one Criterion A symptom is required if delusions are bizarre or hallucinations consist of a voice keeping up a running commentary on the person's behavior or thoughts, or two or more voices conversing with each other. [/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]B. Social/occupational dysfunction: For a significant portion of the time since the onset of the disturbance, one or more major areas of functioning such as work, interpersonal relations, or self-care are markedly below the level achieved prior to the onset (or when the onset is in childhood or adolescence, failure to achieve expected level of interpersonal, academic, or occupational achievement). [/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]C. Duration: Continuous signs of the disturbance persist for at least 6 months. This 6-month period must include at least 1 month of symptoms (or less if successfully treated) that meet Criterion A (i.e., active-phase symptoms) and may include periods of prodromal or residual symptoms. During these prodromal or residual periods, the signs of the disturbance may be manifested by only negative symptoms or two or more symptoms listed in Criterion A present in an attenuated form (e.g., odd beliefs, unusual perceptual experiences).[/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]D. Schizoaffective and Mood Disorder exclusion: Schizoaffective Disorder and Mood Disorder With Psychotic Features have been ruled out because either (1) no Major Depressive Episode, Manic Episode, or Mixed Episode have occurred concurrently with the active-phase symptoms; or (2) if mood episodes have occurred during active-phase symptoms, their total duration has been brief relative to the duration of the active and residual periods.[/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]E. Substance/general medical condition exclusion: The disturbance is not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication) or a general medical condition.[/size][/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]F. Relationship to a Pervasive Developmental Disorder: If there is a history of Autistic Disorder or another Pervasive Developmental Disorder, the additional diagnosis of Schizophrenia is made only if prominent delusions or hallucinations are also present for at least a month (or less if successfully treated).

[/size][/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]
Also, note that [/size][/font]The Prevalance Rate for schizophrenia is approximately 1.1% of the population over the age of 18. (http://www.schizophrenia.com) In the United States that figure is 7.2 per 1,000. This means that schizophrenia is a rare brain diease.

 

[Ssarl]

Shannonkish,
I would ask you most strongly to refrain from amateur diagnosis; I appreciate that you might want to help, and I've no idea wheather you've had the illness yourself (if so, I invite you to talk to me any time you want support), but making a call on these matters over the internet is never, never, never a good idea.

Firstly:

Note: Only one Criterion A symptom is required if delusions are bizarre or hallucinations consist of a voice keeping up a running commentary on the person's behavior or thoughts, or two or more voices conversing with each other.

This might well be the case, or she might have other symptoms she hasn't mentioned. There is by no means enough info to go on.

Zita - the only way to get a clear diagnosis with this is to talk to a medical professional and be completely honest with them (my own diagnosis was a bit complicated, in part because I didn't admit to everything that was happening or understand that some bits of it were actually abnormal).

I am not on meds... my story is in the large thread, the one about 'I'll be the first topic'. My symptoms have largely gone; I am left with some problems but they pale in comparison to the state things were in before.

 

[Shannonkish]

Ssarl,

While I stated that I wasn't a psychiatrist, I do happen to work in the Mental health field. I also stated that it would be best for the OP to see a medical professional. (See the sticky of this forum). My point in posting what I did was not to diagnose the OP, as I can't diganose. I know enough, however, (being that I am a master's student working on being licensed and currently hold my BS in Psychology, as well as work in this field), to know that given the symptoms described, I can almost bet that in this case, the OP is not suffering from Schizophrenia, but I am willing to be proven wrong if a professional states otherwise. My point was to make the OP and any others that visit this thread aware of the fact that just because someone has auditory or visual hallucinations does NOT mean they are schizophrenic. There are plenty of other disorders that have these same symptoms.

Also, while only 1 Criteria from A is needed (if delusions are bizzare, (which they aren't) or consisten of a voice keeping a running commentary (which according to the OP is not the case), criteria from the other sections B-F must also be present.

Diganosis of a mental disorder NEVER occurs if only a single symptom is present. For example, if I was feeling sad, a PsyD. would NOT diagnosis me with Depression based solely on the feeling of sadness. This is the purpose of the DSM IV. The criteria is pretty specific because, as I mentioned, Schizophrenia is a rare(r) psychological disorder.

 

[Zita123]

this is what I was diagnosed with. I do have a lot more symptoms that I would not like to write about right now. But, Thank you.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!
Zita

Ssarl,

While I stated that I wasn't a psychiatrist, I do happen to work in the Mental health field. I also stated that it would be best for the OP to see a medical professional. (See the sticky of this forum). My point in posting what I did was not to diagnose the OP, as I can't diganose. I know enough, however, (being that I am a master's student working on being licensed and currently hold my BS in Psychology, as well as work in this field), to know that given the symptoms described, I can almost bet that in this case, the OP is not suffering from Schizophrenia, but I am willing to be proven wrong if a professional states otherwise. My point was to make the OP and any others that visit this thread aware of the fact that just because someone has auditory or visual hallucinations does NOT mean they are schizophrenic. There are plenty of other disorders that have these same symptoms.

Also, while only 1 Criteria from A is needed (if delusions are bizzare, (which they aren't) or consisten of a voice keeping a running commentary (which according to the OP is not the case), criteria from the other sections B-F must also be present.

Diganosis of a mental disorder NEVER occurs if only a single symptom is present. For example, if I was feeling sad, a PsyD. would NOT diagnosis me with Depression based solely on the feeling of sadness. This is the purpose of the DSM IV. The criteria is pretty specific because, as I mentioned, Schizophrenia is a rare(r) psychological disorder.

 

[Shannonkish]

Ah, okay. Schizoaffective disorder is a bit different.

 

[Ssarl]

Zita,
I received the same diagnosis - schizoaffective psychotic disorder, quite a tongue-twister! It wasn't a happy day hearing it, but it's good to have a better idea of what I'm up against, at least...

Shannon,
As well as reiterating that I really don't believe *any* discussion of diagnoses should happen on these forums (it's both dangerous and *deeply* unflattering), I would like to point out something, which I have gained from my personal experience as a patient...

There is a difference between 'having no other symptoms' and 'MENTIONING no other symptoms'. The OP hasn't explicitedly stated that there is no running commentary, for one - there's a lot of ambiguity there. Ask. Never assume there isn't more to the picture.

I never brought some things up of my own accord because I had no idea they were a symptom, for one. For so long I'd had phrases and images occur repeatedly in my mind that I just didn't question it, I had to be told that it was quite a serious condition (and it's now gone... hurrah).

I hope you will remember this...

 

[Shannonkish]

Ssarl,

Let me remind you. I did not diagnose anyone or anything. All I have stated were facts. I never stated that the OP didn't have other symptoms... I simply stated that...

I know enough, however,...to know that given the symptoms described, I can almost bet that in this case, the OP is not suffering from Schizophrenia, but I am willing to be proven wrong if a professional states otherwise.

Please note the bolded part!!

I am not really sure why you are getting so worked about this. I never diagnosed anyone, nor did I state anything other than fact and my opinion. I suggested, several times for the OP to see a licensed professional.

Blah blah blah... I am tired of defending my posts, which are simply stated facts about this mental disorder. So, I will leave you to your forum. Enjoy!

 

[Ssarl]

There's a time and a place. I encourage your interest in this field and your discussion of the facts (I study psychology itself, inspired by my experiences with schiz, and I love discussing it...) but this forum just isn't appropriate for it. It's for patients to share their experiences rather than an intellectual discussion of the disease...
I really don't want a fight about this, there's no point. All that's needed is a bit of consideration from all concerned.

*offers hugs and a basket of kittens to diffuse situation*

 

[Shannonkish]

whatever.

 

[Zita123]

Thank you for caring. I will keep you in my prayers always!
GOD BLESS YOU!
Zita If I have some weird questions can I pm you?

Zita,
I received the same diagnosis - schizoaffective psychotic disorder, quite a tongue-twister! It wasn't a happy day hearing it, but it's good to have a better idea of what I'm up against, at least...

Shannon,
As well as reiterating that I really don't believe *any* discussion of diagnoses should happen on these forums (it's both dangerous and *deeply* unflattering), I would like to point out something, which I have gained from my personal experience as a patient...

There is a difference between 'having no other symptoms' and 'MENTIONING no other symptoms'. The OP hasn't explicitedly stated that there is no running commentary, for one - there's a lot of ambiguity there. Ask. Never assume there isn't more to the picture.

I never brought some things up of my own accord because I had no idea they were a symptom, for one. For so long I'd had phrases and images occur repeatedly in my mind that I just didn't question it, I had to be told that it was quite a serious condition (and it's now gone... hurrah).

I hope you will remember this...

 

[Ssarl]

Not sure if that was aimed at me, but yes, feel free to PM me. Some things I will be able to answer, some things I may not.... I will try. And pray.

 

[Zita123]

That was to you and thank you.
I just noticed that your from Australia. I have always wanted to go there. Is it nice??

Not sure if that was aimed at me, but yes, feel free to PM me. Some things I will be able to answer, some things I may not.... I will try. And pray.

 

[Ssarl]

I'm not sure - it's the only country I've lived in!
I do hear that people are very fond of Australia's beaches; they're a very beautiful place. A few months back we had a week-long retreat on the coast, and every day we'd all have a time of quiet on the beach with God. It was a totally awesome way to experience Him. It's also got some beautiful mountains - if you can handle how long it takes to get there, there's some truly awesome stuff to find!

Australia is very much divided into the city and the country - there's no inbetween, since there can be hundreds of kilometres between places. I live in Brisbane now, which by my standards is a huge city, but I've heard there are many in America that make it look puny! Prior to this, I spend my whole childhood in a tiny little town called Moura, which is in the tropics in Central Queensland. Whether you'd call that 'beautiful' depends on your idea of the word and the time of year you get there - for 11 months of the year it is very dry and everything is yellow (which I really like, because I'm so used to it)... then when it finally it rains in January, there's a good chance it will flood! Then everybody gets cut off on opposite sides of the river and everything is bright green for a while - it's very exciting.

What's it like where you are?

 

[Zita123]

I would give anything to have clear dry air!!!
You make it sound so nice!. I'm very afraid of planes so, I probably would never go there . but, I really would like to. For some reason I have lways wanted to. How long for a plane ride to conn.? I'm afraid of boats too. oh well, I guess I'll miss out on alot! I did go to Florida to Disney land! That was fun, but I had to be tranquilized!! Just kidding ( somewhat ) I did have to take Klonipin, alot of it!!
Here we have the 4 seasons. The spring, winter and fall are my favorite. Summer is everyone elses favorite. I just don't like too much heat!..
Ssarl, Thank you for writing and talking with an old lady!! lol..
BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY!!
Sue ( zita )

I'm not sure - it's the only country I've lived in!
I do hear that people are very fond of Australia's beaches; they're a very beautiful place. A few months back we had a week-long retreat on the coast, and every day we'd all have a time of quiet on the beach with God. It was a totally awesome way to experience Him. It's also got some beautiful mountains - if you can handle how long it takes to get there, there's some truly awesome stuff to find!

Australia is very much divided into the city and the country - there's no inbetween, since there can be hundreds of kilometres between places. I live in Brisbane now, which by my standards is a huge city, but I've heard there are many in America that make it look puny! Prior to this, I spend my whole childhood in a tiny little town called Moura, which is in the tropics in Central Queensland. Whether you'd call that 'beautiful' depends on your idea of the word and the time of year you get there - for 11 months of the year it is very dry and everything is yellow (which I really like, because I'm so used to it)... then when it finally it rains in January, there's a good chance it will flood! Then everybody gets cut off on opposite sides of the river and everything is bright green for a while - it's very exciting.

What's it like where you are?

 

[stranger]

If a psychiatrist had a patient with the visions of the prophets , if a prophet or saint for some reason talked to a psychiatrist about his or her visions... would the psychiatrist not say that the prophet or saint was hallucinating ?

Would the statement by the saint that he knew all truth of God and understood the future not be treated as delusions?

Is this not indeed going to be the actual fate of the few saints when the world turns against them ? {Rev 13:3-7]

OK , so some brains do cause people truble by sending messages down the wrong pathways , and it can indeed disrupt people's lives much , or even completely , even cause suicide in quite a few hard-pressed souls ... but can one not learn something about oneself and others from not treating this as 'madness' or 'illness' , can one not take this seriously as nevertheless output of something from within the being? [even when it competes with what that person wants ]

Equally , if there is faith in Jesus, does one not also have faith that God can heal ... did not Jesus and the disciples show the gift of healing by the spirit of truth of God Himself?

Thus ironically would not a saint who would himself be diagnosed as 'ill' by doctors , be the very one to seek out for a cure ?

It is a deep contradiction in the modern world...

It is also a symptom of the apostasy of christianity that the churches do not systeatically heal people, and so do demonstrably not have the spirit of truth that would UNITE them into ONE truth [John 16:13] as promised by Jesus..

Without this complete truth of God from His holy spirit the churches cannot heal [an one has to wonder what their basis is] ... one is left than with one's personal extent of faith given by God in calling one , at least some knowledge of the truth and maybe some ability to heal in a few... but who can find the few amongst to clamour of conflicting voices of modern apostasy?

Are we then to be grateful for the individual peace of God offered by thescraps of truth falling from the table of the saints, the children of Israel...?

Rather the scripture indicates [Rev 13:3-7[ that the power of Satan will offer healing and so grab centre satge to the effect of all the world worshipping ONE God and christ image ... but it will not be Jesus, Jesus says so hmself!

Then it seems to me that we can offer our friendshipand prayers to those troubled early in these increasingly troubled times that will eventually destroy the faith of billions [faith in their god image and image of christ edorsed by men ]at the return of Jesus ... then the true faith will be establshed in the saints in their translation to immortality...

but the rest shall not live again until the thousand years have past... what matter then this earth and its troubles when we know that billions will be saved in the new earth [Rev 7:9-10]

Be at peace then through His truth if you can grasp it away from the voices of traditional religion of men... for we CAN learn from scripture and from God in yearnng prayer for His truth [if we do so withand open mind toHis truth, ask Him with humble ignorance and innocence as would little children ask a Father]

Be at peace in Him as the world falls apart and do not be fooled when the antichrist unites world religion into one 'christianity, one faith of men... but almsot all men will be so fooled... are you oneof the very few who will not....

that stuggle then is now, and if you would succeed then one makes a stand with very few indeed [perhaps but about two thousand left alive of all the saints listed by Jesus [Rev 7:3-8] ... does one therefore want to suppress that struggle , to allow one to be 'normalised' to the untruth that we know from jesus that almost all men will accept in worship of Satan as God and Christ ?

Clearly the naswer is a cmpletely personal one, most men serve God by being 'bait; in God's trap for Satan [even without realising it] ... there isno shame nor penalty other than death for being deluded by God :-

2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

Ro 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy

One should not thenbe afraid of death if one is thought 'normal' in onee's religion by one's peers

Equally one should not be cowed by misundestanding of almost all the world [bar only a few saints that one may never meet until Jesus' return] if one is moved to follow god's hard truth and face the terrible ordeal of saints that is coming, whenall the world is against them for their faith in God ...

Thus be YOURSELF, whatever that is FOR God ... we are what we are FOR Him, until He takes us to Him and makes us as Him , immortal spirit ...what then of value is this world and its trials and emptinesses? ... the world is nothing and of nothing , created and destroyed almost like a passing dream ... whose only memorial is that it showed that evil failed to show any promise whatsoever compared to love ...

would then that God did not think that he had to know that, then mna would not have suffered so ...

but that is an idle thought since god knows all things , and so in knowing he created... and here we are ... or so we see it that way ...

Yet wait then... are we , in seeing 'ourselves' as humans, making the mistake of not understanding that we were created in the image of Gd, the image of SPIRIT, not of flesh and bones! ...

And do we not believe that we shall be changed to immortal spirit ??

what then is OUR true reality? ... flesh and bones that we know are temporary or immortal spirit that is eternal?

It is rather clearly the latter I think, but then it is our fleshand bones, our 'selves' , our individual divided from God, that is illusion !

What then would psychiatrists say of me when I say this world itself is thus illusion , more like a passing dream bythe spirit that the 'physical REALITY' it is NAMED as !!

Thus am I ill to them... I do not doubt some would say that I am! Yet I do not feel ill, I am at peace as never before in my whole troubled life [of deepest depresssion at the world and the hate in it, the lack of love for all men]

AND WHY is that ? Why did peace COME as out of nowhere and to SENSES science does NOT acknowledge !

Simply I asked God, and FACED the terrible truth about MYSELF , that I am UGLY to God because of sin, but UGLY for His purpose, UGLY because GOD Himself requires men to reject sin ... but we cannot reject it until we have sinned , and so we becoe ugly .... and then god redeems us from that ugliness...

HOW does He do that? simply by pouring out His truth [Acts 2:17, John 16:13]

More importantly for unsderstanding , WHEN does He do that ?

and there is the problem , most men say that this scripture implies that our children already all prophesy,but I do not think they do :-

Acts2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

Do we not KNOW that our children do NOT all prophesy?

Are we not puzzled then that all christianity says that men must be saved in THIS life ???

Why should pour His truthout on all that have died , who will only have life again after the second resurrection ...?

Think on it , God seals all flesh in His spirit AFTER death in the second resurrection, NOT in this earth [only the few of Rev 7:38 are saints in this life!]

So God gives all truth to MOST people in the righteous new earth, so we can ALL resist sSatan and be righteous, perfect our sould as saints in the new earth and be redeemed at the great judgment... it is not what most men say ... but what does the scripture Rev 13:3-7] about what most men will say at this time ? What does tHIS scripture say that SHOULD reprove that almost universal christian belief of men?

Something one can only answer by itense study of the scripture [since the above KJV version is mistranslated anyway , the words "last days" only actually read what might better be translated as "after this" ] and by pryer to god to see if he will reveal His truth a little to one now , ahead of schedule as-it-were ...

So be at peace with everyone , even those who do not understand you, even those who would kill you for that matter, as the saints were killed for their faith, BE YOURSELF because that is what God requires... do not follow the crowd unless that is what you ARE for now... we kNOW from Jesus himself that the CROWD is WRONG, not God !! Have faith in God then , not in the crowd, if that faith in God is yet given you... else believe in men with all your heart and be decieved with billions, they [we?] to serve God, just in a different way !

In His peace,
may it be with you [my prayer]
Roger