The Didache: Proof of Deviation From Christ's Teachings by Apostolic Fathers

[CoreyD]

Is there any proof that what is carried on today by the Catholic faith, carries on from the teachings of Jesus and his apostles?

The Didache is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise (ancient church order) written in Koine Greek, dated by modern scholars to the first or (less commonly) second century AD

Dating the document is thus made difficult both by the lack of hard evidence and its composite character. The Didache may have been compiled in its present form as late as 150, although a date closer to the end of the first century seems more probable to many.

Baptism
The second part (chapters 7 to 10) begins with an instruction on baptism, the sacramental rite that admits someone into the Christian Church. Baptism is to be conferred "in the Name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" with triple immersion in "living water" (that is, flowing water, probably in a stream). If this is not practical, baptism in cold or even warm water is acceptable. If the water is insufficient for immersion, it may be poured three times on the head (affusion). The baptized and the baptizer, and, if possible, anyone else attending the ritual should fast for one or two days beforehand.

Fasting
Chapter 8 suggests that fasts are not to be on the second day and on the fifth day "with the hypocrites", but on the fourth day and on the preparation day. Fasting Wednesday and Friday plus worshiping on the Lord's day constituted the Christian week. Nor must Christians pray with their Judaic brethren; instead they shall say the Lord's Prayer three times a day. The text of the prayer is not identical to the version in the Gospel of Matthew, and it is given with the doxology "for Yours is the power and the glory forever." This doxology derives from 1 Chronicles 29:11–13; Bruce M. Metzger held that the early church added it to the Lord's Prayer, creating the current Matthew reading.

Daily prayer
The Didache provides one of the few clues historians have in reconstructing the daily prayer practice among Christians before the 300s. It instructs Christians to pray the "Our Father" three times a day but does not specify times to pray. Recalling the version of Matthew 6:9–13, it affirms "you must not pray like the hypocrites, but you should pray as follows." Other early sources speak of two-fold, three-fold, and five-fold daily prayers.

Church Organization
The local leadership consists of bishops and deacons, and they seem to be taking the place of the itinerant ministry. Christians are enjoined to gather on Sunday to break bread, but to confess their sins first as well as reconcile themselves with others if they have grievances (Chapter 14).


From this, we can see quite a number of differences between what the Bible teaches, and what this document alleges is "The Lord's Teaching Through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Διδαχὴ Κυρίου διὰ τῶν δώδεκα ἀποστόλων τοῖς ἔθνεσιν, Didachḕ Kyríou dià tō̂n dṓdeka apostólōn toîs éthnesin)".

Baptism

Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

Matthew 3:16, 17; Romans 6:3-7;

Fasting
Luke 18:9-14;

Praying
Matthew 6:7-13; Acts 2:42-47; Acts 14:22; Romans 15:30-33;

Church Organization
Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:18-20; Acts 5:41, 42; Acts 20:20, 21; 2 Timothy 4:2-5

 

[BobRyan]

. Nor must Christians pray with their Judaic brethren; instead they shall say the Lord's Prayer three times a day.

You make a good point.

1. No reference to "repeating the same prayer three times a day" in the NT
2. No reference to avoiding Jewish Christians in the NT - esp since all the Apostles were Jewish Christians

 

[PloverWing]

Sorry, what is the proof that you alluded to in the title?

 

[chevyontheriver]

Sorry, what is the proof that you alluded to in the title?

That even the very first of the sub-apostolic Church Fathers were full of heresy and had abandoned the faith of the NT? In the text of the Didache itself.

 

[CoreyD]

You make a good point.

1. No reference to "repeating the same prayer three times a day" in the NT
2. No reference to avoiding Jewish Christians in the NT - esp since all the Apostles were Jewish Christians

Thanks man. Always good to have company.
I found that last one quite interesting. I was like segregation in the body?
Then too, when to fast. Things really took a turn fast.
True to the apostle's words. Acts 20:29; 2 Peter 2:1

 

[The Liturgist]

Is there any proof that what is carried on today by the Catholic faith, carries on from the teachings of Jesus and his apostles?

The Didache is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise (ancient church order) written in Koine Greek, dated by modern scholars to the first or (less commonly) second century AD

Dating the document is thus made difficult both by the lack of hard evidence and its composite character. The Didache may have been compiled in its present form as late as 150, although a date closer to the end of the first century seems more probable to many.

Baptism
The second part (chapters 7 to 10) begins with an instruction on baptism, the sacramental rite that admits someone into the Christian Church. Baptism is to be conferred "in the Name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" with triple immersion in "living water" (that is, flowing water, probably in a stream). If this is not practical, baptism in cold or even warm water is acceptable. If the water is insufficient for immersion, it may be poured three times on the head (affusion). The baptized and the baptizer, and, if possible, anyone else attending the ritual should fast for one or two days beforehand.

Fasting
Chapter 8 suggests that fasts are not to be on the second day and on the fifth day "with the hypocrites", but on the fourth day and on the preparation day. Fasting Wednesday and Friday plus worshiping on the Lord's day constituted the Christian week. Nor must Christians pray with their Judaic brethren; instead they shall say the Lord's Prayer three times a day. The text of the prayer is not identical to the version in the Gospel of Matthew, and it is given with the doxology "for Yours is the power and the glory forever." This doxology derives from 1 Chronicles 29:11–13; Bruce M. Metzger held that the early church added it to the Lord's Prayer, creating the current Matthew reading.

Daily prayer
The Didache provides one of the few clues historians have in reconstructing the daily prayer practice among Christians before the 300s. It instructs Christians to pray the "Our Father" three times a day but does not specify times to pray. Recalling the version of Matthew 6:9–13, it affirms "you must not pray like the hypocrites, but you should pray as follows." Other early sources speak of two-fold, three-fold, and five-fold daily prayers.

Church Organization
The local leadership consists of bishops and deacons, and they seem to be taking the place of the itinerant ministry. Christians are enjoined to gather on Sunday to break bread, but to confess their sins first as well as reconcile themselves with others if they have grievances (Chapter 14).


From this, we can see quite a number of differences between what the Bible teaches, and what this document alleges is "The Lord's Teaching Through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Διδαχὴ Κυρίου διὰ τῶν δώδεκα ἀποστόλων τοῖς ἔθνεσιν, Didachḕ Kyríou dià tō̂n dṓdeka apostólōn toîs éthnesin)".

Baptism

Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

Matthew 3:16, 17; Romans 6:3-7;

Fasting
Luke 18:9-14;

Praying
Matthew 6:7-13; Acts 2:42-47; Acts 14:22; Romans 15:30-33;

Church Organization
Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:18-20; Acts 5:41, 42; Acts 20:20, 21; 2 Timothy 4:2-5

The Orthodox Church is compliant with the requirements of the Didache and the Didascalia. Indeed my bishop reccommends as a bare minimum prayer rule praying the Lord’s Prayer three times a day. Of course its better to go beyond that.

 

[HTacianas]

Is there any proof that what is carried on today by the Catholic faith, carries on from the teachings of Jesus and his apostles?

The Didache is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise (ancient church order) written in Koine Greek, dated by modern scholars to the first or (less commonly) second century AD

Dating the document is thus made difficult both by the lack of hard evidence and its composite character. The Didache may have been compiled in its present form as late as 150, although a date closer to the end of the first century seems more probable to many.

Baptism
The second part (chapters 7 to 10) begins with an instruction on baptism, the sacramental rite that admits someone into the Christian Church. Baptism is to be conferred "in the Name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" with triple immersion in "living water" (that is, flowing water, probably in a stream). If this is not practical, baptism in cold or even warm water is acceptable. If the water is insufficient for immersion, it may be poured three times on the head (affusion). The baptized and the baptizer, and, if possible, anyone else attending the ritual should fast for one or two days beforehand.

Fasting
Chapter 8 suggests that fasts are not to be on the second day and on the fifth day "with the hypocrites", but on the fourth day and on the preparation day. Fasting Wednesday and Friday plus worshiping on the Lord's day constituted the Christian week. Nor must Christians pray with their Judaic brethren; instead they shall say the Lord's Prayer three times a day. The text of the prayer is not identical to the version in the Gospel of Matthew, and it is given with the doxology "for Yours is the power and the glory forever." This doxology derives from 1 Chronicles 29:11–13; Bruce M. Metzger held that the early church added it to the Lord's Prayer, creating the current Matthew reading.

Daily prayer
The Didache provides one of the few clues historians have in reconstructing the daily prayer practice among Christians before the 300s. It instructs Christians to pray the "Our Father" three times a day but does not specify times to pray. Recalling the version of Matthew 6:9–13, it affirms "you must not pray like the hypocrites, but you should pray as follows." Other early sources speak of two-fold, three-fold, and five-fold daily prayers.

Church Organization
The local leadership consists of bishops and deacons, and they seem to be taking the place of the itinerant ministry. Christians are enjoined to gather on Sunday to break bread, but to confess their sins first as well as reconcile themselves with others if they have grievances (Chapter 14).


From this, we can see quite a number of differences between what the Bible teaches, and what this document alleges is "The Lord's Teaching Through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Διδαχὴ Κυρίου διὰ τῶν δώδεκα ἀποστόλων τοῖς ἔθνεσιν, Didachḕ Kyríou dià tō̂n dṓdeka apostólōn toîs éthnesin)".

Baptism

Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

Matthew 3:16, 17; Romans 6:3-7;

Fasting
Luke 18:9-14;

Praying
Matthew 6:7-13; Acts 2:42-47; Acts 14:22; Romans 15:30-33;

Church Organization
Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:18-20; Acts 5:41, 42; Acts 20:20, 21; 2 Timothy 4:2-5

I don't understand precisely what your point is. It might help if you explained a bit more as to just what the differences are.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I don't understand precisely what your point is. It might help if you explained a bit more as to just what the differences are.

I think he's trying to say that the Didache and the Catholic Church are on one side (presumably with the Orthodox) and the Bible and the 'True Believers (TM) are on the other side. I think it's a way of invalidating all of the Church Fathers from the very first ones. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[PloverWing]

I think he's trying to say that the Didache and the Catholic Church are on one side (presumably with the Orthodox) and the Bible and the 'True Believers (TM) are on the other side. I think it's a way of invalidating all of the Church Fathers from the very first ones. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

I assume that's the intent, but I don't see the alleged conflict yet. What I see, as I read the Didache and other early church writings, is a religion that's developing its theology and practices as it moves into the second and third generations after the first disciples. I don't see a problem with that.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I assume that's the intent, but I don't see the alleged conflict yet. What I see, as I read the Didache and other early church writings, is a religion that's developing its theology and practices as it moves into the second and third generations after the first disciples. I don't see a problem with that.

The ‘early Catholicism’ that appears in the first patristic writings is a huge threat to some Protestants. Which is why the Fathers have to be ignored or even attacked.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I think he's trying to say that the Didache and the Catholic Church are on one side (presumably with the Orthodox) and the Bible and the 'True Believers (TM) are on the other side. I think it's a way of invalidating all of the Church Fathers from the very first ones. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

And then most of Christianity was deviant from Christ's teaching for something like 1800 years? Holy Spirit on vacation.
Bibleology, putting the written word above the Holy Spirit of Christ living in his believers.

Of course there was more to be developed in the early centuries, councils and creeds needed beyond the BIble.

 

[CoreyD]

I don't understand precisely what your point is. It might help if you explained a bit more as to just what the differences are.

Certainly. Anything I can do to help you.
I'll explain one, which I think is the simplest.
Effusion is not baptism. Affusion was not a teaching of Jesus and the apostles.
If you know of scriptures that say otherwise, please point out those scriptures.
If there are none, then that is a difference. Is it not?

It being a difference as early as the first century, upon the death of the apostles, it is proof of the fact that the apostles' words came to past, regarding a deviation from Christ's teachings.
Acts 20:29, 30

29 I know that false teachers, like vicious wolves, will come in among you after I leave, not sparing the flock. 30 Even some men from your own group will rise up and distort the truth in order to draw a following.

2 Peter 2:1

Now there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them - bringing swift destruction on themselves.

2 Thessalonians 2:3, 4

3 Let no one deceive you in any way, for it will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness - the son of destruction - is revealed. 4 He will oppose and exalt himself above every so-called god or object of worship. So he will seat himself in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. 5 And you know what is now restraining him, so that he may be revealed at the proper time.

Are you prepared to accept the words of the apostles, over claims of an anonymous document that contains orders contrary to the teachings laid down by Christ, and the apostles.
Perhaps I'd better explain one more.

According to scholars, this was noted:
The local leadership consists of bishops and deacons, and they seem to be taking the place of the itinerant ministry.

When Jesus was on earth, and after he left, the itinerant ministry was the focal point - the actual 'structure', if you will, of the Church.
The urgency of this organizational structure was made clear both by word, and action.
Luke 10:1-2

1 Now after this the Lord appointed seventy-two others, and sent them in pairs ahead of Him to every city and place where He Himself was going to come. 2 And He was saying to them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few; therefore plead with the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into His harvest.

Matthew 9:35-38

35 Jesus was going through all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues and proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and every sickness.
36 Seeing the crowds, He felt compassion for them, because they were distressed and downcast, like sheep without a shepherd. 37 Then He *said to His disciples, “The harvest is plentiful, but the workers are few. 38 Therefore, plead with the Lord of the harvest to send out workers into His harvest.”

Matthew 24:14

14 This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.

Mark 13:10

10 And the gospel must first be preached to all the nations.

Matthew 28:18-20

18 And Jesus came to them and spake unto them, saying, All authority hath been given unto me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go ye therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: 20 teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.

Acts 5:41-42

41 So they went on their way from the presence of the Council, rejoicing that they had been considered worthy to suffer shame for His name. 42 And every day, in the temple and from house to house, they did not stop teaching and preaching the good news of Jesus as the Christ.

Acts 17:16-17

16 Now while Paul was waiting for them in Athens, his spirit was being provoked within him as he observed that the city was full of idols. 17 So he was reasoning in the synagogue with the Jews and the God-fearing Gentiles, and in the marketplace every day with those who happened to be present.

Acts 20:20-21

20 how I did not shrink from declaring to you anything that was beneficial, and teaching you publicly and from house to house, 21 solemnly testifying to both Jews and Greeks of repentance toward God and faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Timothy 4:2-5

2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; correct, rebuke, and exhort, with great patience and instruction. 3 For the time will come when they will not tolerate sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance with their own desires, 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth and will turn aside to myths. 5 But as for you, use self-restraint in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.

Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; correct, rebuke, and exhort, with great patience and instruction. For the time will come when they will not tolerate sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance with their own desires, and they will turn their ears away from the truth and will turn aside to myths. But as for you, use self-restraint in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.​

Itinerant preacher
History
Early first century New Testament figures such as John the Baptist, Jesus Christ and Apostle Paul were known for extensively traveling and preaching to unreached people groups in the Middle East and Europe, although often staying for longer periods than modern itinerant evangelists.

Starting in the eighteenth century, the Methodists were known for sending out itinerant preachers known as circuit riders to share the message. The 'Itinerancy' is denoted as one of the "chief peculiar usages" of classic Methodism, along with practices such as class meetings and watchnight services.

 

[CoreyD]

I assume that's the intent, but I don't see the alleged conflict yet. What I see, as I read the Didache and other early church writings, is a religion that's developing its theology and practices as it moves into the second and third generations after the first disciples. I don't see a problem with that.

Jesus and his apostles did warn that some would not see a problem with that.
Matthew 24:11

and many false prophets will arise and mislead many.

Acts 20:29, 30

29 I know that false teachers, like vicious wolves, will come in among you after I leave, not sparing the flock. 30 Even some men from your own group will rise up and distort the truth in order to draw a following.

2 Peter 2:1

Now there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them - bringing swift destruction on themselves.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5

3 Let no one deceive you in any way, for it will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness - the son of destruction - is revealed. 4 He will oppose and exalt himself above every so-called god or object of worship. So he will seat himself in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. 5 And you know what is now restraining him, so that he may be revealed at the proper time.

1 Timothy 4:1-3

1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

2 Timothy 4:2-5

2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; correct, rebuke, and exhort, with great patience and instruction. 3 For the time will come when they will not tolerate sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance with their own desires, 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth and will turn aside to myths. 5 But as for you, use self-restraint in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.

These warn of extremely dangerous and detrimental changes, which neither Jesus nor his apostles spoke approvingly of.
2 Thessalonians 2:9-12

9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

I believe it's important to give that some thought. What do you think?

 

[HTacianas]

Certainly. Anything I can do to help you.
I'll explain one, which I think is the simplest.
Effusion is not baptism. Affusion was not a teaching of Jesus and the apostles.
If you know of scriptures that say otherwise, please point out those scriptures.
If there are none, then that is a difference. Is it not?

It being a difference as early as the first century, upon the death of the apostles, it is proof of the fact that the apostles' words came to past, regarding a deviation from Christ's teachings.
Acts 20:29, 30


2 Peter 2:1


2 Thessalonians 2:3, 4


Are you prepared to accept the words of the apostles, over claims of an anonymous document that contains orders contrary to the teachings laid down by Christ, and the apostles.
Perhaps I'd better explain one more.

According to scholars, this was noted:
The local leadership consists of bishops and deacons, and they seem to be taking the place of the itinerant ministry.

When Jesus was on earth, and after he left, the itinerant ministry was the focal point - the actual 'structure', if you will, of the Church.
The urgency of this organizational structure was made clear both by word, and action.
Luke 10:1-2


Matthew 9:35-38


Matthew 24:14


Mark 13:10


Matthew 28:18-20


Acts 5:41-42


Acts 17:16-17


Acts 20:20-21


2 Timothy 4:2-5

Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; correct, rebuke, and exhort, with great patience and instruction. For the time will come when they will not tolerate sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance with their own desires, and they will turn their ears away from the truth and will turn aside to myths. But as for you, use self-restraint in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.​

Itinerant preacher
History
Early first century New Testament figures such as John the Baptist, Jesus Christ and Apostle Paul were known for extensively traveling and preaching to unreached people groups in the Middle East and Europe, although often staying for longer periods than modern itinerant evangelists.

Starting in the eighteenth century, the Methodists were known for sending out itinerant preachers known as circuit riders to share the message. The 'Itinerancy' is denoted as one of the "chief peculiar usages" of classic Methodism, along with practices such as class meetings and watchnight services.

So it seems to me that you believe the Church died out at some point. If it did, what was that point? And then, if the Church died out, what is the reason for resurrecting a dead religion?

As far as the Church hierarchy goes please see Acts 20, especially verse 28, also Ephesians 4:11-12.

 

[CoreyD]

The ‘early Catholicism’ that appears in the first patristic writings is a huge threat to some Protestants. Which is why the Fathers have to be ignored or even attacked.

I don't think anyone sees Catholicism as any threat... except what is described at Revelation 17:2
If anything is an actual threat, it is the wrath of God that is coming upon the sons of disobedience. Ephesians 6:5

Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things the wrath of God is coming on the sons of disobedience.​

What is evident here, is that the truth is being revealed. Truth exposes untruths, and that is a threat to Catholicism, which is why the truth will be denied by those defending the Apostolic Fathers deviation from Jesus' teachings.

The document is anonymous. Why?
The document is not in keeping with what was taught by Jesus and the apostles.

The proof is there for everyone to see. How can it be denied?

 

[CoreyD]

So it seems to me that you believe the Church died out at some point. If it did, what was that point? And then, if the Church died out, what is the reason for resurrecting a dead religion?

I believe this post answers your questions.

As far as the Church hierarchy goes please see Acts 20, especially verse 28, also Ephesians 4:11-12.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here.
Acts 20:28, was said prior to Acts 20:29, and neither that, nor Ephesians 4:11-12 invalidates the truthfulness of 1 Timothy 4:1-3, and 2 Timothy 1-5

What Christ has done, is stated at 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12
Did you notice the purpose for Christ letting his Church be taken over by a rebellion?

9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.​

Did you notice... It is actually to allow those "weeds" to be clearly exposed - the people some refer to as "rice Christians", or "bench warmers", whom Jesus identified as "honoring me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me." Mark 7:6

You recall what Jesus said concerning the wheat.
Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and at the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather up the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn them; but gather the wheat into my barn.”’” Matthew 13:30

This is not a resurrection of a dead religion.
The dead religion with all its new shoots is gathered to be burnt.
The wheat is gathered into the barn. This is a restoration of the sons of the people of the kingdom.

I hope that gives you a clear understanding.
Does it all add up?

 

[chevyontheriver]

I don't think anyone sees Catholicism as any threat... except what is described at Revelation 17:2
If anything is an actual threat, it is the wrath of God that is coming upon the sons of disobedience. Ephesians 6:5

Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of such things the wrath of God is coming on the sons of disobedience.​

What is evident here, is that the truth is being revealed. Truth exposes untruths, and that is a threat to Catholicism, which is why the truth will be denied by those defending the Apostolic Fathers deviation from Jesus' teachings.

The document is anonymous. Why?
The document is not in keeping with what was taught by Jesus and the apostles.

The proof is there for everyone to see. How can it be denied?

Hey, thanks so much for confirming my understanding of what you are saying.

Can you provide any historical documents from after the New Testament until say 1500 that do not deviate from your understanding of Christ's teaching? In other words, where did the non-deviant folks hide for all of that time with their light under a bushel basket?

 

[CoreyD]

Hey, thanks so much for confirming my understanding of what you are saying.

Can you provide any historical documents from after the New Testament until say 1500 that do not deviate from your understanding of Christ's teaching? In other words, where did the non-deviant folks hide for all of that time with their light under a bushel basket?

I'm sorry?
My "understanding of Christ's teaching"?
I do not answer loaded questions, so you would need to clarify for me which of the scriptures I presented is not Jesus' teachings, as presented in scripture, but "my understanding of Christ's teaching"?

 

[chevyontheriver]

I'm sorry?
My "understanding of Christ's teaching"?
I do not answer loaded questions, so you would need to clarify for me which of the scriptures I presented is not Jesus' teachings, as presented in scripture, but "my understanding of Christ's teaching"?

Well, you see I have an understanding of Christ's teaching that is probably about 180 degrees from what I'm guessing is your understanding. And just because you throw some Scriptures at me doesn't mean you are teaching Jesus' teaching. Even Satan can quote Scriptures as you may know.

Now if you could return to my question. Can you provide any historical documents from after the New Testament until say 1500 that do not deviate from your understanding of Christ's teaching? In other words, where did the non-deviant folks hide for all of that time with their light under a bushel basket?

You have made your opinion known that the Didache deviates from Christ's teaching. And you have implied that all the Church Fathers also deviate from Christ's teachings. Outside of the New Testament do you have any evidence that the Jaws of Hell have not prevailed against the Church until it got 'reinvented' a few hundred years ago? Where was your true church hiding all this time? Or did it cease to exist only to be made again from nothing?for all of those centuries?

 

[CoreyD]

Well, you see I have an understanding of Christ's teaching that is probably about 180 degrees from what I'm guessing is your understanding.

Regarding the OP, what teachings of Jesus Christ can be understood from 0 to 180 degrees?

And just because you throw some Scriptures at me doesn't mean you are teaching Jesus' teaching. Even Satan can quote Scriptures as you may know.

Now if you could return to my question. Can you provide any historical documents from after the New Testament until say 1500 that do not deviate from your understanding of Christ's teaching? In other words, where did the non-deviant folks hide for all of that time with their light under a bushel basket?

To repeat. I do not answer loaded questions.
If you do not understand what a loaded question is, please use google's search engine, or find a dictionary.

You have made your opinion known that the Didache deviates from Christ's teaching. And you have implied that all the Church Fathers also deviate from Christ's teachings. Outside of the New Testament do you have any evidence that the Jaws of Hell have not prevailed against the Church until it got 'reinvented' a few hundred years ago? Where was your true church hiding all this time? Or did it cease to exist only to be made again from nothing?for all of those centuries?

The questions I understand here, are answered in this post.