Just How Rare is Mortal Sin?

[Caedmon]

Like every Catholic, I have a few sins (some of "grave matter") that I struggle with on a constant basis. Whenever I used to confess to my old priest (and I confessed often), he would tell me that I was not completely cutting myself off from God, that I didn't necessarily need to confess it every time I committed it (I was going to confession every week, at one point), and that I didn't need to abstain from communion. I've also heard, at that parish and others, that committing a mortal sin is actually a rare event, and that it requires a complete rejection of God. In other words, you want nothing to do with God, you stop going to mass, you stop praying, etc. I've heard mortal sin described not as a single sin, but as a path away from God, an accumulation of gradually increasingly sinful behavior, and that it is a conscious choice over a long period of time.
My questions are:
1. What is your lay understanding of the concept of mortal sin? and...
2. How rare do you think it is?

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

I think that a) Thinking it's very rare is a very attractive idea (draw your own conclusions) b) In the end, we simply don't know.

I think the concept of moral sin quoted in the OP is absurd, to be frank. People can convince themselves that the most horrific things are not moral sin, or just not let the thought of them intrude onto daily life and still go one with an outward appearance of piety. All those persistant sex abuse cases to name just one example.

 

[FullyMT]

Here is my understanding in the "shift" in theology behind the reception of Communion and mortal sin:
1) It is just as easy to commit a mortal sin as always.
2) It is often difficult for certain sins to be broken if they are habit forming (in which case, gravity lessens).
3) It is becoming a more popular belief that people in mortal sin are especially in need of the graces of the Blessed Sacrament and should receive Communion either prior to or as soon as possible after receiving Our Lord. It is not because of disrespect, but because of belief that Jesus wants to be with the sinner (I am not stating whether or not I believe this, more re-stating what has been explained to me on seperate occasions).

 

[Caedmon]

Well, the reason I ask is, there are certain sins that have been declared "grave matter" by the Catechism, and these sins are committed by, I'd say, 90% of the population. And as the old saying goes, 90% do it, and 10% lie about it. And yet, I see only a handful of the thousands of parishioners in the diocese actually going to confession.

Now this puts me in a difficult situation. Realistically, practically speaking, I know that there is a significant number of people out there committing these sins, and yet they are not going to confession and are continuing to receive communion regardless. This is confusing to me personally, because I don't know if I'm right for going to confession every single time I commit one of these sins and before I receive communion, or if I'm wrong, and that what the dominant majority of parishioners are doing is actually the right course of action.

I've had people tell me, "Well it's none of your business what other people do." Well yeah, that's the ideal position to take, but it doesn't make any sense to me for me to be an island with no cues or direction on what actions I should take in regard to my spirituality. I've had priests tell me before that sins that you struggle with on a constant basis should not be confessed every single time, and that you should continue receiving communion regardless. And every time I ask other laity about it, they either contradict that or give me the opposite answer, telling me I should "trust my conscience" over my priest's counsel.

So, I'm getting no straight answers... I'm getting a heck of a lot of mixed information about ideals and theology and what-not, but I'm not getting any practical, real-life, straight-forward, cut-and-dry answers, and it's becoming frustrating enough to make me not care one way or the other in regard to the sacraments.

So as things stand, the only course of action I know to take is to continue to receive communion non-stop, with no regard to conscience or formalities of the sacraments, or theology, or priestly counsel, because someone, somewhere out there is going to give me negating or unclear information. And that's where I'm forced to stand until I can find a real answer.

 

[Miss Shelby]

2. How rare do you think it is?

I can only speak for myself when I answer this. And I refuse to answer this on the grounds that I KNOW it will incriminate me.

 

[FullyMT]

Well, the reason I ask is, there are certain sins that have been declared "grave matter" by the Catechism, and these sins are committed by, I'd say, 90% of the population. And as the old saying goes, 90% do it, and 10% lie about it. And yet, I see only a handful of the thousands of parishioners in the diocese actually going to confession.

Now this puts me in a difficult situation. Realistically, practically speaking, I know that there is a significant number of people out there committing these sins, and yet they are not going to confession and are continuing to receive communion regardless. This is confusing to me personally, because I don't know if I'm right for going to confession every single time I commit one of these sins and before I receive communion, or if I'm wrong, and that what the dominant majority of parishioners are doing is actually the right course of action.

I've had people tell me, "Well it's none of your business what other people do." Well yeah, that's the ideal position to take, but it doesn't make any sense to me for me to be and island with no cues or direction on what actions I should take in regard to my spirituality. I've had priests tell me before that sins that you struggle with on a constant basis should not be confessed every single time, and that you should continue receiving communion regardless. And every time I ask other laity about it, they either contradict that or give me the opposite answer, telling me I should "trust my conscience" over my priest's counsel.

So, I'm getting no straight answers... I'm getting a heck of a lot of mixed information about ideals and theology and what-not, but I'm not getting any practical, real-life, straight-forward, cut-and-dry answers, and it's becoming frustrating enough to make me not care one way or the other in regard to the sacraments.

So as things stand, the only course of action I know to take is to continue to receive communion non-stop, with no regard to conscience or formalities of the sacraments, or theology, or priestly counsel, because someone, somewhere out there is going to give me negating or unclear information. And that's where I'm forced to stand until I can find a real answer.

Pray for those in sin. Pray that they will somehow find the truth about the sin. Maybe they plain don't know it's a grave sin? I know people who were shocked to find out that getting drunk is a grave sin.
I thought you had a spiritual director or a regular confessor? Take his advice and ask him questions if you don't understand something that seems to be in contradiction with the Church's teachings.

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

For heaven's sake Joe!

Of course you're going to get confusing information about it, who doesn't? Not everyone has a clear idea about these things, doesn't mean there aren't clear answers. Giving up on the "formailities" of the sacraments because people are giving you different ideas about them is like giving up on life because people don't agree on the meaning of it. It's ludicrous, you must see that.

Just find a good, orthodox priest and talk it all over if you need to.

 

[Caedmon]

Pray for those in sin. Pray that they will somehow find the truth about the sin. Maybe they plain don't know it's a grave sin? I know people who were shocked to find out that getting drunk is a grave sin.
I thought you had a spiritual director or a regular confessor? Take his advice and ask him questions if you don't understand something that seems to be in contradiction with the Church's teachings.

Well I do have a "regular" confessor, in as much as he is the only one available when I have the chance to go to confession. But I have never gone to lengths to ask him about things like this, partly because regular confession times are not counseling sessions, i.e., there are other people waiting, and because he always has a smart remark when I do go to confession, like "Oh God, not you again."

I know he says these things in jest, but they still throw me off and make me feel unwelcome, or like I'm doing something wrong by going to confession so often. My priest is the person I thought I was supposed to be taking cues from, but over the last few months, those cues have been consistently negative.

 

[SaintGeorge]

Mortal sins are as plentiful as the sands of the seashore, more diverse that all the species of the birds of the air and the fish of the sea, and those who commit them could fill the entire earth until there is no longer room for even the smallest child to stand unhindered.

 

[Miss Shelby]

Joe, are you involved with anything in your parish? I only ask because I somewhat know how you feel. It helped me to be in RCIA because I developed a relationship with the priest and see him more than just going to confession. If you knew him a little better and maybe he you, perhaps his comments wouldn't bother you so much.

 

[Caedmon]

For heaven's sake Joe!

Of course you're going to get confusing information about it, who doesn't? Not everyone has a clear idea about these things, doesn't mean there aren't clear answers. Giving up on the "formailities" of the sacraments because people are giving you different ideas about them is like giving up on life because people don't agree on the meaning of it. It's ludicrous, you must see that.

Just find a good, orthodox priest and talk it all over if you need to.

Yeah, yeah, I know. It's just frustrating for me, because one of the main reasons I became Catholic was to find definitive answers about practical life issues. It just doesn't seem like the majority of parishioners care one way or another whether they're in "a state of mortal sin" before they receive, so why should I? I mean, really. Why should I be that different from everyone else? Why should I have to go to confession two, three, four times a month, when the majority of parishioners go to confession two, three, four times a year? Why should I have to be the 'screwball' that has an 'obsession' with confession?

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

Sorry, Joe, but all I'm hearing at the minute is a hissy fit...

Because we're all different. Anyway, how on earth do you know there not going to confession, lots of folks go to confession at different parishes after all.

And anyway it really is none of you business.

 

[Caedmon]

Joe, are you involved with anything in your parish? I only ask because I somewhat know how you feel. It helped me to be in RCIA because I developed a relationship with the priest and see him more than just going to confession. If you knew him a little better and maybe he you, perhaps his comments wouldn't bother you so much.

I did attend RCIA for the past two semesters, but a different priest runs it.

 

[Caedmon]

Sorry, Joe, but all I'm hearing at the minute is a hissy fit...

Because we're all different. Anyway, how on earth do you know there not going to confession, lots of folks go to confession at different parishes after all.

And anyway it really is none of you business.

Waaah! WAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!!!!!!! Alright then. If I follow all the counsel that I've been given by priests, I should just continue receiving communion without going to reconciliation, regardless of whether I continue committing these sins. Right? ... Sorry if I've been out of order in this thread. It wasn't my intention to throw a "hissy fit" or a pity party or whatever. I'm just frustrated.

You know, the more I've thought about this, the more I feel like starting a little group, like a frequent confessors anonymous or something, a support group where people who go to reconciliation at least once (or more times) a month can keep following their spiritual promptings without losing their sanity...

 

[Miss Shelby]

Yeah, yeah, I know. It's just frustrating for me, because one of the main reasons I became Catholic was to find definitive answers about practical life issues. It just doesn't seem like the majority of parishioners care one way or another whether they're in "a state of mortal sin" before they receive, so why should I? I mean, really. Why should I be that different from everyone else? Why should I have to go to confession two, three, four times a month, when the majority of parishioners go to confession two, three, four times a year? Why should I have to be the 'screwball' that has an 'obsession' with confession?

I have asked myself the same questions. The answer is always the same. Because I know better, and other people probably don't. And if I am in any doubt about whether or not I can receive the Eucharist, I don't. It's one chance I won't take. Which is why frequent confession is necessary for me.

 

[isshinwhat]

Our Lady of Fatima said that more souls go to Hell for sins against purity than any other. Be thankful to God that you have been given the grace to seek out Confession and overcome your sinfulness, because many do not heed that call. It's a grave sin and you are conscious of the gravity of said act, therefore while it might not be mortally sinful, the fact that you are asking this question means there is some question in your mind. At any rate, Catholics conscious of grave sin are not to receive, so its a moot point... get thee to a confessional! God gave it to us for a reason, don't let the Devil mock you right out of it.

Now on a positive note, try offering up your temptations for someone who is undergoing similar trials. The outpouring of grace will suprise you. Just focus on praying for that unknown person and their perseverence, then be patient.

Take care, brother.

Neal

 

[Knowledge3]

Let me see if I can find a quote for you:

St. John Chrysostom

I implore and I beseech and I exhort you to confess to God frequently. I do not lead you into a theater of your fellow-servants, nor do I compel you to reveal your sins before men. Open your conscience in the presence of God, and show Him your wounds, and seek medication from Him. Show them not to the one who will reproach you but to one who will heal you; for even if you remain silent, He knows all.

 

[Maggie893]

First a minor rant.

I am so tired of the local parishes treating Confession like a second class sacrament! It's a beautiful, powerful sacrament of the Church, ordained by Christ and providing immense Grace! Why do we have 1/2 hour to 45 minutes once a week to rush in and hope that we get picked???? Half the time it's done in a dark corner of the church! Personally I believe there should be a Confession ministry, where people are praying with one another before, light, praise and worship music in the background, inspirational handouts/messages being offered.

Caedmon, that has little to do with your post because I actually think you honor confession by going so frequently, it's that you have to doubt it benefit that I am frustrated.

***rant over....

Sorry.

So to the issue, here's what I suggest. I personally believe that the only way one will overcome repetetative sins is through confession. But one thing that is very important is that the "sinner" come to a better understanding of how the sin affects God. If we simple confess to get the Eucharist, we will likely not transform our actions as readily as we might if we fully understood the impact our sin has on God. The more we love someone the less we want to hurt our relationship with them. True contrition is a vow to never repeat the sin.

I know from experience that there is a point where we need to say, "Jesus, by the power of the Holy Spirit, give me true contrition." and then we need to make a complete commitment to Never acting in that way again.

Confession should be both a place of peace and conviction. While it would be wonderful if every priest were and excellent confessor that is not always the case. But...that doesn't mean every confession can't be an excellent confession.

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

/\Great Post/\

 

[LightHearted]

Joe,

You're doing the right thing by going to confession after every mortal sin. You know that you're doing the right thing. Don't let the actions (or inactions) of other people fool you into thinking that you don't need to go. That sounds like a pretty clever trick that the devil has up his sleeve.

Are you active in your parish? I like the suggestion that Miss Shelby made, in that you should become active in the parish ministries. This would allow you to get to know your priest better, along with all of the other church members. Each church has a very small core of people that seem to help out in every ministry, and they're ever looking for recruits.

I've developed a very good relationship with my priest. We have fun, tell jokes, go out for breakfast, and pray for one another. All of this came about over time, and through working hand in hand with one another through various ministries. The fact that your priest thought that he could joke with you about Reconciliation, when in actuality it makes you uncomfortable, says to me that he doesn't know you very well.