Mainline Protestant churches are dying

[RileyG]

I hear what you are saying, but I disagree somewhat. I think younger people have similar sentiments sometimes, but talk about them in different ways.

And since this is a liberal Christian space, I think our God-talk is always a bit of a moving target. Young people now days do have a spiritual side, but many churches haven't done a good job speaking to that, or advertising what they do have on offer.

What do you mean by a moving target?

 

[FireDragon76]

What do you mean by a moving target?

I mean language about God is always going to be culturally contingent, and reflective of the culture in which it is used.

 

[RileyG]

I mean language about God is always going to be culturally contingent, and reflective of the culture in which it is used.

Ah, thanks for clarifying!

Take care.

 

[okay]

One of many factors maybe a lost sense of community. We are all so mobile, moving, job switching, church switching, can't find one you like? Do your own thing.

Interestingly, according to Ryan Burge (a social science professor who studies this stuff and posts at Graphs About Religion) the top reason why people de-church is because they moved and never bothered to find a new one.

Ryan Burge explains ‘casual dechurching’ – Baptist News Global

The majority of Americans leaving the church do so for rather humdrum reasons, sociologist of religion Ryan Burge said during a recent episode of the “CBF Podcast.”

baptistnews.com

He is fascinating to listen to if you catch him on various podcasts. He was also a pastor at an American Baptist church that recently closed after having a tiny congregation that finally burned through their savings. He seems to think that perhaps in the 1960s and 1970s when civic religion was huge, it was just too socially costly to not be part of a church. So folks who did not really believe much may have been part of (for example) the local PCUSA church back then, but today people can just be a 'none' with no real consequences. Perhaps the decline in Christianity is simply revealing what has been there all along to some extent...

Robert P Jones at PRRI does some similar kinds of work. I am an engineer so always want to see the data

2023 PRRI Census of American Religion: County-Level Data on Religious Identity and Diversity

The 2023 PRRI Census of American Religion provides an updated analysis on religious trends in America, including new, comprehensive county-level estimates on religious affiliation and diversity in the…

www.prri.org

I wish he broke out the data better, but among white Christians in the US, it looks like there are roughly equal numbers of evangelicals, Catholics, and non-evangelical protestants. They are all declining. Again, I wish he showed plots including all Christians...

 

[okay]

My family moved to a new church in 2019 because our younger daughter wanted to be involved in the youth program; covid blew that up and by the time we were going back she was off to college. After that I found that I was not attending for months on end - mostly because it is too far away - so have been looking at churches closer to my home and only mainline churches fit the bill for me at this point due to LGBTQ inclusion.

Some congregations are very depressing to visit, with almost nobody attending and as a 50-something I feel like the youngest person in the sanctuary; they have beautiful folks to talk to and who clearly love God and each other, but there is no long-term viability. But a few seem to be thriving which gives me hope. Recently I was at an Episcopal parish for one of their family Sundays, and there were about 20 little kids up front for the children's homily, and 15-20 teenagers eating pizza after service before they left for some fun activity that afternoon. Yes, lots of gray hair as well, but the (small-ish) sanctuary felt pretty full which was refreshing. My decision on what church to hook my wagon to for the (hopefully) next few decades will be heavily influenced by the apparent viability of the congregation.

I live in suburbia and every little town has a number of mainline churches, most of which seem non-viable long-term. Within a 20 minute drive of my house there perhaps 8 UCC and definitely 12 Episcopal parishes, most of which seem non-viable. Given the secularization of the country, we just have too many churches to possibly stay open. If they consolidated so that there were only 2 UCC and 4 Episcopal that close to me they may all be thriving right now, and when folks visit a thriving church they may be more likely to join. I know I am. Just a thought...

jason

 

[FireDragon76]

My family moved to a new church in 2019 because our younger daughter wanted to be involved in the youth program; covid blew that up and by the time we were going back she was off to college. After that I found that I was not attending for months on end - mostly because it is too far away - so have been looking at churches closer to my home and only mainline churches fit the bill for me at this point due to LGBTQ inclusion.

Some congregations are very depressing to visit, with almost nobody attending and as a 50-something I feel like the youngest person in the sanctuary; they have beautiful folks to talk to and who clearly love God and each other, but there is no long-term viability. But a few seem to be thriving which gives me hope. Recently I was at an Episcopal parish for one of their family Sundays, and there were about 20 little kids up front for the children's homily, and 15-20 teenagers eating pizza after service before they left for some fun activity that afternoon. Yes, lots of gray hair as well, but the (small-ish) sanctuary felt pretty full which was refreshing. My decision on what church to hook my wagon to for the (hopefully) next few decades will be heavily influenced by the apparent viability of the congregation.

I live in suburbia and every little town has a number of mainline churches, most of which seem non-viable long-term. Within a 20 minute drive of my house there perhaps 8 UCC and definitely 12 Episcopal parishes, most of which seem non-viable. Given the secularization of the country, we just have too many churches to possibly stay open. If they consolidated so that there were only 2 UCC and 4 Episcopal that close to me they may all be thriving right now, and when folks visit a thriving church they may be more likely to join. I know I am. Just a thought...

jason

Interesting story from a different part of the country. I live in the South (Orlando, Florida, specifically), and UCC churches are relatively rare, there's only about 2 within 12 miles. One is an historic Congregationalist church in an small town near Orlando (Winter Park), but my own congregation, which was built in an old suburban area in the 60's (now incorporated) is struggling. We have a fairly substantial endowment, but attendance is down from before the pandemic. Despite being LGBT inclusive, young people generally aren't interested.

Where I live, Episcopalians tend to be almost Fundamentalist, and aren't generally LGBT inclusive. They are very much like conservative Presbyterians with incense.

 

[okay]

Interesting story from a different part of the country. I live in the South (Orlando, Florida, specifically), and UCC churches are relatively rare, there's only about 2 within 12 miles. One is an historic Congregationalist church in an small town near Orlando (Winter Park), but my own congregation, which was built in an old suburban area in the 60's (now incorporated) is struggling. We have a fairly substantial endowment, but attendance is down from before the pandemic. Despite being LGBT inclusive, young people generally aren't interested.

Where I live, Episcopalians tend to be almost Fundamentalist, and aren't generally LGBT inclusive. They are very much like conservative Presbyterians with incense.

Interesting. In New England my limited experience is that many Episcopal parishes are affirming, including that parish that I described. In June (and sometimes all year round) you will see rainbows on flags or signs outside of churches. The affirming parishes I have visited don't seem too hung up on the details of what you believe theologically, they have open communion tables, and almost seem to pride themselves on giving lots of space to foster curiosity about and God and faith. Of course not all are affirming; the tiny parish a couple of miles from my house does not appear to be.

Yes, young people are not interested in church much. And the new data coming out shows that in gen Z women are even less religious than the men, which is a new phenomenon. My elder daughter found the Episcopal church in college, and now that she has graduated has been getting involved in a parish. She says that there are plenty of young families with children and a bunch of older folks, but there are literally zero other people in her age group where she attends. She would probably have to move closer to a city to find a mainline church with a critical mass of people her own age. Part of me thinks that might be a good move for her, as most of the jobs in her field are in the city anyway.

 

[JEBofChristTheLord]

Where church-teaching and church-behavior glorifies the ethics of this world, there is very little to learn, and thus few bother to try.

 

[lismore]

Interestingly, according to Ryan Burge (a social science professor who studies this stuff and posts at Graphs About Religion) the top reason why people de-church is because they moved and never bothered to find a new one.

Hello! One reason I often hear for people falling away from church is that they found walking into a new church too daunting, people seemed to be unfriendly, cliquey or it was hard to break in, socially. Regular churchgoers can regularly speak to people in their circle of friends at the church, form a clique and not be aware of new persons, especially if those churchgoers have been there for many years, it can become like an impenetrable barrier, invisible from the inside.

So when people move and try to find a new church, it may not be that they're not bothered, it may be the perception or the reality of not being made welcome, or walking into a church where everyone is in a pre-existing social clique and they feel excluded. A church needs to intentionally look out for and welcome strangers and newcomers.

God Bless

 

[JEBofChristTheLord]

If the leadership of a church delivers the motivation and the power of the Holy Spirit, that church thrives.

 

[hedrick]

Interestingly, according to Ryan Burge (a social science professor who studies this stuff and posts at Graphs About Religion) the top reason why people de-church is because they moved and never bothered to find a new one.

Ryan Burge explains ‘casual dechurching’ – Baptist News Global

The majority of Americans leaving the church do so for rather humdrum reasons, sociologist of religion Ryan Burge said during a recent episode of the “CBF Podcast.”

baptistnews.com

He is fascinating to listen to if you catch him on various podcasts. He was also a pastor at an American Baptist church that recently closed after having a tiny congregation that finally burned through their savings. He seems to think that perhaps in the 1960s and 1970s when civic religion was huge, it was just too socially costly to not be part of a church. So folks who did not really believe much may have been part of (for example) the local PCUSA church back then, but today people can just be a 'none' with no real consequences. Perhaps the decline in Christianity is simply revealing what has been there all along to some extent...

Robert P Jones at PRRI does some similar kinds of work. I am an engineer so always want to see the data

2023 PRRI Census of American Religion: County-Level Data on Religious Identity and Diversity

The 2023 PRRI Census of American Religion provides an updated analysis on religious trends in America, including new, comprehensive county-level estimates on religious affiliation and diversity in the…

www.prri.org

I wish he broke out the data better, but among white Christians in the US, it looks like there are roughly equal numbers of evangelicals, Catholics, and non-evangelical protestants. They are all declining. Again, I wish he showed plots including all Christians...

The trend shown there is interesting (and consistent with other sources) because it seems that evangelicals are the largest decline. Until recently there were a lot more evangelicals than mainline. That's no longer true.

There are some caveats though:

• Not everyone who is non-evangelical is mainline. I'd be curious to know more about that population
• This is how people identify in surveys. It doesn't translate into church attendance. At least in mainline churches, decline in attendance has been much sharper than these results indicate. I've seen surveys about church attendance. I don't believe any of them. Far fewer people actually attend than report that they did.
• This is the first time in years that the youngest cohort has (almost) as many Christians as the next oldeest cohort.

 

[d taylor]

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​

I would guess any church that is dying, is not telling a lost people out in everyday life. How to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation and become a permanent born again child of God. Then after the telling of how to receive Eternal Life, teaching them to become disciples, so they may go and do like wise.

These churches will cause their own demise, because most either do not believe in Jesus. Or if they do, they simply do not care about people outside of their group in regards to Eternal Life. Oh they may call themselves ministering to people feeding the poor, fighting for social causes they believe in, etc... but as for Eternal Life and the unbeliever. It is the last on the list of a churches ministry, if it is even on the list to began with.

Many of these churches may even hold to a universal salvation belief, so really there is no motivation to teach Eternal life to unbelievers.