It Is Ok To Make A Negative Confession..

[Presbyterian Continuist]

It all depends on how you interpret the word and what you believe God has said.

For example, there is a massive thread on the GT forum about women pastors/preachers. Basically the argument is "God has called us", "oh no he hasn't; it says so in the Bible."
I have been told that I am disobeying God, that my call is down to feminism, personal ambition, or whatever. Some have even suggested that women preachers/pastors is a thing of the devil. The word says women must be silent, therefore the word means that women must be silent. Any testimony of what God is doing today is therefore invalid because it does not line up with Scripture (apparently.)

People have, and do, use the same reasoning about having your head covered in church, not having blood transfusions and any other number of issues - because it says so in the word. Some people even manage to justify a belief that the gifts of the Spirit are not for today, that Jesus wasn't really God or that the trinity is a flase belief - because of how they read Scripture.

So for them, I am making negative confession and speaking against God when I say "God called me". I don't believe I am, and neither do many others. But by your definition, then that is what I am doing.

As far as I can see, this negative confession belief applies only to the issues of healing and prosperity. If the belief is that Scripture says that we have the right to full health because it was provided at the cross, and we have the right to a lot of money because God wants us to have good things, but someone comes along and says that they don't believe that and that they pray "thy will be done"; THEN they are told they are making negative confession.

So it all depends on who you talk to and what their understanding of Scripture is.

Somewhere in the book of Acts it tells of Philip who had several daughters who had the gift of prophecy. I wonder how they could have exercised their gift if they were not allowed to speak?

And also, that wonderful husband and wife ministry, Aquilla and Priscilla who equipped Apollos and made him the great man of God that he became?

The popular belief of what went on in the Corinthian church was that the women there were talking out of turn, and Paul's desire was that they be silent so things could be done decently and in order. Paul had his own opinions about women teaching, and there is lots of controversy about that which only the Lord can settle when He comes again.

A ministry that a person receives, whether they are men or women, is by faith, and because the Scripture says that there is no male or female in the body of Christ (that is, no distinction between gender), then a woman can confidently have a ministry in the Spirit.

My church is Presbyterian, and is run by a group of elders. We have women elders as well. One of these women has preached in the church and has been freely accepted. Our minister at present is a young woman, and God is blessing our church through her ministry. Her appointment has been approved by the elders. I cannot conceive that God would bless us in the way He has if He did not approve of a woman taking church services and preaching.

So I think, in the light of some groups outlawing women ministers, preachers, prophets, and teachers, my thoughts would be:

They have their opinions, and I have mine...

 

[ANM29]

There is a paradox in the Christian life. If we go to God commending ourselves on how good we are, God will ignore us. Note the difference between the Pharisee and the publican in the parable of Jesus. I am not saying that we should go around saying "aint it awful" to everyone we meet; but when we go before God, it is much better to talk with Him about our sins, faults and weaknesses, because when we do that, He covers them, and lets the graces of Jesus shine out through us. But if we come before God and talk with Him about how spiritual we are, and how much better than others less fortunate than us are, then the Lord will punish and discipline us until we learn humility.

We are what we are through the grace of God. We have nothing that has not been given to us by the Lord. Without Him we can do nothing.

When I see these great flashy ministers and evangelists strutting around advertising themselves with great big pictures of themselves and their names in lights, I see people who are commending themselves, making a great show in the flesh, while fooling people to think they are moving in the Spirit. It is a great tragedy to see thousands of people running after them, as if they were more important to them than Jesus Himself.

We must not lose touch with the crucified, suffering Saviour, who hung on that cross for us. He has now been raised to honour and glory, and prays for us to the Father. We need to be humble under His mighty hand. I have no hesitation in talking about my faults and failings to the Lord. I never hide my sinfulness from Him, because I depend on His grace and love to lift me up. Isn't it much better to be lifted up by the Lord with his love and grace, than to lift myself up and appear to others as some great spiritual dude, when I know that I am not really.

He knows who I am, and I am not afraid to let it all hang out with Him. Then, when I minister to others, He is free to let His glory shine through. I treasure that most of all.

 

[ANM29]

Somewhere in the book of Acts it tells of Philip who had several daughters who had the gift of prophecy. I wonder how they could have exercised their gift if they were not allowed to speak?

And also, that wonderful husband and wife ministry, Aquilla and Priscilla who equipped Apollos and made him the great man of God that he became?

The popular belief of what went on in the Corinthian church was that the women there were talking out of turn, and Paul's desire was that they be silent so things could be done decently and in order. Paul had his own opinions about women teaching, and there is lots of controversy about that which only the Lord can settle when He comes again.

A ministry that a person receives, whether they are men or women, is by faith, and because the Scripture says that there is no male or female in the body of Christ (that is, no distinction between gender), then a woman can confidently have a ministry in the Spirit.

My church is Presbyterian, and is run by a group of elders. We have women elders as well. One of these women has preached in the church and has been freely accepted. Our minister at present is a young woman, and God is blessing our church through her ministry. Her appointment has been approved by the elders. I cannot conceive that God would bless us in the way He has if He did not approve of a woman taking church services and preaching.

So I think, in the light of some groups outlawing women ministers, preachers, prophets, and teachers, my thoughts would be:

They have their opinions, and I have mine...

And now many have made a 'law' out of that scripture...Sad....

 

[pinetree]

I'll just stick my oar in here, because I just can't help it...

I am not sure whether our everyday words actually create the future, but I know that our choices today create our future tomorrow in some way. I also know that we might have to give some sort of account of the things we say at some future time, and that thought scares me a little because I am not always careful about the words I say, especially when I use my sense of humour, which is not always reverent to say the least!

But the Lord did show me the type of words that can create a future for a person. That is when we speak prophetically as led by the Holy Spirit for a person. This is why the gift of prophecy is such an important gift, and carries quite a weight of reponsibility. The words we speak in prophecy for a group or a person can create a future for them, or at least affect their future. For example, a person may receive a prophecy that says things that God is going to do for them in times to come. There may be no present indication that those things could ever be possible, and it would be easy to discount the prophecy as being false; but, in six months time, when the recording of that prophecy is played back, or reread, it might be obvious that what was said is quickly coming to pass. Joel spoke a prophecy 800 years before the Day of Pentecost, and it came to pass all that time later. I believe that if the Holy Spirit leads a person to prophesy something for the future which, according to the evidence, does not exist right now, then God will create the future according to the Word He has spoken. Of course, we have to be careful that what we prophesy is actually what the Holy Spirit is saying, especially when we prophesy something that is going to happen in the future for a person. Remember the 400 prophets of Baal who prophesied that Ahab was going to win a mighty victory, when one prophet of the Lord said that he was going to die in battle and Israel was going to be without a shepherd. So it is not always the majority who are right.

But I would not want to put anyone off if they through their faith receive a word they believe is from the Spirit and through their obedience give it, even though their knees are shaking with fear while they are doing it. Many powerful words of prophecy have been given through people like that. It has all to do with the motivation and sincerity of people's hearts before God. False prophets are false because of their motivation and self commendation, and not because of the mistakes that a sincere-hearted believer might make in giving a word he truly believes is from God. But we cannot readily tell the motivation of a person's heart to know the difference sometimes, and that is why Paul teaches that prophecy should be judged before it is believed and accepted.

We have also heard of the expression, "self fulfilling prophecy." This is a mystery in a lot of ways, but it seems that people who go around constantly saying "aint it awful", seem to have more 'awful' things happen to them than people who go around saying, "isn't God good to me!"

I think that the "doom and gloom" merchants (including those in the church), may influence our future if we choose to believe what they say. But John says "Believe not every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they come from God or not."

So, capping it all off, I think that our future is determined by what we choose to believe today.

Yes, I completely agree with what you are saying, especially with prophecy and teaching.

Words are very powerful and can shape one's outlook and the human heart.

A parents words to a child are very important, and things we say to one another.

The words Jesus speaks are Spirit , truth and life, that is how I've learned to tell if it is God's voice or not.

God gave us a prophetic word about opening a window, for a special blessing we needed, and a few months later it happened. Your right, sometimes after we hear the word, we have a waiting period for it to come to pass! We have a sure word of prophecy.

 

[pinetree]

A lot of churches would censor Paul for saying that.

yup!

 

[Strong in Him]

I go to a church which is very similar to yours. I am an elder of that church. About three years ago we lost our minister, and half the membership left, leaving about 40 to continue on. The departing minister wrote a report and submitted it to the local Presbytery saying that St Aidan's should close down and the proceeds from the sale of the church should be used for local ministry. The church and its grounds are worth about $1.5 million NZ. When we were praying about that, the Lord told me, "I have not finished with this church yet!" and , "Fear not little flock, it is the Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom."

We have found that the Lord has kept us going and has provided many wonderful visiting ministries while we are looking for a new minister. We had a whole family join the church because they said that God had led them there.

Our people are elderly too, with just a few younger ones. They are also resistant to change, being staid Presbyterians, but they want God's will done in the church, and they don't want it to die.

Thank you for this, Oscarr, and for the encouragement.

The one big, crucial difference I see, is that your folk want God's will to be done and have their eyes on him. I'm not at all sure those in my former church do. However ... I guess I can just continue praying.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Often, by the Grace and amazing generosity of God, I reap what others have sown - in terms of their prayers, witness and blessings.

Very often God gives me what I do not deserve and may not even have asked for.
Sometimes I complain against him - he shows me love.
Sometimes I deny I can do something - he gives me the ability, nonetheless.
Sometimes I complain about the few aches and pains I have - he blesses me by taking them away or giving me strength to endure.
Sometimes I am very negative and very human - he still shows me love, and reminds me that I will never be seperated from it.

I never said that God did not still bless us...He continued to bless the children of Israel but later down the road their persistence in complaining and teaching their children to complain kept them (the orig group) from entering the promised land. I'm not talking salvation here but we will reap what we've sown (not one-time episodes but living in episodes) somewhere down the line.

I agree that "in the moment" we don't see how the actions of our words will effect us and/or others in the future. However, in the event that we persist in ignoring what the scripture says about negative talk we will reap something that is not complimentary to our walk with Him. It will teach our children to become complainers. It will drive others away from us (I know I don't like to be around people who consistently and persistently complain)

It's human to complain, but we should not think it's ok so lets teach it to our children and our neighbors. Again, I ask the question: what exactly is it that we understand when our children do what we've instructed them not to? What do you think God understands about us when we do what He's instructed us not to? He understands that we think we know better than He and while HE still loves and adores us and He gave Himself for us we still have to reap what we sow...thats HIS words, not mine.

 

[pinetree]

Well it is good to know that it is really important to be free in Christ!

Not live in elementalism,thinking it is all about my confession,instead of being true to my God experience,positive or negative..

John 8:32
Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free."

 

[pinetree]

Thank you for this, Oscarr, and for the encouragement.

The one big, crucial difference I see, is that your folk want God's will to be done and have their eyes on him. I'm not at all sure those in my former church do. However ... I guess I can just continue praying.

Here is an idea for you friend..

When people say that you cant teach,because Paul said soooooo.

Give them this often debated verse to chew on...

It will be a good distraction,,,

1 Timothy 2:15
But women will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

Verbatim?