the Thief on the cross is a perfect picture of salvation, the simplicity that is in Christ

[HTacianas]

You yourself said is. There are two types of baptism. One of water which was required by Law for Jesus. Jesus could not be the High Priest without fulfilling the Law. It was a shadow pointing to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Water does not save. Faith does.

Then of the Holy Spirit since the day of Pentacost. Water does not save. Faith does. Simon and the men and women believed and were also baptized. But belief was what created the change. Not the water. And then they were baptized/received the Holy Ghost. Because that was the process to display the change so that Gentiles could understand this new thing.

[Act 8:12-19 KJV] 12 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women. 13 Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done. 14 Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: 15 Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost: 16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) 17 Then laid they [their] hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. 18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, 19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.

Water baptized was a sing.
Then they were baptized/received the Holy Spirit.
Simon knew he was missing something. So he wanted the Holy Spirit also. But not for the right reason. So Simon was water baptized.
Then Simon received the Holy Spirit on Pentacost with the others.

Baptism does not actually mean water. It means immersed. One is a shadow. One is the completed or completes.

Peace and Blessings

Because that was the process to display the change so that Gentiles could understand this new thing.

It doesn't say any such thing. The bible says baptism is for the remission of sin. What you see among the Samaritans in Acts 8 is Orthodox baptism. First is in water, then by the laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit.

 

[TPop]

It doesn't say any such thing. The bible says baptism is for the remission of sin. What you see among the Samaritans in Acts 8 is Orthodox baptism. First is in water, then by the laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit.

Sorry. Those are works of men.
There is more than water going on here.

Please address:
[Mar 1:8 KJV] 8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.

[Act 1:5 KJV] 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

[Act 2:14-21 KJV] 14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all [ye] that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: 15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is [but] the third hour of the day. 16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; 17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: 19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke: 20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come: 21 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

[1Co 12:12-13 KJV] 12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also [is] Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the one Baptism. One Faith. One Fater.

Peace and Blessings

 

[bibletruths]

That is right. Jesus did not divide. Jesus completed the Water Baptism requirement for him to take his position. And then there was the laying on of hands for a period of time up to receiving the Holy Spirit on Pentacost. And then on Pentacost, the Holy Spirit comes without the Laying on of Hands and indwells us and Baptizes us into the Body of Christ.

[1Co 12:13 KJV] 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

You don't fail to receive salvation if you are not water-baptized. Water is for man. Perhaps you are thinking of the Living Water. Also, not of man, and not water from a tub.

Peace and Blessings

1. There is only one baptism that pertains to us, baptism in water and of the Spirit. This is the singular baptism taught post ascension, and irrefutably involves water as we see most notably in 1 Peter 3:21 and Phillip's conversion of the eunuch.

2. There is a difference between the indwelling and "ondwelling", for lack of a better word, of the Holy Spirit. The Spirit came on many people in the OT including Samson and even a donkey. Similarly, already saved persons received the "ondwelling" of the Holy Spirit, in addition to the indwelling, to receive miraculous powers such as prophecy and healing through the laying on of hands. Such has ceased.

3. There is nothing special about the water itself, rather the water is the means by which God chose to save us. That is the analogy in 1 Peter: God used water to wash away sin (sinful humanity), thus saving all 8 persons. If they had just gotten into the ark and the sinful remained alive, their situation was no different. Likewise, God, "through water" as the means, places us in the ark (Christ) and washes away our sins "through water". Consider Naaman. The water of the Jordan were of no power to heal him of his leprosy. The power to heal lied in his obedience to God's command to dip in the Jordan 7 times. He wouldn't have been healed if he dipped in another river or only dipped 7 times. Likewise, one will not be saved without having obeyed the answer to the question of "What must we do to be saved?" (repent and be baptized). To play off a quote from Naaman's servants, "If God had told you to do some great thing to be saved, would you not have done it? How much more then when He says "repent and be baptized for the remission of your sins and you will receive the Holy Spirit"?"

 

[HTacianas]

Sorry. Those are works of men.
There is more than water going on here.

Please address:
[Mar 1:8 KJV] 8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.

[Act 1:5 KJV] 5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

[Act 2:14-21 KJV] 14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all [ye] that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: 15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is [but] the third hour of the day. 16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; 17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: 19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke: 20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come: 21 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

[1Co 12:12-13 KJV] 12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also [is] Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is the one Baptism. One Faith. One Fater.

Peace and Blessings

To address John the Baptist is easy. He could not convey the Holy Spirit. He could only baptize in water.

 

[bibletruths]

I don't do works based. It is faith based.
So were all those saved always done at the water?
Or where is the verses about needing to quickly find water to complete the salvation process.
You can't just speculate that everyone every saved was right near water because God would make it so.

Peace and Blessings

Read Romans 6:1-14. Baptism is defined as "crucified with him (Christ)". Paul later says in Galatians 2:20-21, "I have been CRUCIFIED WITH CHRIST and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. I DO NOT SET ASIDE THE GRACE OF GOD, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"

Similarly, Colossians 2:11-14 says "...Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ, having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were ALSO RAISED WITH HIM THROUGH YOUR FAITH IN THE WORKING OF GOD, who raised him from the dead. When YOU WERE DEAD in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, GOD MADE YOU ALIVE WITH CHRIST. He forgave all our sins..."

Similarly, Galatians 3:26-27 says "So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God THROUGH FAITH, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ."

Titus 3:4-7 really ties it all together. " But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared, He saved us, NOT BECAUSE OF RIGHTEOUS THINGS WE HAD DONE, but because of His mercy. HE SAVED US THROUGH THE WASHING OF REBIRTH (born again of water) AND RENEWAL BY THE HOLY SPIRIT (and of Spirit), who He poured out on us generously THROUGH JESUS CHRIST our Savior, so that, having been JUSTIFIED BY HIS GRACE, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life."

To recognize baptism as essential is not to set aside the grace of God. In fact, we see clearly in these three passages, along with many others, that "faith/belief" is equated with "baptized". Consider the example of the jailer who Paul prevented from committing suicide. Despite the fact that they were supposed to be in prison, the jailer took them to his home where they preached to him and his whole family. Upon hearing the gospel, "immediately he and all his household were baptized". Every other conversion account also involves the converted being baptized in water immediately or, at the very least, ASAP.

Baptism is not our work, rather it is the work of God. I do not give myself spiritual life. I do not make myself alive with Christ. I do not set myself free from the law to be under grace. I do not make myself a child of God. I do not forgive my own sins. I do not grant the indwelling of the Spirit to myself. I do not give myself new birth. I am not able to unite myself with Him in resurrection. God does all of this for me "through baptism/through water". None of these things exist outside of it.