Pope Says All Religions are Path to God?

[public hermit]

I think it's very possible it's taken out of context. The MSM loves to do that.

There's not much information in the link. Perhaps a generous view is that Pope Francis means anyone can find God, even through their particular religion, but the God they find is the God of Catholic faith? It's what Karl Rahner (Jesuit) called an anonymous Christian. Isn't that simply Vatican Ii? It's not a new idea. Justin Martyr thought some of the Greek philosophers were in Christ although they were also ignorant of that fact.

That might be a generous view of what he said since it could be true without denying the primacy of Christ. I don't know that he is doing it just to promote the Catholic faith, I think he probably believes it, but I do think that kind of view is attractive since it opens the possibility of salvation for those who don't or even couldn't know about Christ.

That's attractive in contrast to the idea that salvation is closed to those who don't even know about it, which is repulsive. I think Pope Francis is saying it because he believes it, but he probably also thinks it's a winsome point of view. If so, I really don't understand the push back by Catholics. You can say salvation is through Christ alone, and thus through Catholic faith, without holding an abhorrent position regarding those who are ignorant. Thinking people who are looking for some religion are going to see that as a plus, I would think.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

No there is not. There is plenty of sin in many who profess Christ and there are many calling them on it through and in Christ.
And False worship is sin. A fail from the start with no hope whatsoever.

One would hope that by now we Christians would have learned to get past this kind of Biblical legalism and religious imperialism.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

How does this all-paths attitude fill the pews, or the treasury, more than exclusivism?

Sometimes I think the "hidden economic angle" is overrated, or even a red herring. People are also motivated by straight up ideological conviction.

Because when it starts doubling as social club instead of exclusively a religion (in the name of keeping membership from dwindling), it's easier to keep people engaged from the younger generation who an "inclusion" message may appeal to.

It's likely the same reason they softened their positions on certain LGBT issues and contraception... Because those older rules don't poll so well with the younger generation.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

You seem to be discounting the possibility Pope Francis believes what he said:

“There is only one God, and each of us has a language to reach God. Some are Sikh, some Muslim, Hindu, Christian. And they are all paths to God.”

If he believes that, then it means he doesn't believe the book his religion is based on

If that truly is his beliefs, then his organization is basically just like the Unitarian Church, just with a more expensive art holdings portfolio...

 

[Nithavela]

Being a pope myself, I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[HIM]

One would hope that by now we Christians would have learned to get past this kind of Biblical legalism and religious imperialism.

One would have hoped one would know what it is to be a Christian and stand in righteousness in and through Him

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

One would have hoped one would know what it is to be a Christian and stand in righteousness in and through Him

Agreed.

 

[Chesterton]

How does this all-paths attitude fill the pews, or the treasury, more than exclusivism?

Sometimes I think the "hidden economic angle" is overrated, or even a red herring. People are also motivated by straight up ideological conviction.

You are right. Dead fish move with the current, living things fight against it. It's like when Republicans tried to make their tent bigger, but noticed that the bigger their tent got, the more people left it.

My faith is notorious for exclusivity and being opposed to change. My church has grown so much we're building a bigger church, and the building process has taken so long we may have already outgrown it before we've set foot in it. Also, the number of Orthodox churches in my city has doubled since 2012, which is amazing for a faith which is so tiny and alien in America. And I estimate the number of young converts outnumber the older converts about 20 to 1.

I'm not saying this to gloat in front of my RC friends here, just to say that if you really believe something, you should stick to your guns. You'll probably be okay. If you just go with the flow and try to please everyone, you'll probably please no one.

Catholic means universal/whole for all mankind. Francis takes the catholic out of Catholicism. Next time someone wants to answer "yes" by asking "Is the pope catholic?", we should answer "No, this one not so much".

 

[eleos1954]

Could someone, preferably who is Catholic, break this down for me? Is the Pope promoting a Universalist Unitarian view where you can worship anyone/anything and be saved or is there some nuance the general public is not seeing here? How does the Catholic community feel about this statement? Article linked below:

All faiths lead to God, Pope tells youth in Singapore | News Headlines

A chief provider and curator of Catholic information on the web since 1996. Our editorial voice, always faithful to the teachings of the Church, assists and inspires Catholic clergy and laity.

www.catholicculture.org

The pope seeks to unite all religions through the Catholic Church ... this simply is not possible ... humanity could do better at living at peace ... but there is no way all religions can worship together without compromising the Word of God ... we don't all worship the same god ... and various religions teach of different gods.

Biblically ... There is one true God ... Jesus ... the creator of everything

Luke 12:51 New Living Translation (NLT) per Jesus.

Do you think I have come to bring peace to the earth? No, I have come to divide people against each other!

• 1 Corinthians 8:5-6: This passage states that there is one God, the Father, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created.
  
  
• Deuteronomy 4:35,39: This passage states that the LORD is God, and there is none else beside him.
  
  
• Deuteronomy 6:4: This passage states that the LORD thy God is one LORD.
  
  
• Deuteronomy 32:39: This passage states that the LORD is God, and there is no god with him.
  
  
• John 17:3: This passage states that the way to have eternal life is by knowing the only true God and Jesus Christ.

Jesus came to divide ... not unite. He is and will separate the sheep from the goats.

It is true mankind was created in the image of God but that image gets distorted by not preaching biblical truth as it is written ... pope is creating confusion ... especially of those who are not very well versed in biblical scripture.

 

[chevyontheriver]

There's not much information in the link. Perhaps a generous view is that Pope Francis means anyone can find God, even through their particular religion, but the God they find is the God of Catholic faith? It's what Karl Rahner (Jesuit) called an anonymous Christian. Isn't that simply Vatican Ii? It's not a new idea. Justin Martyr thought some of the Greek philosophers were in Christ although they were also ignorant of that fact.

That might be a generous view of what he said since it could be true without denying the primacy of Christ. I don't know that he is doing it just to promote the Catholic faith, I think he probably believes it, but I do think that kind of view is attractive since it opens the possibility of salvation for those who don't or even couldn't know about Christ.

That's attractive in contrast to the idea that salvation is closed to those who don't even know about it, which is repulsive. I think Pope Francis is saying it because he believes it, but he probably also thinks it's a winsome point of view. If so, I really don't understand the push back by Catholics. You can say salvation is through Christ alone, and thus through Catholic faith, without holding an abhorrent position regarding those who are ignorant. Thinking people who are looking for some religion are going to see that as a plus, I would think.

For a Catholic, salvation is in Jesus Christ alone. No other saviors exist. Now somebody might be saved outside of the normal channels of the Christian faith, but that would be through the work of Jesus Christ directly. IF pope Francis said that, and it does not appear to me that he did, then fine. If he said Buddha saves and Krishna saves then that's his personal opinion and I don't have to worry about that at all. I'm not asked to disbelieve the Faith and start believing pope Francis on this.

 

[RileyG]

Because when it starts doubling as social club instead of exclusively a religion (in the name of keeping membership from dwindling), it's easier to keep people engaged from the younger generation who an "inclusion" message may appeal to.

It's likely the same reason they softened their positions on certain LGBT issues and contraception... Because those older rules don't poll so well with the younger generation.

We never changed those positions. And it doesn’t matter what the youth think. God never changes.

Also, the Church continues to grow, not dwindle.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

We never changed those positions. And it doesn’t matter what the youth think. God never changes.

Also, the Church continues to grow, not dwindle.

Well that may be true for specific areas and parishes... The overall nationwide trends are pretty clear.

U.S. Church Membership Falls Below Majority for First Time

For the first time in Gallup's polling history, less than half of U.S. adults report belonging to a church, synagogue or mosque.

news.gallup.com

And I would argue that at least to a certain degree, it does matter what the youth think. If the current generation of elderly pass away and the younger generation doesn't adequately replace them, that equates to a drop in membership.

With regards to the softening of positions...

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/14/1231026522/pope-francis-same-sex-blessings-catholic-church-lgbtq

https://www.cnn.com/2016/02/18/health/zika-pope-francis-contraceptives/index.html

 

[ozso]

Could someone, preferably who is Catholic, break this down for me? Is the Pope promoting a Universalist Unitarian view where you can worship anyone/anything and be saved or is there some nuance the general public is not seeing here? How does the Catholic community feel about this statement? Article linked below:

All faiths lead to God, Pope tells youth in Singapore | News Headlines

A chief provider and curator of Catholic information on the web since 1996. Our editorial voice, always faithful to the teachings of the Church, assists and inspires Catholic clergy and laity.

www.catholicculture.org

It's inclusionism rather than universalism. Pope John Paul II and Billy Graham held the same or a similar view. And also Christian universalism isn't the same as Unitarianism.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Yup. My parish is always full. The "empty pews" depends on where you live, I suppose.

You live in a great diocese. Pope Benedict was asked once by a student about where to live in the USA and he told the guy 'The diocese of Lincoln'.

 

[chevyontheriver]

It's inclusionism rather than universalism. Pope John Paul II and Billy Graham held the same or a similar view. And also Christian universalism isn't the same as Unitarianism.

John Paul arranged for a Billy Graham Crusade in Poland. He was not able to attend and actually meet Billy Graham in person because he was summoned to Rome to vote for a new pope. And he never got back to Poland, at least as a cardinal archbishop.

 

[RileyG]

You live in a great diocese. Pope Benedict was asked once by a student about where to live in the USA and he told the guy 'The diocese of Lincoln'.

That’s pretty awesome.

 

[RileyG]

Well that may be true for specific areas and parishes... The overall nationwide trends are pretty clear.

U.S. Church Membership Falls Below Majority for First Time

For the first time in Gallup's polling history, less than half of U.S. adults report belonging to a church, synagogue or mosque.

news.gallup.com

And I would argue that at least to a certain degree, it does matter what the youth think. If the current generation of elderly pass away and the younger generation doesn't adequately replace them, that equates to a drop in membership.

With regards to the softening of positions...

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/14/1231026522/pope-francis-same-sex-blessings-catholic-church-lgbtq

https://www.cnn.com/2016/02/18/health/zika-pope-francis-contraceptives/index.html

To a certain extent, I think you’re right, but I still prefer a church that is faithful to its historic teachings rather than bow down with the times.

Traditionalism seems to be growing.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

To a certain extent, I think you’re right, but I still prefer a church that is faithful to its historic teachings rather than bow down with the times.

Traditionalism seems to be growing.

I think further evidence of the shift are exemplified by things like certain denominations flying pride flags on their buildings and embracing the "social justice" movement.

I'm not all that old, but I'm old enough to remember when, like, no Christian church (regardless of denomination) would've done that. That's gotta be social pressure.

For the record, I don't have any personal objections to churches performing gay marriages (I got my Universalist ordainment online and officiated a gay wedding, despite being an atheist, apparently all it takes is $20 and 7-10 business days), but the fact that any Christian church is doing it is evidence that there's some "bowing to social pressure" that's influencing their policies.

Hit the rewind button and go back 25 years, it'd be virtually unheard of for any Christian denomination to sanction same sex couples or support a pro-choice position. Whether people like to acknowledge or not, the bible is pretty clear on certain matters.

While I don't agree with the Christian viewpoint on a lot of things, I do have a certain level of understanding for why some people who do are frustrated by the diverging from the teachings in the book that they feel is inspired by a supreme being.


I'd equate it to if a vegan group like PETA were concerned about their membership numbers, so started allowing pescatarians and people who eat eggs to join their organization. The people who were strict adherents to their original doctrines would be understandably upset and say "You're just watering down the rules and underlying premise just so that we can bolster our headcount"

 

[variant]

If you don't like what the Pope is saying here it should be a good example for why people shouldn't be allowed to try to authoritatively speak for God, and thus, you like what the Pope is saying here.

 

[RileyG]

I think further evidence of the shift are exemplified by things like certain denominations flying pride flags on their buildings and embracing the "social justice" movement.

I'm not all that old, but I'm old enough to remember when, like, no Christian church (regardless of denomination) would've done that. That's gotta be social pressure.

For the record, I don't have any personal objections to churches performing gay marriages (I got my Universalist ordainment online and officiated a gay wedding, despite being an atheist, apparently all it takes is $20 and 7-10 business days), but the fact that any Christian church is doing it is evidence that there's some "bowing to social pressure" that's influencing their policies.

Hit the rewind button and go back 25 years, it'd be virtually unheard of for any Christian denomination to sanction same sex couples or support a pro-choice position. Whether people like to acknowledge or not, the bible is pretty clear on certain matters.

While I don't agree with the Christian viewpoint on a lot of things, I do have a certain level of understanding for why some people who do are frustrated by the diverging from the teachings in the book that they feel is inspired by a supreme being.


I'd equate it to if a vegan group like PETA were concerned about their membership numbers, so started allowing pescatarians and people who eat eggs to join their organization. The people who were strict adherents to their original doctrines would be understandably upset and say "You're just watering down the rules and underlying premise just so that we can bolster our headcount"

Well said.