Kim Clement

[JimB]

Agreed, and I also agree with some of the points you have made throughout the years about this, that some go over the top unecessarily so and perhaps for self-serving motives.

I would have probably wondered why Agabus felt the belt-binding theatrics were necessary. Paul may have wondered, too, for all we know and just chose not to say anything about it. Who knows?

Showmanship in ministry for me (and those like me) is totally unnecessary and, in fact, a distraction. I have just seen too much of it through the years (and felt it necessary to do a little myself in years past … in another life) and am now ready for something a bit more, um, authentic. I am not interested in church theatrics (although I am going to the theater tonight to see it done right). The less I see a man/woman, the more clearly I can see the Lord.

Now, others may not be that way. They may like a good show. I don’t. We’re different.

One thing for sure, in Pentecostal churches where I spent more than a quarter of a century as a minister, the pressure was on me to perform as well as simply teach. Preaching was in fact a performance and the better I performed my sermon the more “anointed” I was considered. I am ashamed to say I was pretty good at it and it earned me my share of adulation, but I never felt right about it.

~Jim.

People don’t fail; they just give up trying.​

 

[MinJeremiah]

How do you know "Kim is a great man of God"? Judge not, M. You are judging as true which may not be. My guess is you do not know KC. He may be a man of God, then he may not be. Probably no one in this forum knows for sure.

Weren’t some posters scolded a couple of months ago for daring to believe anything other than that Todd Bentley was a real man of God ... until we learned the facts, then all of his supporters who were scolding the more discerning suddenly had nothing to say?

All I know about KC is that he has made some outlandish documented predictions (aka, "prophecies") that have not come to pass. Had it been Elijah or Isaiah, they would have been summarily stoned. Why KC is excused for error and misleading God’s people, I do not know?

~Jim.

God brings us into deep waters not to drown us, but to cleanse us.​

Have you ever heard of grace? Have you heard of the blood?

 

[MinJeremiah]

When it comes to what I think about him being a true prophet, the jury is still out, I simply don't know. I know that some prophecies he has made has come true but others have not.

The reason why I still am not sure about him is his belief of what a true prophet is and what their true job of being a prophet is. It's intriguing, whether it intrigues me because of my itching ears or because there's truth in what he says I don't know.

I do know that in the late 90's he accurately predicted that George W. Bush would win the presidency in a controversial election in 2000. He also accurately said that Obama would win the election and these elections can be used as a good way to discribe the way he sees the job of the prophet.

He says that the prophet hears from God and then delivers the message. Then it's up to the people to believe the message or disregard it. People can and do effect the result. He often points to the story of Jonah and how he heard the message of the Lord saying to go to that city and tell them that they will be destroyed, but the people repented and God reversed his decision. Because the city was not destoryed did not make Jonah a false prophet, God originally had every intention of passing judgment upon that city, but because the people took that message and believed it and then acted upon it they effected the outcome and made God repent of his decision. By today's standards, Jonah would've been a false prophet because he said God was going to pass judgement and it didn't happen.

The jury is only out in this forum. For the most part, in full gospel circles Kim is highly honored. Very few Charismatic or Word of Faith Churches would not welcome him. He is not new. He is very seasoned and has been in the ministry a long time.

Further it is a shame to kick brothers down who have erred in ministry. I was never involved with Todd's ministry, but him fall doesn't mean he was fake and that God's hand was not on him. If that was so we could wipe just about every man of God's name out the Bible as legit.

It amazes me how I did a thread on judgment and many people were saying don't judge this or that. It was mostly baloney. But the same people are very quick to judge preachers. And I have know problem with one who judges a preacher by his character, message and fruit; but some seem to judge by blogs, forums, and Google's search engine. That's sad.

 

[nephilimiyr]

He says that the prophet hears from God and then delivers the message. Then it's up to the people to believe the message or disregard it. People can and do effect the result. He often points to the story of Jonah and how he heard the message of the Lord saying to go to that city and tell them that they will be destroyed, but the people repented and God reversed his decision. Because the city was not destoryed did not make Jonah a false prophet, God originally had every intention of passing judgment upon that city, but because the people took that message and believed it and then acted upon it they effected the outcome and made God repent of his decision. By today's standards, Jonah would've been a false prophet because he said God was going to pass judgement and it didn't happen.

Another case where a prophet prophesied a thing to happen and it not taking place can be found in 2 Kings 20. Isaiah went to king Hezekiah to tell him that he will surely die. However, Hezekiah in prayer reminded God of his promise and God repented. Hezekiah then recovered of his illness and lived another 15 years. Isaiah's prophecy did not come to pass.

This could possible be another instance where a prophet gives the prophetic message, but people then effect the outcome of the message by how they react to it.

 

[Faulty]

The jury is only out in this forum. For the most part, in full gospel circles Kim is highly honored. Very few Charismatic or Word of Faith Churches would not welcome him. He is not new. He is very seasoned and has been in the ministry a long time.

Further it is a shame to kick brothers down who have erred in ministry. I was never involved with Todd's ministry, but him fall doesn't mean he was fake and that God's hand was not on him. If that was so we could wipe just about every man of God's name out the Bible as legit.

It amazes me how I did a thread on judgment and many people were saying don't judge this or that. It was mostly baloney. But the same people are very quick to judge preachers. And I have know problem with one who judges a preacher by his character, message and fruit; but some seem to judge by blogs, forums, and Google's search engine. That's sad.

There's a lot of assumption in that statement.

Too bad you actually don't do any homework on Todd's summer show before writing it off as just a "fall".

And No, KC is not revered everywhere but here, maybe in your circle perhaps.

 

[Elijah2]

Whatever happend to balance Elijah2? Anyone only making searches about him being a false prophet is more than likely to come to the conclusion that he is a false prophet. That's not using discernment but allowing yourself to be led by the conclusions of others.

Thanks mate, conclusions are not the point, the question asked was who is he and what is he. The balance comes from doing your own search on the positives and the negatives, and you won't get any balance on this forum.

So I believe he is a false prophet, like I believe many other so-called balanced prophets are. I haven't come across any yet, but will let you know when I do.

Discernment isn't involved here, because he lives in America and I live in Australia, and I've seen them all before when they visited here.

God save Australia.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

 

[MinJeremiah]

There's a lot of assumption in that statement.

Too bad you actually don't do any homework on Todd's summer show before writing it off as just a "fall".

And No, KC is not revered everywhere but here, maybe in your circle perhaps.

No assumption. Name one recognized national leader out of the Charismatic and Word of Faith movement that has scolded Kim Clement. He has ministered with most of them all.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Thanks mate, conclusions are not the point,

Conclusions? Do you mean judgement?

When it comes to people judging others it is a major deal to get a balance.

The balance comes from doing your own search on the positives and the negatives, and you won't get any balance on this forum.

That's true, I agree with that, but that is not what you said. What you said to the OP was that she was supposed to go to GOOGLE and enter in the name Kim Clement and, well here's your quote, "Kim Clement False or Deception or whatever negative you can think and you will probably get enought information for you to discern."
You're telling her to do nothing but a negative search on him. I don't see how you can deny that. That is not balance.

Discernment isn't involved here, because he lives in America and I live in Australia, and I've seen them all before when they visited here.

I know discernment isn't involved in what you are telling others to do because you are directing her to do nothing but negative searches on him. If you want her to discern who and what Kim Clement is then simply tell her to enter his name in Google and hit the enter botton. Otherwise if she does only what you have suggested she is only going to hear from his detractors and those who call him a false prophet, why on earth is that so hard to understand? Why do I have to sit here and argue with you about that?

 

[Faulty]

No assumption. Name one recognized national leader out of the Charismatic and Word of Faith movement that has scolded Kim Clement. He has ministered with most of them all.

You said he'd be welcome in most charasmatic churches and circles and that is the statement I disagreed with. Don't try to confuse the subject by changing the comparison after the fact.

The only thing this statement asserts is that the "leaders" don't make it a habit of feeding off each other.

Any of these leaders worth their salt would not associate with this guy. The fact they do, doesn't speak well of KC's character, but rather speaks of the lack of character in others.

 

[nephilimiyr]

 

[MinJeremiah]

You said he'd be welcome in most charasmatic churches and circles and that is the statement I disagreed with. Don't try to confuse the subject by changing the comparison after the fact.

The only thing this statement asserts is that the "leaders" don't make it a habit of feeding off each other.

Any of these leaders worth their salt would not associate with this guy. The fact they do, doesn't speak well of KC's character, but rather speaks of the lack of character in others.

If Kim is not a man of God, nobody is.

 

[ARBITER01]

There's a difference between a prophesier and a prophet, the prophet actually operates in the power of GOD as his/her credentials, not just words.

It amazes me how easily people tend to ascribe that title as prophet to a person.

 

[Faulty]

I say lets give this man one more chance. Here is an excerpt of a prophesy he gave earlier this year (link: http://www.kimclementvault.com/prophecyread.asp?num=291). We can examine the fruits when the time comes.

"Property, property, property, property is going to be yours, says the Lord. There has been attack against your property, there has been attack against your homes and your houses to tear down your walls and to pull you out and minimize your faith. God said, enough! Now I say to you, property, property, property, property - four times shall you be restored, says the Lord!

By March of 2009 it will be a complete opposite to what it is now, says the Lord.

There will be a new vehicle that will emerge from Ford as it joins forces with another motor company. It shall be something that shall stand next to every European car. God said, I want to bring pride back to this Nation, and surely I will, says the Lord. If you would take this relentless flow of good news and speak it out, I will grant your favor and give you the property that you need to build my house, says the Lord of Hosts.

I hear the Spirit of the Lord saying to me, I am preparing one of the most prosperous Christmases for my people! This could possibly be one of the greatest Christmases ever for the troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, for twice, twice the Spirit says, I will embarrass Iran. Twice I will embarrass Iran and it will attempt to do something against Israel. Twice I will embarrass it says the Lord. Watch how this Christmas will be some of your greatest victories, says the Spirit of the Lord!"

 

[Faulty]

It's prophecies like this one that make me hope he's right.

1/14/06
"And some of you said, when the Spirit said Hillary Clinton , some of you shouted out "yes". God said, I have already dealt with her heart, not to be President of this Nation but to be president in a Christian world. She will have a testimony second to none and will eventually come out with it and make declaration that Christ Jesus saved her marriage, saved her child, and saved her life. And when this happens there will be a shaking in the Democratic Party so powerful. They will say, what choice do we have? And God says, one of the Kennedy sons who has lost a limb will come into the Kingdom and break the Kennedy curse once and for all, says the Spirit of God."

 

[nephilimiyr]

I say lets give this man one more chance. Here is an excerpt of a prophesy he gave earlier this year (link: http://www.kimclementvault.com/prophecyread.asp?num=291). We can examine the fruits when the time comes.

"Property, property, property, property is going to be yours, says the Lord. There has been attack against your property, there has been attack against your homes and your houses to tear down your walls and to pull you out and minimize your faith. God said, enough! Now I say to you, property, property, property, property - four times shall you be restored, says the Lord!

By March of 2009 it will be a complete opposite to what it is now, says the Lord.

There will be a new vehicle that will emerge from Ford as it joins forces with another motor company. It shall be something that shall stand next to every European car. God said, I want to bring pride back to this Nation, and surely I will, says the Lord. If you would take this relentless flow of good news and speak it out, I will grant your favor and give you the property that you need to build my house, says the Lord of Hosts.

I hear the Spirit of the Lord saying to me, I am preparing one of the most prosperous Christmases for my people! This could possibly be one of the greatest Christmases ever for the troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, for twice, twice the Spirit says, I will embarrass Iran. Twice I will embarrass Iran and it will attempt to do something against Israel. Twice I will embarrass it says the Lord. Watch how this Christmas will be some of your greatest victories, says the Spirit of the Lord!"

The key line in there is: "If you would take this relentless flow of good news and speak it out, I will grant your favor and give you the property that you need to build my house"

It's not enough to just sit back and wait for this to become true FaultySurplus. You are supposed to believe it and speak it out. Are you willing to do that? If not, then don't give him a second chance.

 

[nephilimiyr]

It's prophecies like this one that make me hope he's right.

1/14/06
"And some of you said, when the Spirit said Hillary Clinton , some of you shouted out "yes". God said, I have already dealt with her heart, not to be President of this Nation but to be president in a Christian world. She will have a testimony second to none and will eventually come out with it and make declaration that Christ Jesus saved her marriage, saved her child, and saved her life. And when this happens there will be a shaking in the Democratic Party so powerful. They will say, what choice do we have? And God says, one of the Kennedy sons who has lost a limb will come into the Kingdom and break the Kennedy curse once and for all, says the Spirit of God."

That would be good wouldn't it? This is something I could pray for. It's like his prophecies about Obama being filled with the Holy Spirit shortly after he takes office. That is something I would love to happen to him and this country, so I pray about it and hope it's true. But that is something I would be praying for anyway...

 

[Faulty]

April 16, 2005. Things that were to take place after the 2006 elections. Has this happened yet? I don't watch TBN, I really don't know.

"And it shall come to pass that the news media shall change drastically. TBN shall change drastically. There will be a change of face and a new name added to Trinity Broadcasting Network. They will not hold onto the old only. But they will have the old and the new and shall combine them together. No more dullness to the youth of this day for I'm going to raise up one that shall take the youth by force. But it shall not be called Trinity Broadcasting Network, it shall be called something else."

 

[Faulty]

The key line in there is: "If you would take this relentless flow of good news and speak it out, I will grant your favor and give you the property that you need to build my house"

It's not enough to just sit back and wait for this to become true FaultySurplus. You are supposed to believe it and speak it out. Are you willing to do that? If not, then don't give him a second chance.

That prophecy wasn't given to me to speak out about, but I will observe the results.

 

[nephilimiyr]

April 16, 2005. Things that were to take place after the 2006 elections. Has this happened yet? I don't watch TBN, I really don't know.

"And it shall come to pass that the news media shall change drastically. TBN shall change drastically. There will be a change of face and a new name added to Trinity Broadcasting Network. They will not hold onto the old only. But they will have the old and the new and shall combine them together. No more dullness to the youth of this day for I'm going to raise up one that shall take the youth by force. But it shall not be called Trinity Broadcasting Network, it shall be called something else."

That might've been the time when TBN created their own MTV style channel JCTV, otherwise I have no idea.

Would that be that much of a prophecy though? Kim Clement could've easily heard about the plans for JCTV.

 

[Faulty]

Again, interesting. I wonder if it ties into the other Ford prophesy.

Given 4/8/2006 in Detriot, Michigan.

"[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,serif]For God said there will be a re-visitation of the 50s and the 60s and the 70s, says the Spirit of God. And God said, Motown will be revived. Motown will be revived because God said technology is rapidly unfolding the way your vehicle motor industry shall be on the cutting edge again. They've already said we must put down, we must lay aside, we must get rid of. Suddenly it will change. And God said they will say, oh, it's because of science. They will say it's because of scientific breakthrough, a new source of energy. No, it is not only because of that. But God said, I will give the spirit of discovery, creation and inventiveness into the motor industry - not in Japan, not in any other place - not in Germany, not in Switzerland, but in Detroit, Michigan .says the Lord. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,serif]And they would mock the discoverers, they would mock the inventors? Who is Ford? Huh! Let me tell you, God says. Ford will be revived! It shall be revived in a way that shall shock the motor industry and they shall say, where did this all come from? Where did this all come from? And God said, I will remember when My Warriors gathered around the prophetic voice and shouted the praises.[/FONT]"