Gay persecution of Christians: The latest evidence...

[jazzflower92]

To us there are 613 commandments, but I don't think the numbers game here really matters. Leviticus, like all other books in the Torah, applied to those bound to the Torah. So, don't try to throw something at me because in my faith those rules only apply to Jews.

I don't have to approve of anything anybody does in order for me to treat them like a human being, free to live the life they choose to live.

You can treat someone like a human being and politely refuse something one doesn't approve of. What if a Muslim was forced to do a Christian event they don't want to do? In some of those LGBT sites they seem to go to demonizes those folks and never mention how some gay activists have actually sent death threats to those businesses.

 

[LoAmmi]

You can treat someone like a human being and politely refuse something one doesn't approve of. What if a Muslim was forced to do a Christian event they don't want to do? In some of those LGBT sites they seem to go to demonizes those folks and never mention how some gay activists have actually sent death threats to those businesses.

I would say that if the Muslim owns a public accommodation that anybody should be able to come in and purchase from them providing it is a product or service they normally carry.

 

[jazzflower92]

I would say that if the Muslim owns a public accommodation that anybody should be able to come in and purchase from them providing it is a product or service they normally carry.

Depends I don't think a Muslim would feel right about selling something he would consider sinful. That is where we have to respectfully disagree. In the cases of hospitals people need to help 100% because that is a vital source and all people regardless of any sin.

That is the case lies because these Christian owners did mention they did sell stuff to gay customers but halted at gay marriages. So, its the events part that really has to be discussed. I would withhold a cake if I learn by somehow that a man is now marrying his mistress while he divorced his wife while she had cancer. In that case that cake will be thrown into his face.

 

[Dusky Mouse]

Why this issue? Why don't they refuse to serve anybody who isn't a Christian? What if they know the person has been committing sins? Should they refuse to serve them?

Who are they that they sit in the judgment of the sins of others?

Why are you condemning Christians for making a personal choice in the name of their faith?

 

[LoAmmi]

Depends I don't think a Muslim would feel right about selling something he would consider sinful. That is where we have to respectfully disagree. In the cases of hospitals people need to help 100% because that is a vital source and all people regardless of any sin.

I can respectfully disagree.

 

[LoAmmi]

Why are you condemning Christians for making a personal choice in the name of their faith?

I think that they shouldn't be allowed to do something = condemning?

 

[jazzflower92]

I can respectfully disagree.

I think this I where I wouldn't call it persecution but really a thing where even when one respectfully disagrees honestly they will then feel the firestorm from many activists. Like I said its a firestorm not persecution there is a big difference.

 

[LoAmmi]

I think this I where I wouldn't call it persecution but really a thing where even when one respectfully disagrees honestly they will then feel the firestorm from many activists. Like I said its a firestorm not persecution there is a big difference.

I completely agree with what you've said here.

 

[Dusky Mouse]

I think that they shouldn't be allowed to do something = condemning?

Sure. You just proved it.

You think Christians shouldn't be allowed to hold to their faith and refuse to tolerate or enable gay sinners. While arguing they should be forced to tolerate everything that is contrary to scripture, God, their faith.
Why aren't you tolerant of Christians?

 

[LoAmmi]

Sure. You just proved it.

You think Christians shouldn't be allowed to hold to their faith and refuse to tolerate or enable gay sinners. While arguing they should be forced to tolerate everything that is contrary to scripture, God, their faith.
Why aren't you tolerant of Christians?

I don't think *anybody* has the right to refuse business to protected classes (in some states sexual orientation is a protected class) regardless of their religious beliefs. Please don't accuse me of being selectively against Christians.

In the past I have stated that the customization of a product is where I might be swayed to say the business didn't have to do it, but I go back and forth on that.

 

[jazzflower92]

I completely agree with what you've said here.

Just so you know here is this thread about Russia.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7773125-24/

 

[Dusky Mouse]

I don't think *anybody* has the right to refuse business to protected classes (in some states sexual orientation is a protected class) regardless of their religious beliefs. Please don't accuse me of being selectively against Christians.

In the past I have stated that the customization of a product is where I might be swayed to say the business didn't have to do it, but I go back and forth on that.

The religious are a protected class.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[LoAmmi]

The religious are a protected class.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

Protected class doesn't swing back the other way in law. If it did, all someone would have to do is say that in their religion black people are sons of the devil and they'd be able to not serve them. It doesn't work that way.

We can disagree.

 

[KatherineS]

You can treat someone like a human being and politely refuse something one doesn't approve of. What if a Muslim was forced to do a Christian event they don't want to do?

A Muslim should not be forced to do a Christian event like receiving Holy Communion. A commerical enterprise like a bakery does not have the right to refuse to sell bread to Christians because they might use it for Holy Communion.

 

[jazzflower92]

A Muslim should not be forced to do a Christian event like receiving Holy Communion. A commerical enterprise like a bakery does not have the right to refuse to sell bread to Christians because they might use it for Holy Communion.

Or how about his an atheist feels uncomfortable about selling to an event for creationists.

 

[LoAmmi]

Or how about his an atheist feels uncomfortable about selling to an event for creationists.

Selling a product? they should sell it.

 

[TheOtherHockeyMom]

And while we're debating about this...the Duma is debating whether gay parents should have their children forcibly removed.

 

[jazzflower92]

And while we're debating about this...the Duma is debating whether gay parents should have their children forcibly removed.

The Duma can jump in a lake for all I care because anyone who sides with Putin is really compromising their values. I was disliking Putin before it became popular. Plus he is bringing back Psychiatry.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/opinion/article/soviet-psychiatry-returns/487761.html

http://news.charismanews.com/world/...r-abused-under-guise-of-psychiatric-treatment

 

[TheOtherHockeyMom]

The Duma can jump in a lake for all I care because anyone who sides with Putin is really compromising their values. I was disliking Putin before it became popular. Plus he is bringing back Psychiatry.

Soviet Psychiatry Returns | Opinion | The Moscow Times

Persecuted Protester Abused Under Guise of 'Psychiatric Treatment'

It's not just Putin, the church in Russia has a role in this. Christian persecutions of gays...
The Orthodox Church’s role in Russia’s anti-gay laws | National Catholic Reporter

Included in that law is a provision that allows police officers to arrest and detain (up to two weeks) any foreign nationals or tourists whom they suspect to be gay, lesbian, or “pro-gay.”

Media reports suggest that Putin may sign an edict that would allow police to remove the children of gay or lesbian parents. Children could even be taken if their parents are only suspected of being gay or lesbian.

CBS News reported that the activists “were attacked by hundreds of Orthodox Christian activists and members of pro-Kremlin youth groups. The mostly burly young men with closely cropped hair pelted them with eggs while shouting obscenities and homophobic slurs.”

Though riot police moved in, only the gay rights activists were detained. Protesters who were not detained were later beaten by masked men on a central street about a mile away. The police, it seems, turned a blind eye.

 

[jazzflower92]

Anne Jolis: Render Unto Putin - WSJ.com

It looks like some members of the clergy do seem to have some dissatisfaction with the relationship going on with the heads of church and Putin.