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Limited atonement !

Brightfame52

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Ephesians 1 Teaches Particular Redemption by Rev AS​

Ephesians 1:3 declares that we have been blessed “with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ.” These blessings come to us “according as he [i.e., God] hath chosen us in him [i.e., Christ] before the foundation of the world” (4), that is, we receive all these blessings according to our eternal election (4) and predestination (5). Ephesians 1 enumerates some of our spiritual blessings: holiness (4), adoption (5), acceptance with God (6), redemption (7), the forgiveness of sins (7), the knowledge of God’s will (9), the sealing of the Holy Spirit (13) and an eternal inheritance (11, 14). Not only are we blessed according to our election (4, 5) but all the elect have “all spiritual blessings” (3). On the other hand, the fact that the reprobate are not blessed with any of these spiritual blessings is also according to the eternal “purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will” (11).

One of the spiritual blessings we have in Christ is “redemption through his blood” (7). Thus the Son’s redemption or atonement is an instance of those spiritual blessings which come to us “according as he has chosen us in him before the foundation of the world” (4). Therefore, the Lord redeemed, shed His blood and died for the elect and not for the reprobate. Thus the elect are forgiven (7), adopted (5), accepted (6), made holy (4) and sealed with the Spirit (13) for their eternal inheritance (11, 14) on the basis of our Saviour’s cross. The reprobate do not receive any of the spiritual blessings of Christ’s sacrifice, for He did not die for them.
 
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Brightfame52

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Regards,

John

Regards,

John
Right now as far as I can tell, the Holy Spirit hasn't given you truth, for you are in error at this time. Read some of my posts in this thread, and if God be pleased He will begin to enlighten you.
 
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Brightfame52

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I don't believe that at all. There is one sin that is not covered by the blood; one sin that will send someone to hell. What is that sin?

Hint: John 3:16

Regards,

John
Any sin Christ didnt die for will send you to hell. Thank God He died for the sin of unbelief, if not, no one could be saved, since all of us come into the world in the prison of unbelief.
 
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David Lamb

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Any sin Christ didnt die for will send you to hell. Thank God He died for the sin of unbelief, if not, no one could be saved, since all of us come into the world in the prison of unbelief.
I agree. John Owen wrote:

"The Father imposed His wrath due unto, and the Son underwent punishment for, either:

All the sins of all men.
All the sins of some men, or
Some of the sins of all men.

In which case it may be said:

That if the last be true, all men have some sins to answer for, and so, none are saved.
That if the second be true, then Christ, in their stead suffered for all the sins of all the elect in the whole world, and this is the truth.
But if the first be the case, why are not all men free from the punishment due unto their sins?

You answer, “Because of unbelief.”

I ask, Is this unbelief a sin, or is it not? If it be, then Christ suffered the punishment due unto it, or He did not. If He did, why must that hinder them more than their other sins for which He died? If He did not, He did not die for all their sins!”
 
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Brightfame52

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@David Lamb

You answer, “Because of unbelief.”

Just think what a discredit to Christ it would be if men are saved by overcoming a sin such as unbelief, which He didn't die for. That makes man his own saviour. However Christs redeeming death did in fact redeem all for whom He died, the elect, from all unrighteousness, to include unbelief, that's why the redeemed will believe, its an evidence they've been redeemed by the blood of Christ Rev 5:9

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests
: and we shall reign on the earth.
 
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David Lamb

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@David Lamb



Just think what a discredit to Christ it would be if men are saved by overcoming a sin such as unbelief, which He didn't die for. That makes man his own saviour. However Christs redeeming death did in fact redeem all for whom He died, the elect, from all unrighteousness, to include unbelief, that's why the redeemed will believe, its an evidence they've been redeemed by the blood of Christ Rev 5:9

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests
: and we shall reign on the earth.
Yes, I fully agree.
 
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Brightfame52

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Romans 8 Teaches Particular Redemption

Romans 8 is also contrary to universal atonement. Verses 28-30 speak of a people whom God foreknew, predestinated, called according to His purpose, justified, glorified and conformed to the image of His Son. The apostle draws the following conclusion: “What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?” (31). “Then” or “therefore” indicates that this is a logical inference based on his preceding statements, here called “these things.” The “us” can only be those predestinated (or elected) and called according to God’s eternal purpose (28-30). Paul’s argument is this: If God is “for us” (31) in predestination, calling, justification and glorification (29-30), then “who can be against us?” (31). In other words, if God in His eternal decree has chosen us to everlasting bliss, called us out of darkness into His marvellous light, acquitted us of all our sins and reckoned us righteous with the very righteousness of Christ Himself, and glorified us in conforming us to the image of His Son, then “who can be against us?” (31).

The apostle reinforces this already compelling argument with another: “He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?” (32). Who are the “us” referred to twice here for whom God sent the Saviour to die? Again, they are those predestinated and called according to God’s eternal purpose (28-30). The only conclusion is that Christ died for the elect.

If it is objected that the Lord Jesus also died for the non-elect, then we reply that the passage gives absolutely no hint of this. In fact, this would make the passage teach that God sent His Son to die for those who are not predestinated and not called, justified, glorified or conformed to Christ. Moreover, if it is argued that the Saviour died for the reprobate, this would make the passage teach that the reprobate will receive all the blessings of His cross, for verse 32 teaches that God freely gives “all things” to those for whom Christ died. The “all things” include freedom from the law of sin and death (2), life and peace (6), adoption as God’s sons (14), the witness of the Spirit (16), an eternal inheritance (17), the redemption of the body at the resurrection of the just (23), the ability to pray in the Spirit (26), etc. Furthermore, the “all things” would also include the blessings of justification, calling, glorification and conformity to Christ according to God’s eternal predestination (28-30)! To read universal atonement into Romans 8:32 would mean that God freely gives the blessings of calling, justification and glorification to the reprobate, those whom He never calls, justifies or glorifies. This verse teaches an absolutely inseparable connection between those for whom Christ died and all these spiritual blessings. Some do not receive these blessings; therefore, the Saviour did not die for them.

Next Romans 8 declares that no charge (33) and no condemnation (34) can be laid against those who are justified (33), those for whom Christ died (34). But many charges are righteously made by the God of heaven against the reprobate wicked so that they are condemned! This is the case because they are not justified (33), for Jesus did not die for them and does not intercede for them (34).

For Whom Did Christ Die? – CPRC 3
 
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Brightfame52

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Mike Mcinnis writes:

There is no more hated doctrine in that camp than that which declares that the redemption which was finished by CHRIST is exclusively accomplished for an elect people. The statement, “Jesus died for everyone” cannot be true unless one of two things is true: Either we conclude that all men are saved or we conclude that CHRIST only made salvation a possibility by HIS death and in reality saved no one by HIS effort. We are certain that all men are not saved because the LORD JESUS plainly declared that all men were not HIS sheep and that some have the devil for their father..HE says HE does not know them. The writer of Hebrews plainly states that CHRIST has “obtained eternal redemption” for those for whom HE shed HIS precious blood. Even as the angel told Joseph, “thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.” There is no mention in the scripture of an ATONEMENT that does not atone, a JUSTIFIER which does not justify, nor a SAVIOR which does not save. HE is the SANCTIFIER and the SANCTIFICATION of all of those for whom HE has entered in once into the Holy Place with HIS own blood. The redemption of the LORD’s people is not a cooperative effort nor does it somehow become effective when they believe it. Those who are redeemed by HIS blood are redeemed by HIS blood. Their justification does not depend on what they do or do not do, but rather is completely based on what HE has done in their behalf. What they could not do HE has accomplished for them. HE has become sin for them that they might be made the righteousness of GOD in HIM. There can be no true gospel preached where the work of CHRIST is presented as less than the complete salvation of those for whom HE died. There is no mixture of the profane and the sacred in the proclamation of the finished work of CHRIST. There is no place for men to glory in having been made the recipients of HIS grace and the objects of HIS favor.https://media-cloud.sermonaudio.com/text/122192132104807.pdf 4
 
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Brightfame52

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Is there a contradiction here ? Jesus said He gave himself a ransom for many Mark 10:45

For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

And His faithful apostle wrote that Jesus gave His life a ransom for all 1 Tim 2:6

6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Now here is a writing that I believe reconciles what appears to be a contradiction, and will go on to confirm limited atonement: Craig A. Thurman

For Whom Did Christ Give His Life a Ransom? 1 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. Mt 20:28 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time. 1Ti 2:6 There is here an apparent contradiction. On one hand Jesus said that He gave His life a ransom for many and, on the other Paul said that Christ gave his life a ransom for all. Anyone with reverence for the Word of God knows that these statements cannot be contradictory. Both of these statements are correct and therefore they must be harmonious. So, how can this apparent contradiction be resolved? First, in Mt.20.28 many is an indeterminate portion of a larger number. Many distinguishes some from all. So, many of a larger, all-comprehensive number are ransomed. This all-comprehensive number can be called all without exception. Second, in 1Ti.2.6, all takes into account only those that are ransomed. This entire group is without distinction, because they are all equally ransomed. So, all in this instance can be called all without distinction. The word all is often defined incorrectly. For this reason, the statements in which this word is used are also misunderstood. For example, all is almost always used with reference to some things or some people in particular. In Mt.3.5, 6 it is written, Mt 3:5,6 Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan, and were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins. Here the word all does not mean that Judaea and Jordan became vacated to the extent that no one was left in those places. Here, all is understood in a limited sense and refers to a particular people. To whom does all refer? It only refers to all that desired to receive John’s baptism? All of these were from these places. So, when we fail to correctly define just this one little word the truth becomes distorted in some measure. In 1Ti.2.6 all means all without distinction. In other words all refers to all kinds of people, not every person without exception; people without distinction (without regard to their being rich or poor, healthy or sick, master or servant, and color). The topic of 1Ti.2.1-8 demands that all be defined in this way. Paul encouraged Timothy to make prayers and supplications for all men. (v.1) These men are described as kings and all that are in authority. (v.2) Verses 4 and 5 continue to state that Christ would have all men to be saved because he is a mediator between God and men. It is for all of these that He gave Himself a ransom. Therefore, all can only be interpreted to mean all without distinction, or all kinds of men. As it is not the will of God for us to entertain prayer for all men without exception, it was not the will of God for Christ to ransom every man without exception. The Word of God says no such things. However, the Word of God states in clearest terms that Christ gave His life a ransom for every man without distinction. For Whom Did Christ Give His Life a Ransom? 2 Re 5:9, 10 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; and hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. He did not ransom every man when He died. How do we know that? Some men die in their sins. Clearly a ransom price had not been paid for these which perished. Conversely, how can any man perish whose ransom price was paid for by Jesus Christ? Mt.18.11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. Joh 6:39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. So, there is not a contradiction in Mt.20.28 and 1Ti.2.6 at all. When the Word of God is rightly divided these two verses state one, harmonious message: Christ ransomed many from all without exception, and the many ransomed are all without distinction. This doctrine is called particular redemption. http://media.sermonaudio.com/articles/hi-8171711208-1.PDF5
 
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Brightfame52

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Is Universal Atonement True? (1)​

A number of readers have asked about the extent or purpose of the atonement, that is, For whom did Christ die? This question is especially important because many evangelicals today believe that Jesus shed His blood for everyone head for head excluding no one. This view is preached in many pulpits and widely promoted in books and pamphlets. But this position must be analysed very carefully. Is it really true that Jesus gave His life to save absolutely everybody without exception? Let us ask some questions of this view.

(1) How could the Triune God, who is possessed of infinite wisdom and understanding, send His dearly beloved Son to ransom from sin and Hell those who were already in Hell, a place from which the damned have no way out (cf. Luke 16:26)?

(2) God sent His Word to only one nation, the Israelites, during the Old Testament age, and “He hath not dealt so with any [other] nation” (Ps. 147:19-20; Acts 14:16). Moreover, Jehovah does not send the gospel in the New Testament age to everybody either (cf. Acts 16:6-8; Matt. 24:14). Why then would God send Christ to die for those who never hear the gospel and hence could never be saved (Rom. 10:14, 17)?

(3) The Bible teaches that Judas was “the son of perdition” (John 17:12), that is, a man wholly characterized by perdition, ruin and eternal destruction. Did Jesus really die for Judas when He knew that the Old Testament had already prophesied that Judas would betray Him (Ps. 41:9) and “go to his own place,” namely Hell (Acts 1:25; Ps. 109; John 17:12)?

(4) Scripture states that God hated Esau (Rom. 9:13) but everywhere Christ’s atonement is spoken of as the fruit of God’s love (e.g., John 3:16; 15:13; Rom. 5:8; I John 4:10). How then could God send Christ in His infinite, eternal and boundless love (Eph. 3:18-19) to die for Esau whom He hated? Rev. Stewarthttps://cprc.co.uk/covenant-reformed-news/crnnovember2002/#universal
 
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Brightfame52

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The Limited atonement by the blood of Christ is confirmed by scripture because His death and its benefits are according to covenant and for a specific people, Spiritual Israel, Gods elect from amongst the nations. Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. Now the many is the house of Israel Heb 8:10-12

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. This verse 12 corresponds with the remission of sins in Matt 26:28 so we know its the same covenant and its benefits. 5
 
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Brightfame52

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Limited atonement is the blessed truth that God the Son, the Lord Jesus Christ became incarnate in order to satisfy all the conditions of the salvation of God's elect, sheep, His Church and, thereby, acquire for them all grace here and all glory hereafter, an eternal redemption Heb 9:12. Christ's finished work, His bloody sacrifice of His sinless humanity upon the altar of His infinite Deity, was the culmination of His whole work of redemption. This included His incarnation, obedience, and death, as the Representative and Substitute for chosen sinners. He was obedient unto death, even the death of the cross Phil. 2:6-8. Christ's entire satisfaction, the merit of His whole work of mediation, is called the Righteousness of God. This is the only ground of salvation, and it is revealed in the Gospel to those it was specifically for, the elect Rom 1:16-17.Definitely , Christ's righteousness is the entire merit of His whole work of redemption. It was brought in and established by the obedience unto death which Christ Himself accomplished as a Substitute/Surety for His people. Rom 5:19 Christ's righteousness alone demands the salvation of every sinner whom He represented (God's elect). 8
 
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Rescued One

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(1) How could the Triune God, who is possessed of infinite wisdom and understanding, send His dearly beloved Son to ransom from sin and Hell those who were already in Hell, a place from which the damned have no way out (cf. Luke 16:26)?

Are people already in hell?
 
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Brightfame52

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The complications one has when they deny limited atonement and insist Christ died for all without exception which is false:

First, if Christ's death is universal, in and of itself, it cannot be effectual to any of its objects unless you believe the equally false doctrine that all without exception shall be saved by Christs death, the heresy of universalism.

It logically means the sinner makes the supreme difference in heaven or hell instead of the atonement of Christ.
 
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Brightfame52

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Are people already in hell?
Yes and on the day of Judgment they will come out for final judgment execution Rev 20 13-15

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
 
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