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Teen nudism: your opinion.
- Thread starter Washington
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I've worked at Disneyland, so I can answer that.
When you enter Disneyland, your bags are searched. To date, there have been a few thousand people permanently banned from Disneyland. Disneyland also has it's own police force as well as it's own security force on site and all the employees are given guidelines as to what behaviors to watch out for and how to respond. At Disney, there are very few points where there are not eyes available to watch you. Unattended children are quickly taken to one of several locations until their parents can be located. And folks that touch on the rides are thoroughly mocked behind the scenes, as well as often met by security at the end of the ride and escorted out of the park.
The further answer is nudists also have to deal with people like you, who are so obsessed with the idea that they are lust-filled perverts that they will come to the colonies expressly to abuse attendees. People like you must be screened out, because nudists do not deserve to have bigoted bile spewed at them. There are folks whose small minds simply cannot comprehend the idea that naked doesn't equal sex, and try to enter solely to catch a glimpse of nudity rather than to take part in the nudist lifestyle. In short, a nudist colony is no more obligated to allow perverts to their resort than I am to allow perverts at my backyard pool party.
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Actually, no, nudist camps don't worry about me or "people like me" because I don't frequent them, nor am I sexually obsessed. Thanks for projecting, though. What I do think is at issue is twisting the Bible into blessing behavior that attracts sin. And you cannot say it does not attract sin because of the things I've mentioned.
They do attract a certain type of person, else they wouldn't have a screening process and a do-not-admit list that they circulate, nor a 1:1 counselor ratio at many of their youth camps.
They do attract a certain type of person, else they wouldn't have a screening process and a do-not-admit list that they circulate, nor a 1:1 counselor ratio at many of their youth camps.
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Yes, you are sexually obsessed, that's why you can't separate the words 'nude' and 'sexual' in your mind.
Others cannot separate 'nude' and 'sexual', and those people are not welcome in a nudist colony.
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Darkhorse
just horsing around
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Well, I don't have to see the OP's picture of nude teens dancing because I've lived it.
I am the father of 2 teenage boys (17 & 14). My wife and I have raised them with a healthy respect and reverence for the human body as a supreme creation of God. We have also raised them in an atmosphere where nudity is acceptable and not inexorably linked with sex.
Part of our vacation time every year includes one or more nudist resorts. While there we swim, eat, play games and soak in the hot tub. Many of these resorts also have dances at scheduled times (with a D. J. or band), and our kids love those. Many also have karaoke nights, usually open to everyone.
All this takes place amid hundreds of other people, all without clothes.
This sounds much more erotic than it actually is, and therin lies much of its value.
Popular wisdom holds that allowing teenagers to participate in nudism is similar to pouring gasoline onto a fire.
In fact, it is more akin to clearing away flammable material with a backfire, using a small, controlled fire to remove fuel before the uncontrolled fire can reach it. In addition to its many other benefits, nudism "clears away" society's pornographic view of nudity, helping teens (and everyone else) to manage their natural curiosity and restrain their sexual impulses.
By demonstrating that the rules of good behavior apply with or without clothes, the teens learn that self-control depends on them, not on whether or not they (or anyone else) have clothes on.
They also learn what all kinds of people look like at all ages and stages of life, including scars and stretch marks, thin and fat, old and young, in all sizes, shapes and colors. It's all real; not airbrushed fantasies.
What provokes lust is specific to the individual and their culture. To my family and me, a room full of nude people gyrating to music is interesting and fun, but not lustful. We do not anticipate having sexual relations with any of them; we know that's not going to happen.
There is something very reassuring about watching your kids waiting for the waterslide, lined up with others of both sexes and all ages, all of them nude, but acting like ladies and gentlemen, with no improper behavior.
Would a typical swimsuited crowd of teenagers be this polite and mannerly? I doubt it.
As for some of the Biblical passages:
Chapter 16 in Ezekiel is an allegory of the Jewish nation, first as a helpless infant, then as a youthful virgin, then as a wife to God who becomes unfaithful. Nakedness is used first as a symbol of helplessness, then innocence and beauty, then debauchery and shame. This chapter has nothing to do with forbidding or permitting nudity.
God never commanded Adam & Eve to wear clothes. The fig leaves were their idea, and their shame incurred God's rebuke ("Who told you that you were naked?"). He had made them nude, and declared His creation "very good"
By the way, He still sends all of His creatures (including humans) into the world nude.
When He drove them out of the garden for their disobedience, He made clothing of animal skins for them, for two reasons:
(1) protection from the "thorns and thistles" of the curse, as well as cold and abrasion (leather and fur are still among the best known protections for these hazards)
(2) to establish the idea that only the killing of a sacrificial animal would atone for sin (pointing the way to Jesus's future sacrificial death.)
By the way, some nudist resorts have chapels, even regular Christian church services.
And yes, everyone (including the preacher) is nude. And it works fine.
I am the father of 2 teenage boys (17 & 14). My wife and I have raised them with a healthy respect and reverence for the human body as a supreme creation of God. We have also raised them in an atmosphere where nudity is acceptable and not inexorably linked with sex.
Part of our vacation time every year includes one or more nudist resorts. While there we swim, eat, play games and soak in the hot tub. Many of these resorts also have dances at scheduled times (with a D. J. or band), and our kids love those. Many also have karaoke nights, usually open to everyone.
All this takes place amid hundreds of other people, all without clothes.
This sounds much more erotic than it actually is, and therin lies much of its value.
Popular wisdom holds that allowing teenagers to participate in nudism is similar to pouring gasoline onto a fire.
In fact, it is more akin to clearing away flammable material with a backfire, using a small, controlled fire to remove fuel before the uncontrolled fire can reach it. In addition to its many other benefits, nudism "clears away" society's pornographic view of nudity, helping teens (and everyone else) to manage their natural curiosity and restrain their sexual impulses.
By demonstrating that the rules of good behavior apply with or without clothes, the teens learn that self-control depends on them, not on whether or not they (or anyone else) have clothes on.
They also learn what all kinds of people look like at all ages and stages of life, including scars and stretch marks, thin and fat, old and young, in all sizes, shapes and colors. It's all real; not airbrushed fantasies.
What provokes lust is specific to the individual and their culture. To my family and me, a room full of nude people gyrating to music is interesting and fun, but not lustful. We do not anticipate having sexual relations with any of them; we know that's not going to happen.
There is something very reassuring about watching your kids waiting for the waterslide, lined up with others of both sexes and all ages, all of them nude, but acting like ladies and gentlemen, with no improper behavior.
Would a typical swimsuited crowd of teenagers be this polite and mannerly? I doubt it.
As for some of the Biblical passages:
Chapter 16 in Ezekiel is an allegory of the Jewish nation, first as a helpless infant, then as a youthful virgin, then as a wife to God who becomes unfaithful. Nakedness is used first as a symbol of helplessness, then innocence and beauty, then debauchery and shame. This chapter has nothing to do with forbidding or permitting nudity.
God never commanded Adam & Eve to wear clothes. The fig leaves were their idea, and their shame incurred God's rebuke ("Who told you that you were naked?"). He had made them nude, and declared His creation "very good"
By the way, He still sends all of His creatures (including humans) into the world nude.
When He drove them out of the garden for their disobedience, He made clothing of animal skins for them, for two reasons:
(1) protection from the "thorns and thistles" of the curse, as well as cold and abrasion (leather and fur are still among the best known protections for these hazards)
(2) to establish the idea that only the killing of a sacrificial animal would atone for sin (pointing the way to Jesus's future sacrificial death.)
By the way, some nudist resorts have chapels, even regular Christian church services.
And yes, everyone (including the preacher) is nude. And it works fine.
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Wayte
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Lust is more mental than physical. If naked wasn't such a taboo thing in society, then it wouldn't excite lust like it does. If you want to discourage lust, make the human body a non-tabo thing, and nobody will care enough to be excited.
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Letalis
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?
So now it's our aim to desexualize the human body so much that it fails to excite us?
Good luck with that one. Personally I don't really want society trying to "improve" my thinking.
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Wayte
Oh, you know. Some guy.
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I think you misunderstand me.
As I stated, it's mental. If you're somehow afraid of being "desensitized," don't worry, it can't happen. When you know it's showtime, your little buddy knows its showtime. I merely wish people would quit being so shy about the human body, so that nudity wouldn't be such a huge deal. Nudity not being a huge deal has the added affect of your body not interpretting "showtime" as anytime more than an extra inch of skin is revealed. Really, it's more of an argument against the "buuut nudity ilicits lust" crowd than an actual goal.
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Balugon
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It wouldn't be hard to guess my bias, but I have no problem with it. People assume nudity inspires lust, but that's because society has told them "nudity inspires lust," and they haven't had a chance to find out for themselves if that is true or not. And pictures on the internet aren't enough, and that's because pictures don't take into account the social aspect that affects the mind when being around other people in person. A good example is everyone telling you that pizza tastes great, but all you have ever seen is pictures of pizza on tv or on the internet. While your mouth may water, you have no idea what pizza actually tastes like until you taste it for yourself; you also don't know how it smells, how it feels, etc. And the same could happen for a ride at an amusement park- everyone could tell you it's aweful, and you might have fear in your gut when you first go for a ride on it, but you might end up finding that all your friends didn't know you at all and didn't know that you would end up really liking it. Society gets into lust issues because they are over-sexualized; being around public non-sexual nudity helps get people back to a normal healthy level. The body wasn't meant to be incredibly sexually arousing to others based on physical sight, because a woman making a gesture that she loves you and wants to have sex with you was and is quite enough to get a man thoroughly aroused.
Another example of taught "biological responses" would be me telling you a scary story about a nearby park, and then having you go with me into that park at night. You might then have a biological response of fear and your heart beating faster, but isn't truly natural. It happened because of what I told you. In the same way, people are able to start becoming aroused if they are told over and over again that nudity is only for sex (especially when society loves to show sex scenes a 1000x more than non-sexual nude scenes). But, if you stayed in the park that the scary story was told about, and were there hanging out with friends night after night, eventually the lie that was told to you about the park being scary would start to wear off, and you might start to find a great peace and enjoyment being in the park at night. And it's the same with social nudity; at first you might be a little aroused emotionally by seeing some of the more physically beautiful people of the opposite sex nude, but the more you hang out in public and are doing non-sexual activities with people like swimming and playing volleyball, the more your mind starts to adjust back to where it should be, and nudity becomes no big deal.
I agree with DarkHorse, God clothing Adam and Eve was symbolic of Christ covering us with his blood. It might even have had significance in the story of Cain and Abel, because Abel brought a sacrifice that required the killing of an animal, but Cain did not, and Cain's offering was rejected. Where was the practice of sacrifice learned? On top of that, if Christ came to restore what we lost in the Fall, then why shouldn't we be able to walk around nude? Is God's Spirit too weak? Are Christians forever unable to reach people that live in nudist communities because the Christians can't handle a little nudity? The Bible says "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." And honestly, like I explained before, social nudity is part of the cure for Christians apparent "lust" issues, not part of the problem.
It's also of note that God commanded Isaiah to walk around nude for 3 years. If God was against social nudity, and God won't command sin, then God wouldn't have commanded Isaiah to do that. Isaiah 20.
Also, from a practical standpoint, and as others have said, social nudity helps to counter the "photoshop effect," and helps to show that every body is different and that different is normal. I've heard that basically every picture that goes into the popular magazines these days has been edited by photoshop, because celebrities and models don't want blemishes to show up and don't want to look imperfect (which may mean adjusting the boob and hip size a bit to make sure they look attractive).
Another example of taught "biological responses" would be me telling you a scary story about a nearby park, and then having you go with me into that park at night. You might then have a biological response of fear and your heart beating faster, but isn't truly natural. It happened because of what I told you. In the same way, people are able to start becoming aroused if they are told over and over again that nudity is only for sex (especially when society loves to show sex scenes a 1000x more than non-sexual nude scenes). But, if you stayed in the park that the scary story was told about, and were there hanging out with friends night after night, eventually the lie that was told to you about the park being scary would start to wear off, and you might start to find a great peace and enjoyment being in the park at night. And it's the same with social nudity; at first you might be a little aroused emotionally by seeing some of the more physically beautiful people of the opposite sex nude, but the more you hang out in public and are doing non-sexual activities with people like swimming and playing volleyball, the more your mind starts to adjust back to where it should be, and nudity becomes no big deal.
I agree with DarkHorse, God clothing Adam and Eve was symbolic of Christ covering us with his blood. It might even have had significance in the story of Cain and Abel, because Abel brought a sacrifice that required the killing of an animal, but Cain did not, and Cain's offering was rejected. Where was the practice of sacrifice learned? On top of that, if Christ came to restore what we lost in the Fall, then why shouldn't we be able to walk around nude? Is God's Spirit too weak? Are Christians forever unable to reach people that live in nudist communities because the Christians can't handle a little nudity? The Bible says "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." And honestly, like I explained before, social nudity is part of the cure for Christians apparent "lust" issues, not part of the problem.
It's also of note that God commanded Isaiah to walk around nude for 3 years. If God was against social nudity, and God won't command sin, then God wouldn't have commanded Isaiah to do that. Isaiah 20.
Also, from a practical standpoint, and as others have said, social nudity helps to counter the "photoshop effect," and helps to show that every body is different and that different is normal. I've heard that basically every picture that goes into the popular magazines these days has been edited by photoshop, because celebrities and models don't want blemishes to show up and don't want to look imperfect (which may mean adjusting the boob and hip size a bit to make sure they look attractive).
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tgg
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Hi Alfie,
I was just about to ask you whether you are a nudist when you answered my question. Thank you for such a great, articulate and well thought-out post to a topic that is often considered grey area.
I am also working on a band in Brisbane to make teens and people in their 20s and 30s aware of the nudist philosophy of life - you can listen to some of our music at YouTube - laissezfayre's Channel and check out our newsgroup at laissezfayre : Laissez-Fayre (there's no nude imagery on the sites due to their stringent policies).
Have a great day and may God go with you.
I was just about to ask you whether you are a nudist when you answered my question. Thank you for such a great, articulate and well thought-out post to a topic that is often considered grey area.
I am also working on a band in Brisbane to make teens and people in their 20s and 30s aware of the nudist philosophy of life - you can listen to some of our music at YouTube - laissezfayre's Channel and check out our newsgroup at laissezfayre : Laissez-Fayre (there's no nude imagery on the sites due to their stringent policies).
Have a great day and may God go with you.
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