The Genetic Code

[ruthiesea]

As to the 70% not believing in God, since Christians make up just 30-31% of the world population I'm again puzzled by your assertion of "nonsense". Do you have any numbers to back your claim?

Christians are not the only ones who believe in G-d. 24.9% of the population is Muslim and a small amount, <1%, is Jewish.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Christians are not the only ones who believe in G-d. 24.9% of the population is Muslim and a small amount, <1%, is Jewish.

Yes and no. From an outsiders point of view, all those do look like versions of the same god, but there are clearly incompatibilities. About 30% believe in "God" and his son Jesus, about 25% believe in "Allah" and his true prophet Mohammad, and less than 1% don't accept ether of these two auxiliaries and believe in "G-d" as they are apparently superstitiously compelled not to include all of the letters of the word.

When you all can agree on the true nature of your deity then maybe us outsiders will be willing to attribute half the world's population to the followers of a single god. Until then your claimed perceptions of that entity are different enough that they cannot be seen as one. Have fun hashing it out, but leave the other half of the world out of your little fight. So the original response that 70% of the world doesn't believe in "God" (the Jesus one) stands.

But, since how many people believe in something doesn't have any bearing on the truth of it and that belief (in "God") is not on topic anyway, does any one want to talk about the origin of the genetic code?

 

[Bungle_Bear]

Christians are not the only ones who believe in G-d. 24.9% of the population is Muslim and a small amount, <1%, is Jewish.

Muslims and Jews don't believe in God. The Christian god is tripartite, Allah and Yahweh are not.

 

[renniks]

Wow, really? Simple maths: 100 - 30 = 70

Feel free to show how that doesn't compute.

ETA I get it now. You don't understand the difference between god and God, do you? Your claim that "70% believe in gods or God" is incorrect. That should be "93% believe in gods or God, of which 30% believe in God and 63% believe in other gods"

You don't seem to understand that one doesn't have to have his theology correct to understand that the world demands a designer. 96 percent believe in a god of some sort. Now, what percentage believe in a creator God?

The survey of 1,000 U.S. adults found that most Americans — 72 percent overall and 46 percent of nones( non religious) — agree that: “Since the universe has organization, I think there is a creator who designed it.” This view is most strongly held by evangelicals and by older adults.

And most Americans — 79 percent overall, and 43 percent of nones — say they agree that “The fact that we exist means someone created us.”

 

[renniks]

Not even science says that life was created by accident.

It does. If something isn't directed, it happened by accident. Appealing to already existing scientific laws doesn't help because they too happened by chance unless there's a creator. ( Which science refuses to acknowledge as part of the equation. )

 

[renniks]

Muslims and Jews don't believe in God. The Christian god is tripartite, Allah and Yahweh are not.

Jews don't believe in God? I don't agree. They just refuse to acknowledge the full nature of God because they don't acknowledge the new testament.

 

[Hans Blaster]

This is the post that started this whole diversion. The fraction of people who believe in some supernatural claim have no bearing on its truth, and certainly has nothing to do with subject of this thread. Please end this irrelevant sub-thread.

I thought science was supposed to be logical? Now it just assumes the impossible can happen with zero real evidence.

 

[SelfSim]

Interesting new study: Genetic predictability steadily erodes during evolution, new study shows, (paper published: Science, May 19). From that University of Chicago press release:

By combining cutting-edge techniques in experimental biochemistry and evolutionary reconstruction of ancient proteins, the study directly measured how the effects of every possible mutation in a biologically essential gene changed across 700 million years of evolution. As the gene evolved, the effects of most mutations changed steadily and randomly, often switching from highly detrimental to inconsequential, or vice versa.

All of which underpins the view that its impossible to predict the effects of mutation, in either forwards or backwards directions in time:

This constant drift makes it impossible to reliably predict the effects of most mutations into the future or back into the past. The findings also imply that the potential fate of a mutation during evolution is determined not only by natural selection, but also by the particular set of chance events that happened to unfold during the gene's history. These events determine the effect each mutation has at each timepoint and therefore the probability that it will be incorporated into the gene during evolution.

All of this also applies to the sequence of the genetic code itself .. for all the same reasons now evidenced in this study.

"Many people think that natural selection has optimized all of our genes to do the best job possible," said Joseph Thornton, Ph.D., Professor of Ecology & Evolution and Human Genetics at UChicago, and senior author of the study. "Our results show that present-day genes are the result of a particular cascade of random but consequential chance events, each of which determined the next steps that evolution could take at every moment in history."

So, where is the role of a supposed 'Designer', given the objective evidence presented in this study?

Also, from the paper itself:

Our findings show that protein sequences drift inexorably into contingency and unpredictability, but that the process is statistically predictable, given sufficient phylogenetic and experimental data.

 

[ottawak]

It does. If something isn't directed, it happened by accident. Appealing to already existing scientific laws doesn't help because they too happened by chance unless there's a creator. ( Which science refuses to acknowledge as part of the equation. )

How would you have science acknowledge an unfalsifiable proposition? I don't think science has the epistemological tools for such a thing.

 

[SelfSim]

It does. If something isn't directed, it happened by accident. Appealing to already existing scientific laws doesn't help because they too happened by chance unless there's a creator. ( Which science refuses to acknowledge as part of the equation. )

'If something isn't directed, it happened by accident', is a generalised straw-man set up by you.

The scientific Laws are anything but 'an accident', as there is an extensive documented history of how they were developed by human scientific thinkers .. (and that applies regardless of humans' evolutionary origins).

 

[ruthiesea]

Yes and no. From an outsiders point of view, all those do look like versions of the same god, but there are clearly incompatibilities. About 30% believe in "God" and his son Jesus, about 25% believe in "Allah" and his true prophet Mohammad, and less than 1% don't accept ether of these two auxiliaries and believe in "G-d" as they are apparently superstitiously compelled not to include all of the letters of the word.

When you all can agree on the true nature of your deity then maybe us outsiders will be willing to attribute half the world's population to the followers of a single god. Until then your claimed perceptions of that entity are different enough that they cannot be seen as one. Have fun hashing it out, but leave the other half of the world out of your little fight. So the original response that 70% of the world doesn't believe in "God" (the Jesus one) stands.

But, since how many people believe in something doesn't have any bearing on the truth of it and that belief (in "God") is not on topic anyway, does any one want to talk about the origin of the genetic code?

Christians, Jews, and Muslims worship the G-d of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
By the way, G-d is tradition and respect. Not superstition.

 

[BerthaSeven]

Christians, Jews, and Muslims worship the G-d of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Can a Muslim achieve salvation without accepting that Jesus as his lord and savior?

Can a Christian achieve salvation by merely doing good in their life and asking God for forgiveness but not considering Jesus in the equation other than as a prophet?

Can a Jew achieve salvation without recognizing Jesus as the Messiah?

Why would God put so many variations of His own systems so close to each other? Why would He have different rules for different people but then allow those people to co-exist meaning that invariably there would be conflict around the path to salvation (as we see today in the Middle East)?

I am genuinely curious about this arbitrary version of God who seems to have set up a great system for people to remain confused and fighting each other for eternity. Is this what God wants?

 

[AV1611VET]

Can a Muslim achieve salvation without accepting that Jesus as his lord and savior?

No.

Can a Christian achieve salvation by merely doing good in their life and asking God for forgiveness but not considering Jesus in the equation other than as a prophet?

No.

Can a Jew achieve salvation without recognizing Jesus as the Messiah?

No.

Why would God put so many variations of His own systems so close to each other?

He didn't.

(That girl in your avatar looks like my sister! )

 

[BerthaSeven]

(That girl in your avatar looks like my sister! )

Sorry to hear that. I photoshopped it to make it more unsettling than the original ad's artwork. I meant no offense toward your sister. If you look closely the stuff being spread on the bread contains bones.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Sorry to hear that. I photoshopped it to make it more unsettling than the original ad's artwork. I meant no offense toward your sister. If you look closely the stuff being spread on the bread contains bones.

Personally, I think it's a funny avatar since it's similar to the 'Whacky Packages' series of gum stickers that Topps used to put out in the 1970's. Oh, those were the days! ... kind of.

Wacky Packages - Wikipedia

Vintage Wacky Packages: 50 Wacky Packs cards for candy, cereal and more (1970s) - Click Americana

I love this one:

 

[BerthaSeven]

Personally, I think it's a funny avatar since it's similar to the 'Whacky Packages' series of gum stickers that Topps used to put out in the 1970's. Oh, those were the days! ... kind of.

Wacky Packages - Wikipedia

Vintage Wacky Packages: 50 Wacky Packs cards for candy, cereal and more (1970s) - Click Americana

I love this one:

Oh I remember those! Yeah! LOL.

 

[AV1611VET]

Sorry to hear that. I photoshopped it to make it more unsettling than the original ad's artwork. I meant no offense toward your sister. If you look closely the stuff being spread on the bread contains bones.

I was just kidding.

Since I use Alfred Enigma Neuman as my avatar, she kinda looks like him.

That is, an enigma.

 

[ruthiesea]

Can a Muslim achieve salvation without accepting that Jesus as his lord and savior?

Can a Christian achieve salvation by merely doing good in their life and asking God for forgiveness but not considering Jesus in the equation other than as a prophet?

Can a Jew achieve salvation without recognizing Jesus as the Messiah?

Why would God put so many variations of His own systems so close to each other? Why would He have different rules for different people but then allow those people to co-exist meaning that invariably there would be conflict around the path to salvation (as we see today in the Middle East)?

I am genuinely curious about this arbitrary version of God who seems to have set up a great system for people to remain confused and fighting each other for eternity. Is this what God wants?

In Judaism forgiveness requires atonement. To G-d you ask for strength to not sin again; if you wrong a person you must right the wrong. In either case you must acknowledge your sin.

 

[ruthiesea]

No.No.No.He didn't.

(That girl in your avatar looks like my sister! )

This is a Christian forum. So, I’m not going to argue the right or wrong of religious differences. Suffice to say Islam, Christianity, and Judaism all have different beliefs.