Apostles are around today.

[PsaltiChrysostom]

We use the title of Apostle typically to those named in the Scriptures as those taught directed by Jesus or by one of the Apostles like Timothy. In the Eastern Orthodox church, the title isapóstolos or Equal-to-the-Apostles gets applied to those who converted large groups of people such as St. Patrick of Ireland, Apostle to the Irish.

 

[FireDragon76]

"Apostle" can refer to someone who is called as a missionary to a region. For instance, St. Ansgar, a 9th century bishop, is considered an apostles to the Danes. St. Columba was an apostle in Scotland in the island of Iona, etc.

Now days I'd be wary of anybody calling themselves an apostle, just because of the delusions of grandeur implied.

 

[dzheremi]

In the Oriental Orthodox tradition, it is similar to what our friend PsaliChrysostom describes above in the Eastern Orthodox Church. The word we use in Arabic in the Coptic Orthodox Church is رسولي (rasouli), which is just the adjective 'apostolic', and is used in all the ways we might use it in English (e.g., الكنيسة الرسولية 'the apostolic church', الإيمان الرسولي 'the apostolic faith', etc.), a potential difference being that we use it with regard to not just those who converted large groups of people (e.g., St. Gregory, the Illuminator of Armenia), but also those who are primarily remembered for their contributions for preserving the apostolic faith, such as HH St. Athanasius, who always gets the honorific 'the Apostolic'/'el rasouli' whenever we mention him. (Though I suppose since he was responsible for sending the Nubian regions their first bishops in the 4th century when he sent the first of them to Philae, it could be argued that HH is apostolic in the other way, too.)

Anyway, so of course there are apostles today, as there are still men and women carrying out the work of evangelizing the world and preserving the faith delivered to us all by the apostles themselves. The key is that they are not one-off or otherwise 'irregulars' relative to Christianity as it is actually established in the world. I could not declare myself an apostle no matter how I read the Bible, for instance, and 'Apostle' is in itself not an established 'rank' within the Christian Church (a point that some parasitic assemblies, such as that of the Mormons, fail to understand). Rather, an apostle of a given time or place will be recognized to be so by the true successors of the original Apostles of Christ, who are the bishops presiding over a given territory and church (e.g., the Georgian Orthodox Church in the country of Georgia, the Armenian Apostolic Church in Armenia, etc.), in the direct line of our fathers and masters the holy apostles and disciples of Christ our God. For example, HH Pope Tawadros II, who has held this position since 2012, is the 118th patriarch to preside over the See of St. Mark, which was established by the apostle and Gospel-writer himself sometime before 68 AD. (As near as I can tell, there has always been at least some degree of debate regarding when exactly our apostle St. Mark arrived in Egypt, but the 68 AD date of his martyrdom does not seem to be contradicted by anyone of note.)

 

[FireDragon76]

The Pentecostal notion of apostle sounds more like a religious entrepreneur (like in the movie with Robert Duval, The Apostle, where he plays a hot-headed Pentecostal preacher that kills a man in anger than runs off as a self-appointed apostle).

However, the ancient notion of the apostle was connected with the concept of the oikomene, the known world, because the purpose of the original apostles was to go out into the world and teach and preach. Every tribe and nation on earth has been contacted by some form of Christianity, at one time or another, so it seems to me the mission of a self-styled apostle is largely nonexistant, unless you want to redefine apostle to mean something ahistorical, or using the term figuratively.

 

[Clare73]

I explained how it is demonstrated: by the five-fold-ministry.

You have no Bible passages that in context shows that the title of apostles and prophets are discontinued.

Passage presented, and then grievously "misunderstood."

 

[All Becomes New]

Now days I'd be wary of anybody calling themselves an apostle, just because of the delusions of grandeur implied.

I'm inclined to agree.

In the Oriental Orthodox tradition, it is similar to what our friend PsaliChrysostom describes above in the Eastern Orthodox Church. The word we use in Arabic in the Coptic Orthodox Church is رسولي (rasouli), which is just the adjective 'apostolic', and is used in all the ways we might use it in English (e.g., الكنيسة الرسولية 'the apostolic church', الإيمان الرسولي 'the apostolic faith', etc.), a potential difference being that we use it with regard to not just those who converted large groups of people (e.g., St. Gregory, the Illuminator of Armenia), but also those who are primarily remembered for their contributions for preserving the apostolic faith, such as HH St. Athanasius, who always gets the honorific 'the Apostolic'/'el rasouli' whenever we mention him. (Though I suppose since he was responsible for sending the Nubian regions their first bishops in the 4th century when he sent the first of them to Philae, it could be argued that HH is apostolic in the other way, too.)

Anyway, so of course there are apostles today, as there are still men and women carrying out the work of evangelizing the world and preserving the faith delivered to us all by the apostles themselves. The key is that they are not one-off or otherwise 'irregulars' relative to Christianity as it is actually established in the world. I could not declare myself an apostle no matter how I read the Bible, for instance, and 'Apostle' is in itself not an established 'rank' within the Christian Church (a point that some parasitic assemblies, such as that of the Mormons, fail to understand). Rather, an apostle of a given time or place will be recognized to be so by the true successors of the original Apostles of Christ, who are the bishops presiding over a given territory and church (e.g., the Georgian Orthodox Church in the country of Georgia, the Armenian Apostolic Church in Armenia, etc.), in the direct line of our fathers and masters the holy apostles and disciples of Christ our God. For example, HH Pope Tawadros II, who has held this position since 2012, is the 118th patriarch to preside over the See of St. Mark, which was established by the apostle and Gospel-writer himself sometime before 68 AD. (As near as I can tell, there has always been at least some degree of debate regarding when exactly our apostle St. Mark arrived in Egypt, but the 68 AD date of his martyrdom does not seem to be contradicted by anyone of note.)

Would that mean you would consider someone like Charles Spurgeon and Billy Graham apostles since they led so many people to faith?

 

[PsaltiChrysostom]

I'm inclined to agree.



Would that mean you would consider someone like Charles Spurgeon and Billy Graham apostles since they led so many people to faith?

Neither the OO or EO would consider them at all because they are outside of our respective churches. It isn't intended as disrespect but they are simply outside of our respective faiths. For example, the Eastern Orthodox call St. Nicholas of Japan the Equal-of-the-Apostles because he founded the Japanese Orthodox church. The OO don't recognize him because he is EO and not OO.

 

[All Becomes New]

Neither the OO or EO would consider them at all because they are outside of our respective churches. It isn't intended as disrespect but they are simply outside of our respective faiths. For example, the Eastern Orthodox call St. Nicholas of Japan the Equal-of-the-Apostles because he founded the Japanese Orthodox church. The OO don't recognize him because he is EO and not OO.

I wish we could get past this sort of thing as the Church of Christ.

 

[Always in His Presence]

And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

If there are no Apostles today, there are also no Prophets, no Evangelist, no Pastors, and no Teachers either.

You cannot separate the word

 

[Always in His Presence]

@Jesse Dornfeld What do you find funny in my post?

 

[All Becomes New]

@Jesse Dornfeld What do you find funny in my post?

You cannot separate the word

Seems nonsensical that you can't spread the word today. I thought you were joking.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Seems nonsensical that you can't spread the word today. I thought you were joking.

I did not say you cannot spread the word - I said you cannot separate the word. Apostles, Prophets, Evangelist, Pastors and Teachers are all part of the same sentence - If one is no longer, then all are no longer. They cannot be separated.

 

[All Becomes New]

I did not say you cannot spread the word - I said you cannot separate the word. Apostles, Prophets, Evangelist, Pastors and Teachers are all part of the same sentence - If one is no longer, then all are no longer. They cannot be separated.

Correct. So they are all around today. That's why it says they are around "until we are unified in the knowledge of the Son of God."

 

[Always in His Presence]

Correct. So they are all around today. That's why it says they are around "until we are unified in the knowledge of the Son of God."

Absolutely yes.

 

[All Becomes New]

Absolutely yes.

Glad we got over that confusion!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Since many agree that (regardless of what we see around us) Apostles and Prophets exist today and will continue to exist till the end, many will also ask: "Where are the manifestations that accompany and prove" these ministries?

1 Corin 12:12
(Weymouth) The signs that characterize the true Apostle have been done among you, accompanied by unwearied fortitude, and by tokens and marvels and displays of power.
(Williams) The marks that signify the genuine apostle were exhibited among you in my perfect patience, in signs, wonders, and wonder-works.

I would submit that because of errors in the fundamental doctrines taught by called apostles who SHOULD have these signs, there are none
IOWs the Holy Spirit is not going to confirm teaching that has grievous errors that do not follow the fundamentals listed in Heb 6:1-3.

 

[All Becomes New]

Since many agree that (regardless of what we see around us) Apostles and Prophets exist today and will continue to exist till the end, many will also ask: "Where are the manifestations that accompany and prove" these ministries?

1 Corin 12:12
(Weymouth) The signs that characterize the true Apostle have been done among you, accompanied by unwearied fortitude, and by tokens and marvels and displays of power.
(Williams) The marks that signify the genuine apostle were exhibited among you in my perfect patience, in signs, wonders, and wonder-works.

I would submit that because of errors in the fundamental doctrines taught by called apostles who SHOULD have these signs, there are none
IOWs the Holy Spirit is not going to confirm teaching that has grievous errors that do not follow the fundamentals listed in Heb 6:1-3.

I've experienced some pretty wild things since my faith was confirmed in August 2018. Not calling myself an apostle, but supernatural things still happen.

 

[OldAbramBrown]

... Billy Graham apostles since they led so many people to faith? ...

Billy Graham didn't firm up churches, he distracted from their full basis to some extent, partly because of his wobbling, plus when the world needed a wider range of ministries, many others sat back.

 

[Dahveed]

Do they have demonstrated "signs and wonders"? Is that required to be an apostle in your tradition? Because that is one of the key things that marks a person as an apostle.

Apostolic Ministry
It must be someone who continued with us, [persevered]. For one of these must become a witness with us of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. Acts 1:21-22
Who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed in due time. And for this purpose I was appointed an apostle—1 Timothy 2:6-7

With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all. Acts 4:33

I persevered in demonstrating among you the marks of a true apostle, including signs, wonders and miracles. 2 Cor 12:12

Through Him we received grace and apostleship to call all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith; Rom 1:5

That the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy. As it is written:
“Therefore I will praise you among the Gentiles;
Again, it says, “Rejoice, you Gentiles, with his people.” Rom 15:8-13

Now I have resurrection power
Jesus, You have given us freedom
Your Holy Spirit lives in me
The new has come

 

[David Kent]

If there are no Apostles today, there are also no Prophets, no Evangelist, no Pastors, and no Teachers either.

You cannot separate the word

You can
Does anyone today have the signs of an apostle?