Putting chaplains in public school is the latest battle in culture wars (Wapo)

[BCP1928]

So do fornicators and adulterers. Should we teach our children that those "lifestyles" are OK too?

That certain lifestyles can no longer be discriminated against does not equate to being "acceptable". That fact can be taught in civics class. It seems the public-school teachers in their curricula often slip into "promoting" the LGBTQ agenda.

Government monies? The government does not have any money that it did not first take from taxpayers. Why should my money be used to promote the LGBTQ agenda in my public schools?

Fornication and adultery are not "lifestyles."

 

[Merrill]

Prisoners can't leave their prison to attend religious services elsewhere. Service personnel often have almost as little freedom to travel in the local community and can be deployed in foreign countries or surrounded by water.

School children go home to their families each night and don't even go to school on weekends. School children have gotten along just fine without school chaplains for decades.

They are also completely unnecessary.

I let someone else explain the 14th amendment (again).

The 14th Amendment has little of anything to do with this issue

it is the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment that is at play here.

like I said, there could be a violation depending on what the chaplains do in the course of the school day, what the scope of their duties are, etc. Simply having a chaplain on staff is NOT a violation of the First Amendment

whether or not prisoners can leave the prison is totally irrelevant as well, as is the assertion that "chaplains are unnecessary"

drag-queens are just as unnecessary, but leftists want those in schools

 

[BCP1928]

The 14th Amendment has little of anything to do with this issue

it is the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment that is at play here.

like I said, there could be a violation depending on what the chaplains do in the course of the school day, what the scope of their duties are, etc. Simply having a chaplain on staff is NOT a violation of the First Amendment

whether or not prisoners can leave the prison is totally irrelevant as well, as is the assertion that "chaplains are unnecessary"

drag-queens are just as unnecessary, but leftists want those in schools

Not as paid employees replacing credentialed counselors.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Sounds great. Where is it being taught? How often do they get taught it?

Now it's your turn to share rhe curriculum or evidence that's it's being taught and how often.

You really want to sealion this side discussion, huh? I don't care whether you believe it's being taught, or whether you're satisfied with how frequently it's being taught. But since it's easy enough to show state social studies curricula:

Texas Administrative Code

​

TITLE 19	EDUCATION
PART 2	TEXAS EDUCATION AGENCY
CHAPTER 113	TEXAS ESSENTIAL KNOWLEDGE AND SKILLS FOR SOCIAL STUDIES

Students examine the history and impact of major religious and philosophical traditions

(1) History. The student understands traditional historical points of reference in world history. The student is expected to:

(B) identify major causes and describe the major effects of the following events from 500 BC to AD 600: the development of the classical civilizations of Greece, Rome, Persia, India (Maurya and Gupta), China (Zhou, Qin, and Han), and the development of major world religions;

(C) identify major causes and describe the major effects of the following important turning points in world history from 600 to 1450: the spread of major world religions and their impact on Asia, Africa, and Europe and the Mongol invasions and their impact on Europe, China, India, and Southwest Asia;


Now it's your turn, show us the state curricula for teaching about sexuality that you object to.

 

[NxNW]

Funny, I bet you participated in other threads about this. Why don't you go look those up instead of demanding I do the work for you again.

There are no threads that actually support your claim.

Can we just dispense with rhe whole nu uh it'd not happening silliness.

It's not happening. Your links don't support your claim. Nobody's teaching an 'agenda'. Telling students not to murder or persecute LGBT people is not a gay agenda.

I.bet you all bent out of shape over the don't say gay bills or legislation banning CRT from schools.

CRT is not being taught in schools, either. Nobody on these forums has been able to provide any actual examples of curricula that contain it.

Why be upset over stuff that isn't happening?

I agree!

 

[NxNW]

The government does not have any money that it did not first take from taxpayers. Why should my money be used to promote the LGBTQ agenda in my public schools?

It's not. It also can't be used to promote religious belief.

 

[BCP1928]

It's not happening. Your links don't support your claim. Nobody's teaching an 'agenda'. Telling students not to murder or persecute LGBT people is not a gay agenda.

Actually that is the "gay agenda." The one and only.

 

[Merrill]

There are no threads that actually support your claim.

It's not happening. Your links don't support your claim. Nobody's teaching an 'agenda'. Telling students not to murder or persecute LGBT people is not a gay agenda.

CRT is not being taught in schools, either. Nobody on these forums has been able to provide any actual examples of curricula that contain it.

I agree!

LOL!

"CRT isn't being taught in schools"

you continue with this lie on this site, and even you know your own propaganda and disinformation is just that

I pointed out in detail on other posts how CRT is used in education, and that education in the US is based largely on Critical Pedagogy (Pablo Freire and other theorists created this--and it is the dominant theory in schools of education in the US)

The nation's largest teacher's unions (NEA and ATF) specifically endorse the teaching of CRT to kids and call for an expansion of those efforts. In their literature, and public statements, they assert:

""It is reasonable and appropriate for curriculum to be informed by academic frameworks for understanding and interpreting the impact of the past on current society, including critical race theory,"

Many CRT texts and related projects are used in school curriculums (too many to count), including the 1619 Project, which has a whole site and materials dedicated to this

Teaching The 1619 Project: Insights for Educators and Librarians

Over 6,000 teachers, principals, school board members, university professors, librarians, and parents signed up for last week’s discussion on teaching The 1619 Project. The insightful discussion...

1619education.org

and don't even get me started about all the LGBT propaganda that ends up in schools ...

I could give you 1000 examples of CRT, Critical Pedagogy, etc. within the context of secondary (or below) education. You don't have a clue as to what you are talking about, and continue to spout out fake, left-wing talking points

 

[BCP1928]

LOL!

"CRT isn't being taught in schools"

you continue with this lie on this site, and even you know your own propaganda and disinformation is just that

I pointed out in detail on other posts how CRT is used in education, and that education in the US is based largely on Critical Pedagogy (Pablo Freire and other theorists created this--and it is the dominant theory in schools of education in the US)

The nation's largest teacher's unions (NEA and ATF) specifically endorse the teaching of CRT to kids and call for an expansion of those efforts. In their literature, and public statements, they assert:

""It is reasonable and appropriate for curriculum to be informed by academic frameworks for understanding and interpreting the impact of the past on current society, including critical race theory,"

Many CRT texts and related projects are used in school curriculums (too many to count), including the 1619 Project, which has a whole site and materials dedicated to this

Teaching The 1619 Project: Insights for Educators and Librarians

Over 6,000 teachers, principals, school board members, university professors, librarians, and parents signed up for last week’s discussion on teaching The 1619 Project. The insightful discussion...

1619education.org

and don't even get me started about all the LGBT propaganda that ends up in schools ...

I could give you 1000 examples of CRT, Critical Pedagogy, etc. within the context of secondary (or below) education. You don't have a clue as to what you are talking about, and continue to spout out fake, left-wing talking points

Now, you guys can't have it both ways. Whatever happened to "CRT is teaching white kids that they have to feel personal guilt for being white?"

 

[Hans Blaster]

The 14th Amendment has little of anything to do with this issue

it is the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment that is at play here.

I told you I'd let someone else explain (again) why the 14th amendment makes the 1st apply to states.

like I said, there could be a violation depending on what the chaplains do in the course of the school day, what the scope of their duties are, etc. Simply having a chaplain on staff is NOT a violation of the First Amendment

Someone "on staff" is an official of the school. Establishment clause applies.

whether or not prisoners can leave the prison is totally irrelevant as well, as is the assertion that "chaplains are unnecessary"

No, no, no, no. You specifically wanted to know why prison chaplins were OK but school ones were not. And I made it clear that it is the inability of prisoners to leave prison that is critical. Students *CAN* and *DO* leave school every day.

So, yes, school chaplain are completely unnecessary. Religious "services" are available to them in the regular course of the day. Just like for their parents who don't have chaplains at work either. If kids can't go 7 hours without interaction with clergy, then the parents have a serious problem and should send their children to a religious school.

drag-queens are just as unnecessary, but leftists want those in schools

non-sequitor.

 

[NxNW]

LOL!

"CRT isn't being taught in schools"

you continue with this lie on this site, and even you know your own propaganda and disinformation is just that

And yet you provide no examples of it being taught or included in curricula.

and don't even get me started about all the LGBT propaganda that ends up in schools ...

By all means, get started. There are no examples of that, either.

I could give you 1000 examples of CRT, Critical Pedagogy, etc. within the context of secondary (or below) education. You don't have a clue as to what you are talking about, and continue to spout out fake, left-wing talking points

You keep making these claims and ridiculous generalizations, while providing no examples of it actually happening.

 

[Pommer]

Actually that is the "gay agenda." The one and only.

And if it’s “taught” in public schools, the mantra will then become “we don’t need public schools!”
Just watch in 3-5 years.

 

[Valletta]

CRT is not being taught in schools, either. Nobody on these forums has been able to provide any actual examples of curricula that contain it.

It is summer vacation. But the battle goes on to stop the teaching of CRT in schools, despite passing a law to try and stop it in Arkansas the court rules it still can be discussed and taught in the classroom:

Arkansas cannot prevent 2 teachers from discussing critical race theory in classroom, judge rules

A federal judge has ruled Arkansas cannot prevent two high school teachers from discussing critical race theory in the classroom but is stopping short of more broadly blocking the state from enforcing its ban on so-called indoctrination in public schools.

apnews.com

 

[loveofourlord]

What training would "properly trained" mental health professionals have? Would a Christian counselling degree qualify?

I would say that a professional can have the training and be christian and such, the issue comes up SO often, that there are no regulations and or actualy making sure they are properly trained when it comes to christian stuff. There is often in the US a presumption that if someone calls themselves a chritian x, they are trained and qualified, but often they aren't required to have the qualifications.

Heard so many horror stories of christian day cares and other things not having to follow laws on background checks, medical requirements and other things.

 

[o_mlly]

You specifically wanted to know why prison chaplins were OK but school ones were not. And I made it clear that it is the inability of prisoners to leave prison that is critical. Students *CAN* and *DO* leave school every day.

Logic problem!

The prisoners are not mandated to see any chaplain or attend his/her services. If you want to parallel prison policy to schools then all the CRT, BLM LGBTQ, etc. stuff should be offered only as extra-curricular activities after school hours for students who elect to attend instead of going home. Good luck.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Logic problem!

Hardly.

The prisoners are not mandated to see any chaplain or attend his/her services.

Are we talking about manditory attendance for school children at services? (I don' think so.)

I was discussing why a prison might *need* a chaplain, where as a school never does.

If you want to parallel prison policy to schools then all the CRT, BLM LGBTQ, etc. stuff should be offered only as extra-curricular activities after school hours for students who elect to attend instead of going home. Good luck.

Not religion, so not at all related.

 

[rjs330]

You're the one who claims it is happening and apparently you think it is happening on a large scale. In fact you have no real evidence that it is happening at all.

See post 117

 

[rjs330]

You really want to sealion this side discussion, huh? I don't care whether you believe it's being taught, or whether you're satisfied with how frequently it's being taught. But since it's easy enough to show state social studies curricula:

Texas Administrative Code

​

TITLE 19	EDUCATION
PART 2	TEXAS EDUCATION AGENCY
CHAPTER 113	TEXAS ESSENTIAL KNOWLEDGE AND SKILLS FOR SOCIAL STUDIES

Students examine the history and impact of major religious and philosophical traditions

(1) History. The student understands traditional historical points of reference in world history. The student is expected to:

(B) identify major causes and describe the major effects of the following events from 500 BC to AD 600: the development of the classical civilizations of Greece, Rome, Persia, India (Maurya and Gupta), China (Zhou, Qin, and Han), and the development of major world religions;

(C) identify major causes and describe the major effects of the following important turning points in world history from 600 to 1450: the spread of major world religions and their impact on Asia, Africa, and Europe and the Mongol invasions and their impact on Europe, China, India, and Southwest Asia;


Now it's your turn, show us the state curricula for teaching about sexuality that you object to.

That's not a religious studies course that was claimed to be in schools.

See post 117

And

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2022/06/03/schools-gender-identity-transgender-lessons/

Six states have now passed LGBTQ+ inclusive curriculum legislation—each with a different definition of ‘inclusion’

Breaking down state curricular mandates and how they will impact instructional content

www.newamerica.org

Ignoring Parental Wishes, Va. County Unanimously Approves Gender Ideology Lessons

Despite parental opposition, a Northern Virginia district will teach students gender ideology following a unanimous June 27 vote.

www.dailysignal.com

 

[BCP1928]

That's not a religious studies course that was claimed to be in schools.

See post 117

And

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2022/06/03/schools-gender-identity-transgender-lessons/

Six states have now passed LGBTQ+ inclusive curriculum legislation—each with a different definition of ‘inclusion’

Breaking down state curricular mandates and how they will impact instructional content

www.newamerica.org

Ignoring Parental Wishes, Va. County Unanimously Approves Gender Ideology Lessons

Despite parental opposition, a Northern Virginia district will teach students gender ideology following a unanimous June 27 vote.

www.dailysignal.com

Instruction in comparative world religions, including Christianity, is part of the required Social Studies curriculum in most states. Students will be exposed to the scriptures there. The Bible is also an object of study in Western Lit. especially AP classes. What more do you require?

 

[essentialsaltes]

That's not a religious studies course that was claimed to be in schools.

No, what I claimed was "Schools can teach about religion and sexuality, without teaching religion or sexuality."

In fact, this treatment is very much like what you're talking about. Sexuality is a line-item in social studies curricula.

Illinois, like California and Colorado, passed a law in 2019, focused primarily on history and social science. The law, which took effect beginning in the 2020-2021 school year, requires that history textbooks include the contributions of LGBTQ+ people.

Teaching about Harvey Milk is not 'teaching homosexuality'.