The mission to Mars

[Chesterton]

When we get to Mars, what do we do? What did we do when we got to the moon? We hit a golf ball. We rode a dune buggy around for a while. Picked up some rocks, when we have plenty of rocks on Earth. G. K. Chesterton once remarked that we have this "insidious habit" of discovering the North Pole.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Talking in soundbites is just irritating.

So are Musk's empty promises. He's been making grandiose claims about Mars for years and I don't buy any of them. Did Musk put humans on Mars last year? Well in 2018 he claimed he would. A quick search for his Mars claims shows these recent claims:

Five uncrewed starships to Mars in 2026 (made Oct 2024):

SpaceX Will Send Five Uncrewed Starships to Mars by 2026, Crewed Missions to Follow

Land on Mars in 3-4 years (2026-27), made Oct. 2023):

Elon Musk Says SpaceX Could Land on Mars in 3 to 4 Years (Published 2023)

Humans on Mars in 2029 (made March 2022):

Elon Musk Has New Estimate for When Humans Might First Step on Mars

They will need to deal with radiation and weightlessness for the journey. My favorite schema is joining together 3 or 4 starships in a rotating loop to handle the gravity issue, Simple water barriers may well work for the radiation. But more thought needs to be put into the habitation module.

The basic concept of boosting these ships to geostationary orbit and refueling them for the journey to Mars seems solid and they have the internal space of two large family houses in one of these starships. If they join them in a larger ring, for the journey, then even more. It would be good to make the journey as short as possible as that is a risk factor. The larger the ship the less the psychological strains on the crew cooped together for the long journey.

when they can get just one empty "starship" into orbit that will be a start.

Once landed toxicity, dust, possible machine failure and loss of key resources are all risk factors. But preparatory robot missions using the same hardware and carrying the necessities for fuel and oxygen, electricity and food production should resolve these issues. If the crops have failed or the base breaks then they should have a window before they even arrive to see this and to come back if necessary.

Oh goody, even more launches just to get a return mission.

This should be exciting to someone with a scientific bent as in effect it is one of the most challenging things man has attempted in a long time.

The key to success is to kick the hucksters aside. I think I am going to join the "robotic exploration" camp. This plan is ridiculously complicated just for scientific exploration.

Or would you prefer an understanding of science that spends years debating origin theories it cannot prove rather than devoting itself to stuff it has a chance with?

Enough of this. I have actual science to do. No fantasy missions to Mars. No "origins debates."

 

[Bradskii]

Just because man ran around the surface for a brief spell, left some footprints, and planted a flag, doesn't mean that he's subdued it and has dominion over it - or been instructed to by God as He did with the earth.

Millions (billions?) of dollars for a bag of rocks. Big hooey!

I can imagine Charles I of Spain saying that he's not going to fund any more trips to the Americas. 'That last voyage cost me a fortune. And all they brought back was some inedible local food. Millions of pesetas for a bag of potatos. Forget it...'

 

[Bradskii]

When we get to Mars, what do we do? What did we do when we got to the moon? We hit a golf ball. We rode a dune buggy around for a while. Picked up some rocks, when we have plenty of rocks on Earth. G. K. Chesterton once remarked that we have this "insidious habit" of discovering the North Pole.

Not worth going anywhere, I guess.

 

[mindlight]

When we get to Mars, what do we do? What did we do when we got to the moon? We hit a golf ball. We rode a dune buggy around for a while. Picked up some rocks, when we have plenty of rocks on Earth. G. K. Chesterton once remarked that we have this "insidious habit" of discovering the North Pole.

The Apollo Missions were like a package holiday to the most exotic location thus far. But when they got there they drove their car, toasted their families back home, sent a few postcards, brought back some rocks as souvenirs and enjoyed a game of golf.

Mars is an altogether longer trip and a bigger investment. The sacrifice is more comparable to early settlers in the first North American colonies. Survival rather than joy rides before the cameras is the more pressing issue. Many know that is a one way trip or at least saturated with uncertainty.

Therefore we need bigger heroes than Neil Armstrong to make the trip.

 

[Chesterton]

Not worth going anywhere, I guess.

Ask the Native Americans.

 

[Chesterton]

The Apollo Missions were like a package holiday to the most exotic location thus far. But when they got there they drove their car, toasted their families back home, sent a few postcards, brought back some rocks as souvenirs and enjoyed a game of golf.

I've done the same in Utah.

Mars is an altogether longer trip and a bigger investment. The sacrifice is more comparable to early settlers in the first North American colonies. Survival rather than joy rides before the cameras is the more pressing issue. Many know that is a one way trip or at least saturated with uncertainty.

Therefore we need bigger heroes than Niel Armstrong to make the trip.

Those are reasons for not doing it.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Therefore we need bigger heroes than Niel Armstrong to make the trip.

At least respect him enough to spell his name correctly.

 

[mindlight]

So are Musk's empty promises. He's been making grandiose claims about Mars for years and I don't buy any of them. Did Musk put humans on Mars last year? Well in 2018 he claimed he would. A quick search for his Mars claims shows these recent claims:

Five uncrewed starships to Mars in 2026 (made Oct 2024):

SpaceX Will Send Five Uncrewed Starships to Mars by 2026, Crewed Missions to Follow

Land on Mars in 3-4 years (2026-27), made Oct. 2023):

Elon Musk Says SpaceX Could Land on Mars in 3 to 4 Years (Published 2023)

Humans on Mars in 2029 (made March 2022):

Elon Musk Has New Estimate for When Humans Might First Step on Mars



when they can get just one empty "starship" into orbit that will be a start.

Oh goody, even more launches just to get a return mission.

The key to success is to kick the hucksters aside. I think I am going to join the "robotic exploration" camp. This plan is ridiculously complicated just for scientific exploration.

Enough of this. I have actual science to do. No fantasy missions to Mars. No "origins debates."

I agree Musk is better at predictions than putting dates on them. This might be a feature of corporate planners with their event orientated lives. They just hate it when you say it will be done when you've solved the problems.

But betting against starship might be a little foolish given Musks track record.

Curiosity is a good motive for being in space but it is not Musks motivation. He wants to establish mankind as a multiplanetary species. Robots have already been on Mars for decades but unless people go there the place quite simply has no interest for most. It is the life and love that people bring to a place that fill it with stories and turn it from a pile of red rocks into a place where everyone wants to visit.

Musks basic strategy is focus on the transportation system. It is for others to find ways to makes Mars City work.

 

[mindlight]

At least respect him enough to spell his name correctly.

I could not find the face palm emoji to respond to your post.

 

[mindlight]

Ask the Native Americans.

There are no red Indians on Mars and black slaves would just be extra mouths to feed. So not like for like.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

It is for others to find ways to makes Mars City work.

We need Vilos Kohaagen to run Mars.

 

[Bradskii]

Ask the Native Americans.

You killed and ill treated the original inhabitants so therefore we shouldn't explore? I thought the argument would have been better presented as 'Go exploring, but treat the locals you find with respect.'

I'm afraid that both your country and mine let ourselves down regarding that.

 

[mindlight]

We need Vilos Kohaagen to run Mars.

But wasn't he the bad guy in Total Recall. Not to be as petty as Tinker grumpy face
previously but I could not find the name at first because it's spelt: Vilos Cohaagen

 

[Chesterton]

You killed and ill treated the original inhabitants so therefore we shouldn't explore? I thought the argument would have been better presented as 'Go exploring, but treat the locals you find with respect.'

I'm afraid that both your country and mine let ourselves down regarding that.

So things would be better if men were good. You should write a book.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

But wasn't he the bad guy in Total Recall. Not to be as petty as Tinker grumpy face
previously but I could not find the name at first because it's spelt: Vilos Cohaagen

He may have been bad but he ran Mars pretty efficiently. Sorry about the name, I had cataract surgery today and have been using a voice app. because I can hardly see at the moment.

 

[Chesterton]

There are no red Indians on Mars and black slaves would just be extra mouths to feed. So not like for like.

Yeah, I wasn't comparing the Americas to Mars, but thanks for the info.

 

[durangodawood]

Mars

 

[Belk]

Mars

 

[NxNW]

Ive watched most of season one. Pretty great.

But Im curious how the Soviets will get more involved if the show remains sort of agnostic regarding their totalitarianism.

Stay tuned; we're deep in S2 now and that very topic is at the forefront.