Religion and incest

[Seb the Atheist]

Let me start by saying that I in no way try to mock, offend or upset people with my question. Nor do I try to condemn or justify this and am I in no way trying make someone question their believe. I understand that this is a sensitive topic and apologize in advance if I'm not allowed to ask this. It's just that it has intrigued me. From what I understand, the Bible describes two events during which incest happened:

1. Adam & Eve having to populate the earth in the beginning
2. The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

My question, without trying to insult and offed anyone or have someone question their belief, is:

Is there still widespread acceptance of the occurred event among Christians, or is this something that has people divided where some believe this to have happened and others believe populating the earth may have occurred differently?

Again, I'm not trying to mock or insult, nor do I condemn or justify this. I simply would like to know if there is a consensus or if it's something that has people divided.
I myself am an Atheist but my wife is a Christian and doesn't believe it has happend like this as she points to different genetics so I'm just curious how others think on this topic.

 

[friend of]

The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

They all had wives aboard the ark.

 

[MehGuy]

Some of the animals chipped in. The random squirrel or muskrat in the family tree doesn't really dilute the human lineage too much.

 

[Qubit]

Indeed, the Bible teaches that the Human Race is a product of incest.

It is what it is.

 

[stevil]

They all had wives aboard the ark.

What about Adam and Eve and their offspring? Who did their offspring mate with?

 

[HTacianas]

Let me start by saying that I in no way try to mock, offend or upset people with my question. Nor do I try to condemn or justify this and am I in no way trying make someone question their believe. I understand that this is a sensitive topic and apologize in advance if I'm not allowed to ask this. It's just that it has intrigued me. From what I understand, the Bible describes two events during which incest happened:

1. Adam & Eve having to populate the earth in the beginning
2. The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

My question, without trying to insult and offed anyone or have someone question their belief, is:

Is there still widespread acceptance of the occurred event among Christians, or is this something that has people divided where some believe this to have happened and others believe populating the earth may have occurred differently?

Again, I'm not trying to mock or insult, nor do I condemn or justify this. I simply would like to know if there is a consensus or if it's something that has people divided.
I myself am an Atheist but my wife is a Christian and doesn't believe it has happend like this as she points to different genetics so I'm just curious how others think on this topic.

There are differing views on it, but regardless of which view one might take you are still left with the question, "If we did not all descend from one man and one woman how many men and women did we descend from"?

 

[comana]

They all had wives aboard the ark.

And their children were all siblings and first cousins. Not great for genetic diversity.

 

[John G.]

You are judging by today's standards.
The first created humans didn't have genetic defects like we have now. Marriages between brothers and sisters did not produce defective offspring and were not taboo.
Abraham married his half-sister, Isaac his cousin, Jacob his cousin.
Moses' parents apparently were nephew and aunt to each other.
However, as time went on, things changed.
Thus Moses - or should I say God through Moses - forbids marriages like his parents had.
In later years, more restrictions came into place as genetic mutations arose.
In the Greek Orthodox Church, for example, one cannot marry a third cousin (but a fourth cousin is acceptable).

 

[comana]

You are judging by today's standards.
The first created humans didn't have genetic defects like we have now. Marriages between brothers and sisters did not produce defective offspring and were not taboo.
Abraham married his half-sister, Isaac his cousin, Jacob his cousin.
Moses' parents apparently were nephew and aunt to each other.
However, as time went on, things changed.
Thus Moses - or should I say God through Moses - forbids marriages like his parents had.
In later years, more restrictions came into place as genetic mutations arose.
In the Greek Orthodox Church, for example, one cannot marry a third cousin (but a fourth cousin is acceptable).

There is nothing in the Bible that addresses different quality of genetics in these stories. And we are not talking about a couple here or there that were extremely closely related. This would apply to populating all of humanity from two people, in the case of Adam and Eve, or six, in the case of the flood.

 

[AlexB23]

Let me start by saying that I in no way try to mock, offend or upset people with my question. Nor do I try to condemn or justify this and am I in no way trying make someone question their believe. I understand that this is a sensitive topic and apologize in advance if I'm not allowed to ask this. It's just that it has intrigued me. From what I understand, the Bible describes two events during which incest happened:

1. Adam & Eve having to populate the earth in the beginning
2. The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

My question, without trying to insult and offed anyone or have someone question their belief, is:

Is there still widespread acceptance of the occurred event among Christians, or is this something that has people divided where some believe this to have happened and others believe populating the earth may have occurred differently?

Again, I'm not trying to mock or insult, nor do I condemn or justify this. I simply would like to know if there is a consensus or if it's something that has people divided.
I myself am an Atheist but my wife is a Christian and doesn't believe it has happend like this as she points to different genetics so I'm just curious how others think on this topic.

Man, this is a complex question, Mr. Sebastian, so I will try to answer it in an unbiased way in two parts. But, I am against incest, but I do give an example where incest might be used to save a hypothetical abandoned Mars colony.

Part 1, a Biblical perspective: The interpretation of the Bible's accounts of incest in the context of populating the earth is a complex issue that has been debated among Christians throughout history.

It's important to understand that there is no consensus among Christians on this issue, and opinions vary widely. Some Christian denominations may accept the literal interpretation of these passages without question, while others may interpret them in a more symbolic or allegorical way.

Moreover, many Christians today recognize the scientific evidence for human evolution and genetics, which raises questions about the literal interpretation of these biblical accounts. Some may reconcile their faith with science by viewing the Bible as a spiritual or moral guide rather than a scientific textbook.

Therefore, it's safe to say that this is an issue that has people divided within the Christian community, with some accepting the literal interpretation of these passages and others interpreting them in a more nuanced way. Ultimately, individual beliefs on this topic depend on one's interpretation of the Bible and their understanding of science and human history.

I hope this answers your question, Sebastian. I apologize if my response was too long-winded, but I wanted to provide a thorough and nuanced answer that acknowledges the complexity of this issue.

------------------------
Part 2, a hypothetical scenario: If a brother and sister were stranded on an abandoned Mars colony, would it be ethical for the two to procreate (a form of sibling incest), in order to have enough people to rebuild the colony after several generations?

This is a highly complex and controversial ethical question that goes beyond the scope of religious beliefs. It involves considerations of survival, genetics, and societal norms.

Firstly, it's important to note that sibling incest is generally considered taboo and illegal in most societies due to the potential genetic risks and social stigma. However, in a hypothetical scenario like the one you've described, where the survival of the human race on Mars might depend on it, the ethical considerations become more nuanced.

Some might argue that in such a desperate situation, where there are no other viable options for procreation and the survival of the human race is at stake, sibling incest could be justified as a necessary measure to ensure the continuation of the species. Others might say, that incest could lead to harmful genetic mutations, which I agree with. So, it it best not to do incest. It's also worth considering the potential psychological and emotional implications of such a situation for the siblings involved. Being stranded on an abandoned Mars colony with no other viable options for procreation could lead to significant psychological stress and emotional challenges.

Ultimately, the ethical considerations of sibling incest in such a scenario depend on one's values, priorities, and perspective on the situation. Some might prioritize the survival of the human race above all else, while others might prioritize the ethical considerations and potential risks.
It's important to note that this is a highly hypothetical scenario, and in reality, there are currently no plans for human colonization of Mars as of 2024. Therefore, this question is purely speculative and philosophical in nature.

 

[Diamond7]

From what I understand, the Bible describes two events during which incest happened:

1. Adam & Eve having to populate the earth in the beginning
2. The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Jaropheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

The sons of Noah already had wives before the flood. Cain was a son of God and he took his wife from the daughters of men. This was the reason for Noah's flood. Azura was the daughter of Adam and Eve and both the wife and sister of Seth in the Book of Jubilees, chapter 4. Of course this is a non canon book. If Eve came from Adam then she would have the Mitochondrial DNA of Adams mother.

Yes this is a sin for a brother and sister to have children but sin was not imputed before the law was given to Moses. .

Romans 5:13 ​

https://biblehub.com/romans/5-13.htm
There is a lot of inbreeding today with the "Jewish" people. So they do study their DNA a lot looking for cures for their diseases. This is also an issue with the Amish people who have a lot of inbreeding. The hospitals here have a separate ward for the Amish. So they do have doctors trained to treat their various conditions. Although their treatment may have no real value for anything.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Let me start by saying that I in no way try to mock, offend or upset people with my question. Nor do I try to condemn or justify this and am I in no way trying make someone question their believe. I understand that this is a sensitive topic and apologize in advance if I'm not allowed to ask this. It's just that it has intrigued me. From what I understand, the Bible describes two events during which incest happened:

1. Adam & Eve having to populate the earth in the beginning
2. The sons of Noah (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) having to populate the earth after the flood

My question, without trying to insult and offed anyone or have someone question their belief, is:

Is there still widespread acceptance of the occurred event among Christians, or is this something that has people divided where some believe this to have happened and others believe populating the earth may have occurred differently?

Again, I'm not trying to mock or insult, nor do I condemn or justify this. I simply would like to know if there is a consensus or if it's something that has people divided.
I myself am an Atheist but my wife is a Christian and doesn't believe it has happend like this as she points to different genetics so I'm just curious how others think on this topic.

I believe Adam and Eve carried the entire human gene pool, no animals or creatures, after God's image. I also believe that Neanderthals and the such ( giants, Nephellim) are outside of their gene pool as they were not made in God's image. This is why Cain was so afraid of fending for himself beyond the care of his parents and family. He joined with a woman known as the " daughters of men" he did not join with those known as " sons of God". Purely my take on the matter!!

But to your question, there was no law against insest additionally, the gene pool was so large within two people that they were able to produce all races with no abnormalities. My take as well!!

 

[Seb the Atheist]

You are judging by today's standards.
The first created humans didn't have genetic defects like we have now. Marriages between brothers and sisters did not produce defective offspring and were not taboo.
Abraham married his half-sister, Isaac his cousin, Jacob his cousin.
Moses' parents apparently were nephew and aunt to each other.
However, as time went on, things changed.
Thus Moses - or should I say God through Moses - forbids marriages like his parents had.
In later years, more restrictions came into place as genetic mutations arose.
In the Greek Orthodox Church, for example, one cannot marry a third cousin (but a fourth cousin is acceptable).

Thanks for your feedback John,
No, I'm not trying to judge and I'm aware that in some Islamic countries and cultures even today it is still permissible and sometimes even encouraged to marry a first cousin which may lead to birth defects.

 

[Seb the Atheist]

The sons of Noah already had wives before the flood. Cain was a son of God and he took his wife from the daughters of men. This was the reason for Noah's flood. Azura was the daughter of Adam and Eve and both the wife and sister of Seth in the Book of Jubilees, chapter 4. Of course this is a non canon book. If Eve came from Adam then she would have the Mitochondrial DNA of Adams mother.

Yes this is a sin for a brother and sister to have children but sin was not imputed before the law was given to Moses. .

Romans 5:13​

Romans 5:13 - Death in Adam, Life in Christ
There is a lot of inbreeding today with the "Jewish" people. So they do study their DNA a lot looking for cures for their diseases. This is also an issue with the Amish people who have a lot of inbreeding. The hospitals here have a separate ward for the Amish. So they do have doctors trained to treat their various conditions. Although their treatment may have no real value for anything.

Thanks for your feedback Diamond, especially about the Amish. I also noticed this within the Islamic community.

 

[Seb the Atheist]

Man, this is a complex question, Mr. Sebastian, so I will try to answer it in an unbiased way in two parts. But, I am against incest, but I do give an example where incest might be used to save a hypothetical abandoned Mars colony.

Part 1, a Biblical perspective: The interpretation of the Bible's accounts of incest in the context of populating the earth is a complex issue that has been debated among Christians throughout history.

It's important to understand that there is no consensus among Christians on this issue, and opinions vary widely. Some Christian denominations may accept the literal interpretation of these passages without question, while others may interpret them in a more symbolic or allegorical way.

Moreover, many Christians today recognize the scientific evidence for human evolution and genetics, which raises questions about the literal interpretation of these biblical accounts. Some may reconcile their faith with science by viewing the Bible as a spiritual or moral guide rather than a scientific textbook.

Therefore, it's safe to say that this is an issue that has people divided within the Christian community, with some accepting the literal interpretation of these passages and others interpreting them in a more nuanced way. Ultimately, individual beliefs on this topic depend on one's interpretation of the Bible and their understanding of science and human history.

I hope this answers your question, Sebastian. I apologize if my response was too long-winded, but I wanted to provide a thorough and nuanced answer that acknowledges the complexity of this issue.

------------------------
Part 2, a hypothetical scenario: If a brother and sister were stranded on an abandoned Mars colony, would it be ethical for the two to procreate (a form of sibling incest), in order to have enough people to rebuild the colony after several generations?

This is a highly complex and controversial ethical question that goes beyond the scope of religious beliefs. It involves considerations of survival, genetics, and societal norms.

Firstly, it's important to note that sibling incest is generally considered taboo and illegal in most societies due to the potential genetic risks and social stigma. However, in a hypothetical scenario like the one you've described, where the survival of the human race on Mars might depend on it, the ethical considerations become more nuanced.

Some might argue that in such a desperate situation, where there are no other viable options for procreation and the survival of the human race is at stake, sibling incest could be justified as a necessary measure to ensure the continuation of the species. Others might say, that incest could lead to harmful genetic mutations, which I agree with. So, it it best not to do incest. It's also worth considering the potential psychological and emotional implications of such a situation for the siblings involved. Being stranded on an abandoned Mars colony with no other viable options for procreation could lead to significant psychological stress and emotional challenges.

Ultimately, the ethical considerations of sibling incest in such a scenario depend on one's values, priorities, and perspective on the situation. Some might prioritize the survival of the human race above all else, while others might prioritize the ethical considerations and potential risks.
It's important to note that this is a highly hypothetical scenario, and in reality, there are currently no plans for human colonization of Mars as of 2024. Therefore, this question is purely speculative and philosophical in nature.

Thanks for your insight Alex.
Yes, I agree that this is a complex question and appreciate the lengthy answer. Part 2 is also interesting as if it were to happen, only the first 2 siblings responsible for repopulating the colony would be aware of the moral construct where as the offspring would miss that knowledge and may therefore assume it's the normal course of action. That brings in a whole different set of hypothetical questions that would be off topic such as, if the brother and sister where Atheists and didn't teach their offspring about the word of Christ and simply refrain from religious teaching, would the children stil go to heaven but that's too off topic.

So thanks again for your detailed answer and hypothetical scenario.

 

[stevil]

You are judging by today's standards.
The first created humans didn't have genetic defects like we have now. Marriages between brothers and sisters did not produce defective offspring and were not taboo.
Abraham married his half-sister, Isaac his cousin, Jacob his cousin.
Moses' parents apparently were nephew and aunt to each other.
However, as time went on, things changed.
Thus Moses - or should I say God through Moses - forbids marriages like his parents had.
In later years, more restrictions came into place as genetic mutations arose.
In the Greek Orthodox Church, for example, one cannot marry a third cousin (but a fourth cousin is acceptable).

Genetic mutations isn't the issue. The issue is the risk of grooming.

 

[AlexB23]

Thanks for your insight Alex.
Yes, I agree that this is a complex question and appreciate the lengthy answer. Part 2 is also interesting as if it were to happen, only the first 2 siblings responsible for repopulating the colony would be aware of the moral construct where as the offspring would miss that knowledge and may therefore assume it's the normal course of action. That brings in a whole different set of hypothetical questions that would be off topic such as, if the brother and sister where Atheists and didn't teach their offspring about the word of Christ and simply refrain from religious teaching, would the children stil go to heaven but that's too off topic.

So thanks again for your detailed answer and hypothetical scenario.

You're welcome bro. Well, Part 2 is an interesting question that I made up. I have ADHD and a passion for understanding our world, so I think of hypothetical scenarios a lot, and use them to answer real-world questions. The offspring of the first two siblings might not miss the moral construct that incest is bad, as the Mars colony may have computers on the base that have data on hard drives about various topics ranging from ethics to health, science, religion and law, and could take form of a basic AI (artificial intelligence). For the question of the brother and sister being atheists, and their offspring not hearing the word of Christ, God would most likely let the children go to heaven, if they have some sense of higher power. Hopefully the colony's data center has computers with the Bible on it.

Here is what a file structure for the Mars data center inside the colony base could look like in my opinion. In reality, a computer on Mars would have much more data compared to this hypothetical file directory:

1. About the colony (founded 2045) --> Founders, NASA, ESA, 2053 Colony disaster
2. Mars Info --> Cartography (map of Mars), geology
3. Earth Info --> Geological history, cartography (map of globe), global warming
4. Literature --> History, Britannica Encyclopedia, Wikipedia offline download, 19th century, 20th century, 2000s, 2010s, 2020s, 2030s
4a. Religion -->Bible, Torah, Quran, Buddhism
4b. Science --> Astronomy, Biology, Chemistry, etc...
4c. Health & Medical Records
4d. Nonfiction --> Books, audio, movies
4e. Novels --> Books, audio, movies
5. Games --> Role playing, board games, card games, video games
6. Cooking instructions

 

[Seb the Atheist]

You're welcome bro. Well, Part 2 is an interesting question that I made up. I have ADHD and a passion for understanding our world, so I think of hypothetical scenarios a lot, and use them to answer real-world questions. The offspring of the first two siblings might not miss the moral construct that incest is bad, as the Mars colony may have computers on the base that have data on hard drives about various topics ranging from ethics to health, science, religion and law, and could take form of a basic AI (artificial intelligence). For the question of the brother and sister being atheists, and their offspring not hearing the word of Christ, God would most likely let the children go to heaven, if they have some sense of higher power. Hopefully the colony's data center has computers with the Bible on it.

Here is what a file structure for the Mars data center inside the colony base could look like in my opinion. In reality, a computer on Mars would have much more data compared to this hypothetical file directory:

1. About the colony (founded 2045) --> Founders, NASA, ESA, 2053 Colony disaster
2. Mars Info --> Cartography (map of Mars), geology
3. Earth Info --> Geological history, cartography (map of globe), global warming
4. Literature --> History, Britannica Encyclopedia, Wikipedia offline download, 19th century, 20th century, 2000s, 2010s, 2020s, 2030s
4a. Religion -->Bible, Torah, Quran, Buddhism
4b. Science --> Astronomy, Biology, Chemistry, etc...
4c. Health & Medical Records
4d. Nonfiction --> Books, audio, movies
4e. Novels --> Books, audio, movies
5. Games --> Role playing, board games, card games, video games
6. Cooking instructions

You could be a good prepper
Yeah, a good gaming pc and my favorite game (Skyrim) and they can station me anywhere.
Probably an off-line version of chat gpt would be good to have.

 

[Qubit]

There is nothing in the Bible that addresses different quality of genetics in these stories.

People lived for hundreds of years back then. If not because of Genetics, then what was it that made them live so long?

 

[comana]

People lived for hundreds of years back then. If not because of Genetics, then what was it that made them live so long?

I don’t believe that any human ever lived 100s of years. With Little medical knowledge, they more likely they live shorter lifespans than we do today.