Infallible Authority Of The Church.

[Studyman]

Sorry it sounded like you were doing the Christians should be observing the Saturday sabbath thing. As for your question I've never come across a Catholic who put any big emphasis on Sunday.

I was quoting the words of the preacher that was referenced in the OP. He is a famous, and trusted Catholic teacher. They were his words, not mine.

One thing I admire about Catholicism is mass is held every day of the week. And many Catholics go to church to worship several days a week all year long.

For me, it's about simple truth. Since I have not adopted one of this world's religious sects over another, I don't feel the urge to justify them, or defend them and can therefore discuss reality, not emotion or traditions, or accepted religious behavior which varies depending on which religious sect or business I adopted.

There is a freedom in that, that Jesus and Paul enjoyed. To be able to discuss reality and truth for the edification of ourselves and others that isn't influenced by one religious philosophy of man, or another. Yes, this Freedom Jesus had, to speak simple truth about religions and traditions, offends a lot of people. And yet, Jesus Himself said the "Truth" shall set us free.

I'm sure there were nice religious women, who were good to their kids and grandkids, who went to the temple and helped others every week in Jesus Time, who, along with moms, dads, and granddads were yelling "Crucify Him". This is simply true.

 

[ozso]

I was quoting the words of the preacher that was referenced in the OP. He is a famous, and trusted Catholic teacher. They were his words, not mine.



For me, it's about simple truth. Since I have not adopted one of this world's religious sects over another, I don't feel the urge to justify them, or defend them and can therefore discuss reality, not emotion or traditions, or accepted religious behavior which varies depending on which religious sect or business I adopted.

There is a freedom in that, that Jesus and Paul enjoyed. To be able to discuss reality and truth for the edification of ourselves and others that isn't influenced by one religious philosophy of man, or another. Yes, this Freedom Jesus had, to speak simple truth about religions and traditions, offends a lot of people. And yet, Jesus Himself said the "Truth" shall set us free.

I'm sure there were nice religious women, who were good to their kids and grandkids, who went to the temple and helped others every week in Jesus Time, who, along with moms, dads, and granddads were yelling "Crucify Him". This is simply true.

I'm not denominational either, but I'm not anti-church. I don't see any wisdom in the "I am an island" lone wolf mentality some are into. Often they come up with unorthodox ideas while talking about how incorrect or even blind most every Christian is.

 

[Studyman]

I'm not denominational either, but I'm not anti-church.

My post wasn't about you. Nevertheless, you do bring up another popular religious tradition. It doesn't really matter what religion a man adopts, as long as they adopt one. And truly there is a smorgasbord to choose from to satisfy the imagination of almost every heart.

Does it matter? Perhaps not. But it seems prudent to at least acknowledge the realities of this world God placed us in.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

"Most Christians assume that Sunday is the biblically approved day of worship. The Catholic Church protests that it transferred Christian worship from the biblical Sabbath (Saturday) to Sunday, and that to try to argue that the change was made in the Bible is both dishonest and a denial of Catholic authority. If Protestantism wants to base its teachings only on the Bible, it should worship on Saturday.” — Rome’s Challenge immaculateheart.com/maryonline Dec 2003.

Please stop. This is not a Sabbath thread.

 

[Studyman]

Please stop. This is not a Sabbath thread.

It's your thread, if you want me to stop posting words from the Catholic Fathers, regarding their authority and how they used it, I will out of respect.

 

[ozso]

My post wasn't about you. Nevertheless, you do bring up another popular religious tradition. It doesn't really matter what religion a man adopts, as long as they adopt one. And truly there is a smorgasbord to choose from to satisfy the imagination of almost every heart.

Does it matter? Perhaps not. But it seems prudent to at least acknowledge the realities of this world God placed us in.

It's not about adopting a religion, it's a matter of being a member of the body of Christ and having a healthy amount of common ground with your fellow members of the body.

 

[Studyman]

It's not about adopting a religion, it's a matter of being a member of the body of Christ and having a healthy amount of common ground with your fellow members of the body.

So then, "all" religious sects and businesses of this world, who come in Christ's Name, who call Jesus, Lord, Lord, are the Body of Christ?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

It's your thread, if you want me to stop posting words from the Catholic Fathers, regarding their authority and how they used it, I will out of respect.

Yes, please do stop making references to "sabbath" because this thread is not about sabbath ideas and also because one other thread "The Church in Rome" was also under threat of becoming a SDA orient5ed Sabbath thread and I had to ask that to stop three times.

 

[tampasteve]

Sorry it sounded like you were doing the Christians should be observing the Saturday sabbath thing. As for your question I've never come across a Catholic who put any big emphasis on Sunday. One thing I admire about Catholicism is mass is held every day of the week. And many Catholics go to church to worship several days a week all year long.

It is admirable, going to daily mass is a real blessing. Honestly, Protestant churches ought to emulate this to some degree, a single Sunday service and maybe a Wednesday bible study is a minimum. However, it is worth noting that the Catholic church has a Sunday obligation, so missing Mass is a sin, so while Catholics may not outwardly "make a big deal" about making Sunday a sabbath rest type observance, an observant Catholic will make every effort to attend Sunday (or Saturday evening) Mass.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

It is admirable, going to daily mass is a real blessing. Honestly, Protestant churches ought to emulate this to some degree, a single Sunday service and maybe a Wednesday bible study is a minimum. However, it is worth noting that the Catholic church has a Sunday obligation, so missing Mass is a sin, so while Catholics may not outwardly "make a big deal" about making Sunday a sabbath rest type observance, an observant Catholic will make every effort to attend Sunday (or Saturday evening) Mass.

Agreed, Catholics do make significant efforts to be at, at least one mass on Sunday (Saturday sunset to Sunday sunset, more or less).

 

[Valletta]

I think you're correct here.

To get infallible Scripture, you need something like: The apostles were infallible when engaged in the particular activity of Scripture-writing, due to God's involvement in that process. Similarly, the OT poets and historians were also infallible when engaged in the particular activity of Scripture-writing.

(I'm going to disagree with both the infallibility of the apostles and the infallibility of Scripture, but I agree that they're linked and are similar in nature.)

The idea being that, like the prophets, their words were inspired by the Holy Spirit. The Bible is the Word of God. That means that the words in Holy Scripture are what God wanted to convey to the people. Church authority decided what was the Word of God and what was not.

 

[AlightSeeker]

One church in revelation who are faithful throw out the false apostles but another church is rich thinking they have all they need although they're spiritually poor, blind, and naked.

 

[ozso]

It is admirable, going to daily mass is a real blessing. Honestly, Protestant churches ought to emulate this to some degree, a single Sunday service and maybe a Wednesday bible study is a minimum. However, it is worth noting that the Catholic church has a Sunday obligation, so missing Mass is a sin, so while Catholics may not outwardly "make a big deal" about making Sunday a sabbath rest type observance, an observant Catholic will make every effort to attend Sunday (or Saturday evening) Mass.

Okay. That was just guesswork on my part considering they have mass available seven days a week.

 

[ozso]

Agreed, Catholics do make significant efforts to be at, at least one mass on Sunday (Saturday sunset to Sunday sunset, more or less).

Ah so Catholocism is a lot more sabbitarian than I thought. Is there some sort of decree that if you don't you're anathema? Are Catholics allowed to work during the Catholic sabbath?

 

[ozso]

So then, "all" religious sects and businesses of this world, who come in Christ's Name, who call Jesus, Lord, Lord, are the Body of Christ?

The body of Christ is made up of individual Christians, not sects and businesses. Romans 12:3-8; 1 Corinthians 12:12-31 etc.

 

[Markie Boy]

I appreciate your motivation. I find it difficult to follow teachers however after seeing how badly their congregations have gone astray. It's like they don't see. Not even you. I think you don't see what I'm seeing. Ok maybe I'm wrong, but i dont believe I am, but it still goes against what I believe so how can I fellowship with that without speaking up? I would be thrown out I think.

I have been down that path - it will lead you being all alone - which is not God's will. From there, it took me years to find peace and be able to understand we are on the path together. It gets to be a long topic, but I'd suggest Gavin Ortlund's Finding the Right Hills to Die On.

 

[AlightSeeker]

I have been down that path - it will lead you being all alone - which is not God's will. From there, it took me years to find peace and be able to understand we are on the path together. It gets to be a long topic, but I'd suggest Gavin Ortlund's Finding the Right Hills to Die On.

The right hill to die on is loneliness. Death is lonely. We are dead without the spirit and so without him we are alone. When we are blind we sit in darkness alone. The church is alone. The apostles left us according to God's will. We have his word and we have his spirit promised though. We have each other if we are joined in the spirit. We become one with God.

1 Corinthians 2:1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, did not come with excellence of speech or of wisdom declaring to you the [a]testimony of God. 2 For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified. 3 I was with you in weakness, in fear, and in much trembling. 4 And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, 5 that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in the power of God.

Spiritual Wisdom
6 However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God [c]ordained before the ages for our glory, 8 which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

9 But as it is written:

“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”

10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the [d]Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.

 

[Markie Boy]

Kinda hard to "Not forsake the gathering of yourselves" - if you are party of one.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Kinda hard to "Not forsake the gathering of yourselves" - if you are party of one.

You are here.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Kinda hard to "Not forsake the gathering of yourselves" - if you are party of one.

We dont worship in flesh but spirit. Is it our voices God wants to hear singing songs? Is it the sight of our appearance he desires? . Or is it the sound of thanksgiving and the sound preaching his word, and prayer that he wants to hear? and to smell the sweet aroma of love? Do we do that here or do we forsake the assembly?