Pregnant Teenager Nevaeh Crain Died After Trying to Get Care in Three Visits to Texas Emergency Rooms

[DaisyDay]

They aren't saying they refused to treat the woman, only that it didn't appear she needed emergency care at the moment, and when it did become clear she needed medical care, it was too late. Medical shizzle happens, and they just shrug.

Emergency abortions aren't happening in a private practice office, but at hospital emergency rooms with teams of not only doctors, nurses, anesthesiologists, etc. Whether an abortion is allowed to take place is not at the sole discretion of the ob-gyn, but also the administrators, lawyers, etc.

 

[RDKirk]

Emergency abortions aren't happening in a private practice office, but at hospital emergency rooms with teams of not only doctors, nurses, anesthesiologists, etc. Whether an abortion is allowed to take place is not at the sole discretion of the ob-gyn, but also the administrators, lawyers, etc.

If I'm not mistaken, all the cases we've been discussing to this point have been emergencies.

 

[DaisyDay]

If I'm not mistaken, all the cases we've been discussing to this point have been emergencies.

Yes, and ?

You seem to want to blame individual doctors as though they make the decisions in a vacuum and not as part of a larger team.

 

[RDKirk]

Yes, and ?

You seem to want to blame individual doctors as though they make the decisions in a vacuum and not as part of a larger team.

I have a personal viewpoint because I'm intimately acquainted with such an incident here in Texas that occurred with a family member a couple of months ago. In this case, she was not pregnant, but suffers from fibroids in the uterus that cause extremely heavy bleeding...to a life-threatening extent. The doctor on call was hesitant, not believing she wasn't actually pregnant. She had to lie and claim another particular ailment to get him to see to her before she literally bled out.

And, no, there was no "larger team" making that decision that night in that moment. They didn't have a lawyer in the emergency room or anything like that.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Emergencies often kill people, even when treated. In TX you have to wait until a known condition becomes an emergency - in this case blood sepsis - before giving the necessary treatment. If you fail to wait, theres 99 years in prison hanging over your head.

and sometimes it is better to do the right thing even if it means you do time for it.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

and sometimes it is better to do the right thing even if it means you do time for it.

I was under the impression that it was in any circumstance, and per the site rules, never, ever the “right thing” to do.

Interesting.

 

[RDKirk]

I was under the impression that it was in any circumstance, and per the site rules, never, ever the “right thing” to do.

Interesting.

That's why I said that doctors need to get as brave as Rosa Parks and make the law prove itself in court.

 

[RileyG]

Emergency abortions aren't happening in a private practice office, but at hospital emergency rooms with teams of not only doctors, nurses, anesthesiologists, etc. Whether an abortion is allowed to take place is not at the sole discretion of the ob-gyn, but also the administrators, lawyers, etc.

Having emergency care isn't an elective abortion...I will die on this hill as a passionately pro-life person...I believe ALL women, children, born and pre-born, should be saved and protected....

 

[RileyG]

That's why I said that doctors need to get as brave as Rosa Parks and make the law prove itself in court.

Are you pro-life?

 

[RDKirk]

Are you pro-life?

I am in favor of keeping as many lives safe as possible, particularly when those lives are in my hands to save.

 

[RileyG]

I am in favor of keeping as many lives safe as possible, particularly when those lives are in my hands to save.

ok...

 

[Diamond72]

No state has done more to fight this interpretation than Texas, which has warned doctors that its abortion ban supersedes the administration’s guidance on federal law, and that they can face up to 99 years in prison for violating it.

Her case highlights the severe impact of Texas's strict abortion laws, which have created confusion and fear among healthcare providers. These laws can lead to delays in treatment, as doctors may hesitate to intervene due to potential legal repercussions. Nevaeh's situation is a stark reminder of the real-life consequences of such policies.

Ignoring or hiding from problems, especially serious ones, rarely leads to positive outcomes. Addressing issues head-on, even when they are difficult, is essential for making meaningful change and ensuring that tragedies like the one you mentioned don't happen again.

Facing the problem, raising awareness, advocating for better policies, and supporting those in need are all crucial steps

 

[Lukaris]

That is a different question: Regardless what the state does or doesn't do, how should the Church go about saving the lives of babies using "Holy Spirit authorized" methods? "The weapons of our warfare are not carnal."

I believe pro life should be preached with wisdom and firmness spiritually and with practical counsel on the individual level.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Are you pro-life?

People can’t really answer that on here because saying anything but yes is against the rules. Just fyi.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

That's why I said that doctors need to get as brave as Rosa Parks and make the law prove itself in court.

Except, of course, Rosa Parks wasn’t facing 99 years in jail or the option of letting somebody die.

Constructing and enacting a law you know to be flawed and waiting to see who wants to be the guinea pig in challenging it or dying from it to prove that it is, in fact, flawed is more than a little perverse.

 

[DaisyDay]

I have a personal viewpoint because I'm intimately acquainted with such an incident here in Texas that occurred with a family member a couple of months ago. In this case, she was not pregnant, but suffers from fibroids in the uterus that cause extremely heavy bleeding...to a life-threatening extent. The doctor on call was hesitant, not believing she wasn't actually pregnant. She had to lie and claim another particular ailment to get him to see to her before she literally bled out.

That makes no sense. Often before a procedure, such as barium trace which would harm a fetus, I've not only had to sign that I was not pregnant, but given a spot pregnancy test right then and there. Furthermore, it is not illegal to treat fibroids either with a D&C or a hysterectomy so no, this is not analogous. According to many of these states' laws, abortion for an obviously unviable fetus remains illegal until it becomes imminently, not simply inevitably, foreseeably life-threatening to the woman.

And, no, there was no "larger team" making that decision that night in that moment. They didn't have a lawyer in the emergency room or anything like that.

What, no team at all? Just a lone doctor all on his own? You know this because....?

Sure, they are not going to question every decision made in the ER, but abortion is exceptional and they have all been warned of the potential to be imprisoned for the wrong decision.

 

[rjs330]

If you're asserting they did break the law by not treating the women who died, why are they not being charged?

Im not sure that the law says thou must treat emergency situations. That comes from medical ethics. Thats why doctors aren't charged everytime they misdiagnose or do malpractice.

The law ALLOWS doctors to treat in case of emergency. They didn't follow this. Its not necessarily breaking the law since it doesn't say you must.

I think the family should sue rhe pants off the doctor and hospital for malpractice.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Im not sure that the law says thou must treat emergency situations.

For context, in another thread SavedbyGrace [I think] has been asserting that the doctors were legally required to treat these emergencies. (So for them, this is a much more biting question. If these doctors are flouting the law, why aren't they being charged with these deaths?)

AI: EMTALA requires that anyone coming to an emergency department requesting evaluation or treatment of a medical condition, receives a medical screening examination. If they have an emergency medical condition, the hospital must provide stabilizing treatment, regardless of the patient's insurance status or ability to pay.

So EMTALA does require emergency departments must treat emergency situations. But...

The Biden Administration asserts that EMTALA means they are legally required to treat emergencies, and that this supercedes any state abortion bans. However, the current state of the court fight is that Texas has won. So Texas emergency rooms do NOT have to treat emergencies unless it meets the medically vague requirements of the Texas abortion law.

 

[RDKirk]

That makes no sense. Often before a procedure, such as barium trace which would harm a fetus, I've not only had to sign that I was not pregnant, but given a spot pregnancy test right then and there. Furthermore, it is not illegal to treat fibroids either with a D&C or a hysterectomy so no, this is not analogous. According to many of these states' laws, abortion for an obviously unviable fetus remains illegal until it becomes imminently, not simply inevitably, foreseeably life-threatening to the woman.

You don't understand the context: They would not touch her at all. They would not administer a test. Hands totally off. Hands in pockets. Period.

 

[RDKirk]

Except, of course, Rosa Parks wasn’t facing 99 years in jail or the option of letting somebody die.

You don't understand the context of the times. In 1954 Alabama, there was a not inconsiderable chance nobody would ever see her again. There was a better than even chance she'd be brutally beaten or raped in jail.

Constructing and enacting a law you know to be flawed and waiting to see who wants to be the guinea pig in challenging it or dying from it to prove that it is, in fact, flawed is more than a little perverse.

Yes, it is.