Vegetarians check in here

[Mountain_Girl406]

I'd support a vegan forum!

 

[FredVB]

A vegan forum here is desirable. Yet it is with any vegan believers communicating with each other to a significant extent that this would be possible to have from those who would approve that. I do understand how many of us with this healthy and ethical choice find the communication we want and which is helpful, especially for us, with such others with using Facebook. Yet these Christian Forums are huge with many communicating, and as with many other groups and bodies that are basically consisting of Christians connected in communication, vegans are way underrepresented relative to a population at large, and there is greater absence of vegan communication. Still some come to the forums here, and having questions involving veganism, and animal issues, which gets some discussion and too often without a proper vegan response. This is an unfortunate thing when it happens, as it shouldn't, and though we get something for our own selves with such communication where it already is available, as on Facebook, there is call to answer from our perspective, and a place where we are communicating is desirable for that. The forum that we consider is just such the thing for that, but communication for our positions should be happening and ongoing, for that possibility to really come. A thread, if not more, where it can be found for this, makes a way for that possibility. The one I was using for it is just such, and we can certainly use it.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/vegan-thread-while-forum-would-be-wanted.7943257/

 

[before.the.fall]

Hi! New member here, just checking in as a strict vegetarian (AKA vegan). Hi to everyone! I'm going to come back and read through here soon!

I just wanted to say one of the main reasons I believe veganism aligns with Christianity is that the amount of meat people are eating today uses so many resources (water and food crops) and that if we stopped feeding so much to livestock (worldwide 50% of grain is fed to livestock, and growing feed crops for livestock attributes to 56% water use in the U.S.) then we would have enough to feed the world, if we only didn't feed it to livestock first, for a smaller amount of caloric output.

Of course, another big reason is that I believe God spent a lot of care creating all the different animals, and He created them to be able to feel joy and pain, and He created us to empathize with them. For these reasons, I don't think God would agree with how we're treating the animals today in feed lots and CAFOs and in slaughterhouses.

So stoked to find a place to discuss how being vegan resonates with my Christianity and Jesus' teachings! It's sad to me that the bulk of vegans are all atheists. They are leading that particular moral standing. I think as Christians, it should be us who make up the most vegans.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

Hi there! Thanks for posting here

 

[FredVB]

I am glad to see this post from a new CF member, and we need those who are vegan coming to this. Those points that were raised are right. There were Christians that were in fact the original vegans in our western culture, with those valid reasons, though the term "vegetarian" came for it earlier. And vegetarian came to mean other options, when the term "vegan" was started for that original meaning. And I had been vegetarian before in that sense of having more options, which has use of animal products still, and when I realized the good reasons to stop using any of those for consuming, I still thought of veganism as being vegetarian and would still use that term. But now I see the need for having veganism being shown completely distinct. It is, though it was known as vegetarian when that was all vegetarian meant originally. But vegetarian in the more modern sense does not deal with the issues which there really are. There is either ignorance of those issues, or if there is awareness vegetarians can learn it is with being vegan that one really deals with those. If there isn't still not ignorance, with not being vegan there is resistance showing there isn't really care for the issues. And the caring would be Christian.

 

[Eryk]

Vegan here... depending on how strict the definition is. One of the hurdles was finding a vegan alternative to glucosamine and condroitin, which helps with the pain in my joints - I hope it works out. It was easier to do without honey, wool, leather and so on.

And then there's the gelatin capsules that my other supplements come in.

And there's the food that I give my cats. They are obligate carnivores and anyway, the issue for me is what I eat.

So I guess nothing is simple. Anyway, I've dramatically reduced the amount of animal products I buy, so there's that.
.

 

[FredVB]

I hope the growth in veganism for you is going well now, Eryk. I see there are always steps in that, though it is different for individual people. Perhaps, if you didn't think of talking with the doctor who would be proscribing supplements, you can try that with stating the importance of being vegan, it is not like a doctor would think there aren't enough people going vegan for that toot be something to deal with.

There is help with communication, and there is a lot of such for vegans, such as on Facebook, as you may already know. Even those just considering being vegan can find helpful communication in that medium with Trying Vegan. Felines are often described as obligate carnivores, yet there are such individuals among them that have become vegan successfully. There is communication for that too. There is special vegan food made for them, and there are things to know to not feed a feline still, and taurine must always still be avaiable to them, as it can be without using animals. If you approach doing this, you don't have to still buy what contributes to the abuse and slaughter of animals, and the other issues from using animals, such as what I think you would be aware of.

 

[FredVB]

There are two things to yet say of veganism. It is the full goal in reality for any and all reasons anyone would or should become vegetarian, one might be vegetarian without first realizing that, as it happened for me, and many others, but from what we know now, there are all those reasons for which we should be vegan right away, it can happen as we wish it did for ourselves, and there are those who do that. Yet with knowing of this, being vegetarian, and not vegan, is just a compromise, in regard to any of the reasons. The other thing is that there is a process anyway, as more is learned about animal products in anything, to avoid those, but such can be learned quickly too instead of only with a long time, as it has happened with some of us. Being informed has a lot to do with this, and communication between vegans is important for this. And we find there are vegan alternatives for just about anything. In the case of needed medication, it would understandably be very important to get it anyway that is possible, but certainly the doctor prescribing it can be asked if there are vegan choices for it, as how medicine is derived is known.

There are yet more and more media of vegan communication in groups, Truly Vegan on Facebook is such that I can recommend, there are also many of us who are vegan Christians, who will communicate through such media, with some groups just for us with our communication as believers had through that, such as for VeganChristian and for Christian Vegans.

 

[FredVB]

I was thinking there would be more vegans and vegetarians coming to these forums still, with doing so most of them might check for any other vegans or vegetarians, and find this forum then and post something here. It just may be that veganism, and maybe even vegetarianism, is thought by Christians generally to be in conflict with "real Christianity" as they understand it, though it is not the case, there are passages in the Bible giving support for veganism, which would not conflict with the rest of the Bible anyway, which can be shown. But that view may keep vegans and vegetarians from coming to Christianity, and many hear the more vocal vegan atheists. So even vegan Christians are not coming now to these forums to face any such opposition that it apparently there, though they should be here, and atheists are posting in these forums anyway.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

I was thinking there would be more vegans and vegetarians coming to these forums still, with doing so most of them might check for any other vegans or vegetarians, and find this forum then and post something here. It just may be that veganism, and maybe even vegetarianism, is thought by Christians generally to be in conflict with "real Christianity" as they understand it, though it is not the case, there are passages in the Bible giving support for veganism, which would not conflict with the rest of the Bible anyway, which can be shown. But that view may keep vegans and vegetarians from coming to Christianity, and many hear the more vocal vegan atheists. So even vegan Christians are not coming now to these forums to face any such opposition that it apparently there, though they should be here, and atheists are posting in these forums anyway.

I don't come here much anymore, my home forum was deleted as the whole place has continuously moved to the right, and there's no place here for people like me. I check in every once in a while, but with less and less frequency

 

[FredVB]

I am sorry that whichever forum you were using was deleted. Voices speaking for veganism are needed, with the bases, veganism is right. It needs to spread, and more who will hear will change to it. It will be too bad if that is missing more in Christian Forums.

I still use communication in other places. I am interested, what other places good for sharing about veganism or with communication for vegans, online, are you using?

 

[FredVB]

With what I see, there are very few, if that much even, of vegans left here on these forums being active. It is too bad. And I mean it is too bad for these forums. It is like staying in a stone age. Veganism is growing tremendously, if vegans are not here, there are many places online where they are active. The issues to be vegan are very real, and it is not contrary to essential biblical Christianity. There are Christians, like I am, who would be giving a great amount of Christian testimony through these forums, while being vegan. But vegans, some who were seeking, and some who are really Christian, like this, have been and are driven away by the heavy argumentativeness from enough of other posters, and hostility, to their support of veganism. And so their valid voice is lost to these forums. Though I can still post here in the CF, I find it so hard to find other vegans in the communication. I will still post some things for the case for veganism, even if I would be a solitary voice, with the others who would support it already driven off, but continue as I have been doing something for speaking to more general Christian issues and topics, here. There are enough other places online, for vegan, and for vegan Christian, communication, with other forums, meetups, and social media, such as Facebook, with the friends, groups, and pages it has, and MeWe, which I just found a little while ago, and started using.

 

[FredVB]

That CF changed the Vegetarian Forum to a forum to include paleo dieters, who are generally so focused on meat, and that vegans, who are as significant a part of the population as vegetarians are, don't have any forum or subforum here, and that they find noninclusive communication of Christians against them here, often with argument against them about the subject of using animals and of having a plant-based way of eating, are reasons that drive them from these forums, while they have plenty of communication among each other in other places online, this being the case even for vegan Christians, who also have a large number, for their own communication. But I have seen that communication here even drives away vegans who would inquire of veganism, or vegetarianism, within Christianity, which could have answers adequately.

Change from this is called for in these forums, especially now that veganism is growing to be so significant in the population, even while the Christian population is lagging behind in the trend and vegans at large feel excluded. It will have to change.

I don't see the antagonism to the change toward veganism is justified by other Christians. I see it is too calloused when they are even unresponsive to the issue of even more people starving to death while feed is grown to supply for breeding more animals to rape and slaughter, yes, both of those, which can be shown, for supplying for the animal products that are desired. It is a shame. I don't see change needed is likely. Just as other vegans and vegetarians have left these forums for such things, including most of those who posted in this thread, I am not likely to stay in these forums myself, for the most part for these things, though more generally I post regarding topics for Christian discussion not actually relating to vegan issues.

If other vegans, or vegetarians, come here finding this communication, and would like communication with me, I would gladly welcome it. That can be in personal messaging to me, if not here. In pm I can refer to other ways to be still in communication. I would have my account still longer than my activity, to watch for that. This goes for any other Christians, who would like contact yet, as well, I am not against being in communication among any Christians, and I speak to many Christian things, besides the basis for such change in this.

 

[FireDragon76]

I've been a vegan since late 2019, and I was a vegetarian when I was younger in my teenage years throughout my early 30's. I only gave it up when I started going back to church, and I only then ate meat somewhat reluctantly at first, as I wasn't used to it. During the pandemic I looked at my health and how it had declined, and I became dissatisfied with the entire lifestyle associated with the normativity, conformism, and respectability of American "orthodox" Christianity. Reading about the environmental impact of animal agriculture was what initially brought in my interest in trying "plant-based meat", and then I learned about the health benefits of a plant-based diet and I began to make the transition to veganism.

I do see some spiritual aspects of vegetarianism, my own ethic is similar to the New Testament scholar, Dr. Albert Schweitzer, a "reverence for life". I've also been influenced by the spirituality of St. Francis and philosophy of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin.

 

[FireDragon76]

Vegan here... depending on how strict the definition is. One of the hurdles was finding a vegan alternative to glucosamine and condroitin, which helps with the pain in my joints - I hope it works out. It was easier to do without honey, wool, leather and so on.

And then there's the gelatin capsules that my other supplements come in.

And there's the food that I give my cats. They are obligate carnivores and anyway, the issue for me is what I eat.

So I guess nothing is simple. Anyway, I've dramatically reduced the amount of animal products I buy, so there's that.
.

Deva now makes a Vegan glucosamine supplement. It's made from genetically modified mold, I believe. It also has some frankincense (boswelia) and turmeric.

I've been taking it a few weeks. It seems to be helpful, moreso than glucosamine's I've taken in the past.

 

[FireDragon76]

That CF changed the Vegetarian Forum to a forum to include paleo dieters, who are generally so focused on meat, and that vegans, who are as significant a part of the population as vegetarians are, don't have any forum or subforum here, and that they find noninclusive communication of Christians against them here, often with argument against them about the subject of using animals and of having a plant-based way of eating, are reasons that drive them from these forums, while they have plenty of communication among each other in other places online, this being the case even for vegan Christians, who also have a large number, for their own communication. But I have seen that communication here even drives away vegans who would inquire of veganism, or vegetarianism, within Christianity, which could have answers adequately.

Change from this is called for in these forums, especially now that veganism is growing to be so significant in the population, even while the Christian population is lagging behind in the trend and vegans at large feel excluded. It will have to change.

I don't see the antagonism to the change toward veganism is justified by other Christians. I see it is too calloused when they are even unresponsive to the issue of even more people starving to death while feed is grown to supply for breeding more animals to rape and slaughter, yes, both of those, which can be shown, for supplying for the animal products that are desired. It is a shame. I don't see change needed is likely. Just as other vegans and vegetarians have left these forums for such things, including most of those who posted in this thread, I am not likely to stay in these forums myself, for the most part for these things, though more generally I post regarding topics for Christian discussion not actually relating to vegan issues.

If other vegans, or vegetarians, come here finding this communication, and would like communication with me, I would gladly welcome it. That can be in personal messaging to me, if not here. In pm I can refer to other ways to be still in communication. I would have my account still longer than my activity, to watch for that. This goes for any other Christians, who would like contact yet, as well, I am not against being in communication among any Christians, and I speak to many Christian things, besides the basis for such change in this.

It's not just among Christians... American society in general is cool to Vegans sometimes, especially as the number of Vegans grows.

In Europe or Australasia, you can find alot more Veganism, from what I have seen.