My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think

[Kelly Rae]

My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think? My son says he's saved, and I know he'll go to heaven, but he said I basically murdered him.

 

[Maori Aussie]

IMHO Christ wants the best for your son.

 

[Mark Quayle]

My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think? My son says he's saved, and I know he'll go to heaven, but he said I basically murdered him.

You told him right.

His assessment is a little like saying the devil makes a person sin. (According to James, it is the person who sins, not the one who supposedly made him do it). If someone murders your son, it is the person who murdered him that did it, regardless of anyone's excuses.

But more to the point, I think, is that God can save your son's life in such a situation, and it can happen either by your denouncing Christ, or by some other means—either way, it is up to God what happens, by your faithfulness or denouncing, and God's will is going to be done, unhappy and evil though it seem to us.

 

[seeking.IAM]

Peter denied Christ three times and came out of it okay, so there is precedent if that were what you would decide in the moment. Here in the U.S. we have a thing that if you cross your fingers behind your back or in your pocket what you say doesn't really count. I reckon I would be like Peter and throw a little finger-crossing superstition into the mix for good measure. Then, I'd go to church next Sunday and ask for a little mercy and forgiveness.

I have sometimes considered a different situation of the entirety of the church being under persecution. Is it better to be martyred for the faith or to survive and take the faith underground to be the preserved remnant of the church?

I reckon I am not too much into martyrdom.

 

[Mark Quayle]

My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think? My son says he's saved, and I know he'll go to heaven, but he said I basically murdered him.

Jesus answered, “You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.” John 19:11

That example is not a special case. Nobody has the ability to do anything that God has not ordained and established. (See WCF 3.1) Nobody can kill your son unless God has a reason for it.

 

[ozso]

If some maniac was going to shoot my child unless I said whatever he wanted me to say, I'd say it.

 

[BobRyan]

My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think? My son says he's saved, and I know he'll go to heaven, but he said I basically murdered him.

Well done. Your son needs to know that God is first, family second. He needs to know it now -- long before such a proposed crisis ever happens.

Your son's question at its core is "there are many very important things in this life - and other things that are less important. Is God really more important than EVERY thing ? OR just more important than some things?"

Matt 22 -- Jesus said there are two great commandments
1. Love God with all your heart (Deut 6:5) - He said is numero uno in His Matt 22 statement
2. Love your fellow human as yourself (Lev 19:18) - is the second -- not the first.

Even the Hindus understand this principle. When the Muslims invaded India and were opposed by the Sikhs, they captured a Sikh leader and threatened to kill his sons in front of him if he did not become Muslim. He refused to comply. This was also done to many others whether it is the case of Protestants being tortured in the 1260 years mentioned in Rev 12 or Christians opposed by pagan Rome.

IN Matt 10 Jesus said that if we deny Him before men - He will deny us before His angels. Standing firm under persecution is a form of evangelism that God allows. IT shows that "God matters" in a way that many people cannot ignore. The blood of the martyrs was seed of the saints for many centuries.

 

[seeking.IAM]

IN Matt 10 Jesus said that if we deny Him before men - He will deny us before His angels.

In consideration of this verse, how do you reckon Jesus dealt with the situation with Peter?

 

[Rescued One]

I don't know what I'd do, but I hope I would say, "I cannot deny Christ.'

 

[Hazelelponi]

My 30 yr son asked it I would denounce Christ if a man said he'd shoot him if did not and I said I would not. What do you all think? My son says he's saved, and I know he'll go to heaven, but he said I basically murdered him.

My son would be getting shot, and he knows he would be. Don't figure mine cares... Lol.

It's really weird that your son is bothered by the hypothetical to be honest. Does he know that denying Christ is something that we can't do?

We should be preparing the children for this stuff. It's important.

 

[Hazelelponi]

In consideration of this verse, how do you reckon Jesus dealt with the situation with Peter?

Forgiveness prior to the indwelling Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit will prevent any denial I believe and if you do deny Christ you were never saved in the first place. During Jesus life they didn't have the Holy Spirit like we do and they did later.

 

[ozso]

A few things.

First this scenario takes us back to when God told Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac. Which Abraham was willing to do.

When Peter said he didn't know who Jesus is, he was lying. There's a difference between denying you know someone, or denying that you are someone like Peter did, and denying in your heart that Jesus is Lord. If Peter had truly denied Jesus is the Messiah, he would not have continued as an apostle. He would have walked away from his faith and gone back to his former life.

I can deny that I like chocolate all day long, but the fact will remain that I actually do like chocolate.