Was Eden a place on earth, heaven, or a mix of both?

[Bellicus]

I've noticed in Genesis when Adam and Eve are cast out of Eden, that cherubs are guarding the way back to the tree of life. The tree of life is not mentioned earlier in Genesis, and is not - from what I remember - mentioned again until in Revelations where it is in the center of New Jerusalem, and from what I know cherubs are not on earth. So this might suggest that the garden of Eden was the same as Paradise/Kingdom of God. But at the same time the bible mention that Eden was near rivers in Iraq like Euphrates and Tigris, and in Sumerian the word Edin means "marshland between two rivers" (if i remember it correctly), so maybe it was located in the south end of Iraq near the gulf of Persia where one of the oldest civilizations of the world is still living in a very fertile area between these two rivers, this was also near the first city in the world Uruk witch was also the birthplace of Abraham.

So where Eden physical, heavenly, or were heaven simply placed on earth, in harmony with earth before the fall of Adam and Eve?

 

[james415]

I've noticed in Genesis when Adam and Eve are cast out of Eden, that cherubs are guarding the way back to the tree of life. The tree of life is not mentioned earlier in Genesis, and is not - from what I remember - mentioned again until in Revelations where it is in the center of New Jerusalem, and from what I know cherubs are not on earth. So this might suggest that the garden of Eden was the same as Paradise/Kingdom of God. But at the same time the bible mention that Eden was near rivers in Iraq like Euphrates and Tigris, and in Sumerian the word Edin means "marshland between two rivers" (if i remember it correctly), so maybe it was located in the south end of Iraq near the gulf of Persia where one of the oldest civilizations of the world is still living in a very fertile area between these two rivers, this was also near the first city in the world Uruk witch was also the birthplace of Abraham.

So where Eden physical, heavenly, or were heaven simply placed on earth, in harmony with earth before the fall of Adam and Eve?

I believe the two trees where metaphorical. The Tree of The Knowledge of Good and Evil symbolizes all that is seen (e.g. the flesh and worldly things) and its fruit is the will of man. The Tree of Life symbolizes all that is not seen (e.g. heaven within) and its fruit is the will of God. If you believe you where born and live by the will of God then you are in God (Tree of Life). If you believe you where born and live by the will of man then you are in the world (Tree of Death, totkogae).

Blessings,
James

...

 

[Bellicus]

I am suspecting the threes are a metaphors too, and sometimes I think the whole garden of Eden is a metaphor, like for example things described in visions in the prophecies are metaphors for something bigger then our mind can grab hold on.

A good point, the tree of knowledge being the tree of Adam, the tree we all are eating from in this life. The tree of life being the tree that is growing up in all of us, that Christ have been sowing seeds in.

 

[HuntingMan]

I've noticed in Genesis when Adam and Eve are cast out of Eden, that cherubs are guarding the way back to the tree of life. The tree of life is not mentioned earlier in Genesis, and is not - from what I remember - mentioned again until in Revelations where it is in the center of New Jerusalem, and from what I know cherubs are not on earth. So this might suggest that the garden of Eden was the same as Paradise/Kingdom of God. But at the same time the bible mention that Eden was near rivers in Iraq like Euphrates and Tigris, and in Sumerian the word Edin means "marshland between two rivers" (if i remember it correctly), so maybe it was located in the south end of Iraq near the gulf of Persia where one of the oldest civilizations of the world is still living in a very fertile area between these two rivers, this was also near the first city in the world Uruk witch was also the birthplace of Abraham.

So where Eden physical, heavenly, or were heaven simply placed on earth, in harmony with earth before the fall of Adam and Eve?

I think Eden was absolutely a physical place here on earth for the very reasons your post presents...real rivers that WE know about are mentioned as far as location of the garden.

I believe that it could have been possible, seeing that eating of the one tree would keep Adam from dying, that we would have 'heaven' of sorts here on earth if it were possible to keep temptation and the desire to sin absent from the picture.

But since I believe that God FOREKNOWS all things, even mans fall, I dont believe that He was naive enough to believe that man wasnt going to get himself cast out of the garden.

 

[james415]

A good point, the tree of knowledge being the tree of Adam, the tree we all are eating from in this life. The tree of life being the tree that is growing up in all of us, that Christ have been sowing seeds in.

Exactly!

We start out worldly like the first Adam and are transformed by Gods purifying fire into being like the last Adam.

1 Corinthians 15:44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. So it is written: "The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual. The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven. As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the man from heaven, so also are those who are of heaven. And just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven.

2 Corinthians 4:16-17 Therefore we do not lose heart. Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day. For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all.

Blessings,
James

...

 

[Bellicus]

Huntingman: I see your point, since those very precise locations are mentioned Eden was most likely a physicals place on earth. But at the same time if we try to find Eden near Tigris or Euphrates, then I don't think there is anything to be found. And certainly not some Cherubs guarding the entrance with a flaming sword swinging back and forth. I am sure someone would have noticed that and talked a lot about it if there were such a place on earth. So This is where I question if Eden were directly connected to the heaven, and maybe that connection is not physical. Also "garden" could be a metaphor, since Adam and Eve were trown out of the garden after they sinned, maybe this broke their connection to the heaven, and this is what the "trowing out" means. They were still in the same fertile land, but now with the curse of work and child-birth, witch is natural parts of a physical existance.

It's fascinating to see how prescise the bible is about historical things by the way. Like the city of Uruk. I read the world-history not long ago and what was most fascinating was to read about the first signs of civilization coming at the exact spot that the bible tells that life started.

Edit: Heres a picture of some marsh-arabs, still living mostly in the same way as they used to live when Abraham was living. Really fascinating

 

[The Madcap]

I highly doubt the Garden Of Eden existed.

 

[Bellicus]

I highly doubt the Garden Of Eden existed.

Because?

 

[The Madcap]

Because?

1. If I take Genesis literally, I find it very difficult to believe, because, at least in my mind, it contradicts Evolution. 2. I don't really see any reason to believe it existed.

 

[Bellicus]

Do you think what Richard Dawkins teaches is more important then what God almighty, the creator of the universe, thought us?

Please read above, some things are clearly historical, some things must be metaphorical.

 

[The Madcap]

Do you think what Richard Dawkins teaches is more important then what God almighty, the creator of the universe, thought us?

Please read above, some things are clearly historical, some things must be metaphorical.

I don't see what you mean. I simply don't believe the Garden Of Eden existed in the same way that the island of Hawaii existed. If it's a metaphor or something along those lines, then fine. I didn't mention Richard Dawkins, but Evolution is far more convincing than a literal interpretation of Genesis.

 

[jamiel]

What he said. ^^^^^^^^^^^