The Monergism Safe House

[nobdysfool]

Just curious - isn't it against the rules to deride calvinism as heresy?

That's my understanding, but it seems to happen anyway....

 

[Tzaousios]

That's my understanding, but it seems to happen anyway....

It makes one wonder what really is going on, doesn't it? Very strange indeed.

 

[student ad x]

Just curious - isn't it against the rules to deride calvinism as heresy?

It depends on which "faith" is the objective one......... and whether someone is able to express his/her "belief" in an objective "truth"~!!

 

[cygnusx1]

the Monergists are not only right about Soteriology ..... they also have the best taste in MUSIC !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[AndOne]

the Monergists are not only right about Soteriology ..... they also have the best taste in MUSIC !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes - now that is true...

YouTube - ‪YYZ‬‏

 

[msortwell]

Case in point. This is from the synergist safe house.

"I'm sure I'm a to be labeled a synergist. I believe regeneration is all of God, following faith of course. I see the logical order as faith then regeneration. This is why I believe I would be labeled as a synergist, because I believe man is free to believe. I don't see how this is different then a Reformed perspective where man also cooperates with God, just after regeneration. There's still cooperation either way"

AAARRRGGHHHHHHH! This is where we are most challenged. Consider the statement quoted above.

"I don't see how this is different . . . just after . . ."

It seems that the original author was using "just" as a synonym for 'only.' Within a single sentence they say that they cannot perceive a difference and then articulate the difference!

Of course they are likely intending it to be understood as, 'I don't see the significance of the difference between before and after . . .' But this is not what is said. How can we expect individuals that so lack precision in what they write/say to interpret the writings/words of others with accuracy?

Many of us are so poorly educated that we are not equipped to determine with accuracy the meaning of the written word.

Take that truth and combine it with the radical individualism that our schools (and many churches do teach) and you have a "perfect storm."

Yes, I chose to end my rant about under-literacy with a vague metaphorical allusion. Apparently, I too have much room for improvement.

 

[msortwell]

Just curious - isn't it against the rules to deride calvinism as heresy?

Which rules, where? CF general rules?

 

[nobdysfool]

Thank you, Mods! I hope no one else was taken in by the imposter....

 

[Eleiou]

 

[heymikey80]

Which rules, where? CF general rules?

http://www.christianforums.com/t7492055/

 

[heymikey80]

Sorry, I don't come around here much.

It's odd that someone who thinks "there's cooperation either way" doesn't recognize that there's sub-operation or consequential operation, in the form of the effect God has on regenerate people, in the form of our faith.

 

[Eleiou]

 

[cygnusx1]

Here's an interesting work you might like to read , it's in 6 parts ;

Does Scripture Teach Prevenient Grace in the Wesleyan Sense? (Part I) by Thomas Schreiner


Dr. Thomas Schreiner





The Nature of Fallen Humanity


Does Scripture Teach Prevenient Grace in the Wesleyan Sense? (Part I) by Thomas Schreiner

 

[cygnusx1]

a fascinating formal debate :

Re: Prevenient Grace Debate

by T. Scott Morgan » Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:53 pm



Warranted Faith Forums • View topic - Prevenient Grace Debate


T. Scott Morgan is the Calvinist , he lets it out in the final post , straight as an arrow !

 

[cygnusx1]

... love this web site ;

Calvinists in the Hands of an Angry Arminian


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]A Brief Response to Roger Olson[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Part 1 of 3[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]by Gary L. W. Johnson
Pastor, The Church Of The Redeemer in Mesa, AZ

Pyromaniacs: Calvinists in the Hands of an Angry Arminian
--------

[/FONT] Arminianism: Semi-Pelagianism?


[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Calvinists in the Hands of an Angry Arminian: A Brief Response to Roger Olson[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Part 3 of 3[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]by Gary L. W. Johnson
Pastor, The Church Of The Redeemer in Mesa, AZ

Pyromaniacs: Arminianism: Semi-Pelagianism?
[/FONT]

 

[josh623]

i got a question... what do you guys think about the doctrine of total depravity, specifically "do un-regenerate men seek God?" Keeping in mind especially Rom 3 "there is none who seeks after God," and Acts 17 (end of chapter). what do you think?

 

[Shulamite]

i got a question... what do you guys think about the doctrine of total depravity, specifically "do un-regenerate men seek God?" Keeping in mind especially Rom 3 "there is none who seeks after God," and Acts 17 (end of chapter). what do you think?

I believe in total depravity. Even the elect are unable to seek after God, to come to Him, unless He draws them. I believe that Faith is the Lord's and it is His gift and it must be given first by Him "He is the Author of our faith" (Hebrews).

I believe those who were chosen in Him before the foundation of the world WILL come to Him because they were predestined to do so, with accordance of HIS will.

I believe that unless He enabled me (the elect) to come to Him, we would not ever come. He has to quicken us first. That which is dead cannot choose Life or quicken itself to Life. In the Psalms, David states that "surely my mother conceived me in sin". Being born in sin, totally depraved, means we are totally unable to "see" Jesus muchless come to Him. "You can do NOTHING apart from Me." and that includes coming to Him.

Arminianism (in my opinion) gives the credit to "man" to choose God, that there is something inherently good in man to choose God. But, this would place the credit for saving faith with men! This takes away from God's glory.

Calvinism (in my opinion) show that God alone is sovereign and He alone gets the glory and credit for salvation. "Salvation belongs to our God and to the Lamb, Who sits on the throne"

If we can choose Him apart from His work in us, then salvation would belong to BOTH "man" and "God"....

I'm all for total depravity.

 

[Eleiou]

Some more verses FOR a radically/totally depraved human condition:

Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me. Psalm 51:5

And you were dead in the trespasses and sins in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience-- among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. Ephesians 2:1-3

Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard his spots? Then also you can do good who are accustomed to do evil. Jeremiah 13:23

 

[Eleiou]

Just a post for the edification of the faithful.............

"For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."

 

[cygnusx1]

some good scriptures to remember ;

Salvation is entirely in God's hands not man's free will :
Pss.80

[1] Give ear, O Shepherd of Israel, thou that leadest Joseph like a flock; thou that dwellest between the cherubims, shine forth.
[2] Before Ephraim and Benjamin and Manasseh stir up thy strength, and come and save us.
[3] Turn us again, O God, and cause thy face to shine; and we shall be saved.


Lamentations 5:21

[21] Turn thou us unto thee, O LORD, and we shall be turned; renew our days as of old.

Pss.85

[1] LORD, thou hast been favourable unto thy land: thou hast brought back the captivity of Jacob.
[2] Thou hast forgiven the iniquity of thy people, thou hast covered all their sin. Selah.
[3] Thou hast taken away all thy wrath: thou hast turned thyself from the fierceness of thine anger.
[4] Turn us, O God of our salvation, and cause thine anger toward us to cease.


1 Kings 18 :

[37] Hear me, O LORD, hear me, that this people may know that thou art the LORD God, and that thou hast turned their heart back again.


Jeremiah 31

[18] I have surely heard Ephraim bemoaning himself thus; Thou hast chastised me, and I was chastised, as a bullock unaccustomed to the yoke: turn thou me, and I shall be turned; for thou art the LORD my God.