the myth of flat earth debunked again

[prodromos]

https://codepen.io/Contrapenner/pen/gOyyjVN

There you go, I made an imaginary moon tracker, with animations and all, the moon being tracked is 2051 trillion imaginary light years away
and its imaginary orbit started on April 29th 2024 at 9:09 central time. Notice however that the track of the orbit itself around its earth is tracked based on the moons movement itself idependant of time.

If I had access to the server, the variable you see in the code as "now" could come from the server.
And in that case the time would be from the server and it would not matter what the users time clock is.

Because it is coming from JavaScript, the users web browser, the Date Object of the browser,
it therefore changes based on what the users clock is, a user can set their clock to before April 29th and have a strange result,
negative numbers. The same is true for the Nasa page, they are simply using the Date Object of the browser,
it is not really any advanced programming at all, and it is not really tracking anything at all.

Just when I think I've seen the greatest levels of pride and hubris humans are capable of, someone comes along and leaves them in their dust.

 

[Astrid]

Just when I think I've seen the greatest levels of pride and hubris humans are capable of, someone comes along and leaves them in their dust.

It's not so impressive. Every yec thinks they initially more
than any scientist on earth.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Years later when asked if they would swear on the Bible that they walked on the moon,
most of them had negative reactions, one even running away in fear.
"Astronauts gone wild" by Bart Sibrel.

Hey, a Bart Sibrel sighting!

The conspiracy theorist best known for his showdown with Moon landing pioneer Buzz Aldrin has sensationally claimed that UFOs are flown by 'fallen angels' determined to rule the world

Bart Sibrel, who has made four low-budget “documentaries” about the Moon landings, told podcaster Joe Rogan that he had been told about the supernatural nature of UFOs by “experts” in the field. “The top two UFO researchers said UFOs are real, number one. Number two, they're not from outer space, and number three they're demonic,” he explained.

 

[contratodo]

You don't need a server to keep track of when the launch was. It is a simple fact:

The miles should not change with my computers clock. The amount of miles the voyager has supposedly traveled should be a set amount not changing with my computers clock. Their whole page is designed to show a calculated result based on the browsers clock. It is not sincerely tracking the voyager therefore, but rather the browsers clock.


"" If you change what "now" is by resetting your clock then OF COURSE the displayed time will change. ""

A professional website would have 'now' stored on the server and not coming from simple JavaScript.

The time might change, but the miles should not, the amount of miles it has supposedly traveled should be a set amount in disregard of time,
if it has actually traveled.

The page is using the browsers clock to calculate how many miles the voyager has supposedly traveled, and not data from the voyager!

Number two, they're not from outer space, and number three they're demonic,” he explained.

How many of you are Christians, who have been responding to me?
I'm sure I saw at least one who does not believe in aliens, who believes they are a lie, a deception.

Does anyone agree with that? That aliens are a deception? Are any of you sincere Christians or what?
What unity do we have? Are not aliens a deception? Does not the Bible hint at such? Revelation 13:6

 

[contratodo]

Just when I think I've seen the greatest levels of pride and hubris humans are capable of, someone comes along and leaves them in their dust.

What ever do you mean? My example is doing the same exact thing as the Nasa page, I even have little animations too,
at this point it has been about 7 days or so, I did have to adjust it on the first, but from then my code is still tracking my imaginary moon very well.
Only 2 or 3 of you actually even looked at it.


https://codepen.io/Contrapenner/pen/gOyyjVN

 

[Hans Blaster]

The miles should not change with my computers clock. The amount of miles the voyager has supposedly traveled should be a set amount not changing with my computers clock. Their whole page is designed to show a calculated result based on the browsers clock. It is not sincerely tracking the voyager therefore, but rather the browsers clock.

[Picard-Riker facepalm GIF]

Have you just ignored everything we've said about how spacecraft are tracked and the delay time of communication, etc.?

I don't know the actual interval between telemetry data from Voyager, but it isn't continuous. (The bit rate is extremely low and requires resources to receive the signal.) The properties of the spacecraft (position, distance, velocity) are accurately known at the points when they are specifically known. The model used to interpolate positions is, no doubt, a simplified version of the one that NASA uses to track the spacecraft. If you get the sky position, you'd have everything needed to point your 100-m radio dish at it and listen for yourself.

"" If you change what "now" is by resetting your clock then OF COURSE the displayed time will change. ""

A professional website would have 'now' stored on the server and not coming from simple JavaScript.

Server! What nonsense! This is my biggest (and oldest) complaint about modern web design -- too much chatting with the servers, auto-page generation, etc. It sucks resources of local bandwidth, loads pages poorly under restricted bandwidth, and requires excessive server capacity to drive. This "server clock" notion of yours is just a tiny manifestation of this disease.

Your computer (or mobile device) has an internal clock. It keeps good time. Most computers are configured to check with a time base server on regular intervals to prevent drift, etc. Cellular devices get the time updated when connecting to towers all the time. Your computer/device has a time (in UTC) that is just as accurate as any served from a remote NASA server. This complaint is bogus.

The time might change, but the miles should not, the amount of miles it has supposedly traveled should be a set amount in disregard of time,
if it has actually traveled.

That's not how motion works. Learn some physics.

The page is using the browsers clock to calculate how many miles the voyager has supposedly traveled, and not data from the voyager!

Go download the raw data if you like. I doubt you have the foggiest idea how to use it.

 

[contratodo]

Your computer/device has a time (in UTC) that is just as accurate as any served from a remote NASA server. This complaint is bogus.

A server is just another computer. Nasa should have their own servers from which they can keep their own time, and the set data of the supposed satellite. The plain point remains the same, the page is not actually tracking anything, but rather is giving calculations based on the users clock.
The users clock is not accurate, the user can change their clock to whatever time, as I did.
A time maintained by a nasa server would be accurate,
as no one could change it but them, and also changing the users computer clock would then not effect the page.

I don't know the actual interval between telemetry data from Voyager, but it isn't continuous. (The bit rate is extremely low and requires resources to receive the signal.)

Right, so you think they receive an actual signal from the satellite way out in 'outer-space'.
If that is the case, the data on that page should only ever change with that signal.
The page simply stating when they receive the signal.

And someone stated how that the signal was updated on April 18th,
my initial demonstration was on April 22nd, I was able to change my clock refresh that page and get different results.

If it really is that they receive a signal every so often,
then at that point they know the data,
and could just store that data in a database, the website referencing the database. Simple.

The page is setup to look as if it is getting live data from a satellite,
but certainly it is not, the data displayed is based off the users own clock, as I demonstrated,
and you can also test it for yourself.

The data, all of the data, the animations and everything, changes if I change my computer clock and refresh the page,
showing that it is not tracking any signal, or even getting data from a database, but rather just my computers clock.
Very elementary simple. (as I showed in my code example)

It is as if they don't know how to code on the server, they have some old guy that does everything still for the websites,
or they did it on purpose.

Go download the raw data if you like. I doubt you have the foggiest idea how to use it.

Where can I download the raw data?


Edit
Just to be clear, this: Voyager - Mission Status
is what we are talking about.
What raw data?

Not operation schedules, not posters,
the raw data from the supposed satellite that the page is supposedly tracking,
where is it dear one?

Nowhere, the page is giving data based on the users clock, not any "raw data" from a "satellite" in "outer-space".

The Nasa logo has a snakes tongue for a reason. Deception is what they practice.
Lies, blaspheme about God, blaspheme about His tabernacle and blaspheme about them that dwell beyond the sky.

Even when you click the "view voyager" button and get the fancier animation, that too is going off your computers clock,
you can change where the "satellite" is by simply changing your computers clock.

Where can I download the raw data?

No where.

 

[prodromos]

A server is just another computer. Nasa should have their own servers from which they can keep their own time, and the set data of the supposed satellite. The plain point remains the same, the page is not actually tracking anything, but rather is giving calculations based on the users clock.
The users clock is not accurate, the user can change their clock to whatever time, as I did.
A time maintained by a nasa server would be accurate,
as no one could change it but them, and also changing the users computer clock would then not effect the page.




Right, so you think they receive an actual signal from the satellite way out in 'outer-space'.
If that is the case, the data on that page should only ever change with that signal.
The page simply stating when they receive the signal.

And someone stated how that the signal was updated on April 18th,
my initial demonstration was on April 22nd, I was able to change my clock refresh that page and get different results.

If it really is that they receive a signal every so often,
then at that point they know the data,
and could just store that data in a database, the website referencing the database. Simple.

The page is setup to look as if it is getting live data from a satellite,
but certainly it is not, the data displayed is based off the users own clock, as I demonstrated,
and you can also test it for yourself.

The data, all of the data, the animations and everything, changes if I change my computer clock and refresh the page,
showing that it is not tracking any signal, or even getting data from a database, but rather just my computers clock.
Very elementary simple. (as I showed in my code example)

It is as if they don't know how to code on the server, they have some old guy that does everything still for the websites,
or they did it on purpose.



Where can I download the raw data?


Edit
Just to be clear, this: Voyager - Mission Status
is what we are talking about.
What raw data?

Not operation schedules, not posters,
the raw data from the supposed satellite that the page is supposedly tracking,
where is it dear one?

Nowhere, the page is giving data based on the users clock, not any "raw data" from a "satellite" in "outer-space".

The Nasa logo has a snakes tongue for a reason. Deception is what they practice.
Lies, blaspheme about God, blaspheme about His tabernacle and blaspheme about them that dwell beyond the sky.

Even when you click the "view voyager" button and get the fancier animation, that too is going off your computers clock,
you can change where the "satellite" is by simply changing your computers clock.

Where can I download the raw data?

No where.

Congratulations! I don't believe I have ever seen such an excellent example of the Dunning-Kruger effect in action. Truly amazing!

 

[Hans Blaster]

Where can I download the raw data?


Edit
Just to be clear, this: Voyager - Mission Status
is what we are talking about.
What raw data?

Not operation schedules, not posters,
the raw data from the supposed satellite that the page is supposedly tracking,
where is it dear one?

Nowhere, the page is giving data based on the users clock, not any "raw data" from a "satellite" in "outer-space".

The Nasa logo has a snakes tongue for a reason. Deception is what they practice.
Lies, blaspheme about God, blaspheme about His tabernacle and blaspheme about them that dwell beyond the sky.

Even when you click the "view voyager" button and get the fancier animation, that too is going off your computers clock,
you can change where the "satellite" is by simply changing your computers clock.

Where can I download the raw data?

No where.

I entered the most obvious search terms into a search engine and it was the FIRST link:

Voyager - Science Data Access

 

[Hans Blaster]

A server is just another computer. Nasa should have their own servers from which they can keep their own time, and the set data of the supposed satellite.

First of all it is NASA. All caps. Initials for the agency's name: National Aeronautics and Space Administration.

The plain point remains the same, the page is not actually tracking anything, but rather is giving calculations based on the users clock.
The users clock is not accurate, the user can change their clock to whatever time, as I did.

The page is to illustrate the motion and progress of Voyager, not to give you hyperaccurate position so you can aim you phasers at it. Your complaint is just whinging for no real reason.

A time maintained by a nasa server would be accurate,
as no one could change it but them, and also changing the users computer clock would then not effect the page.

This is an odd complaint for you since the whole point of this Voyager sub-thread is to claim NASA is lying. It seems odd that you would trust them to keep time if you think they are lying about their primary mission: space exploration.

Right, so you think they receive an actual signal from the satellite way out in 'outer-space'.

Of course I do. Outer space is real and so is Voyager.

If that is the case, the data on that page should only ever change with that signal.
The page simply stating when they receive the signal.

We already went over this. Several times.

And someone stated how that the signal was updated on April 18th,
my initial demonstration was on April 22nd, I was able to change my clock refresh that page and get different results.

If it really is that they receive a signal every so often,
then at that point they know the data,
and could just store that data in a database, the website referencing the database. Simple.

The page is setup to look as if it is getting live data from a satellite,
but certainly it is not, the data displayed is based off the users own clock, as I demonstrated,
and you can also test it for yourself.

The data, all of the data, the animations and everything, changes if I change my computer clock and refresh the page,
showing that it is not tracking any signal, or even getting data from a database, but rather just my computers clock.
Very elementary simple. (as I showed in my code example)

It is as if they don't know how to code on the server, they have some old guy that does everything still for the websites,
or they did it on purpose.

We already went over this. Several times.

Where can I download the raw data?


Edit
Just to be clear, this: Voyager - Mission Status
is what we are talking about.
What raw data?

Not operation schedules, not posters,
the raw data from the supposed satellite that the page is supposedly tracking,
where is it dear one?

Nowhere, the page is giving data based on the users clock, not any "raw data" from a "satellite" in "outer-space".

The Nasa logo has a snakes tongue for a reason. Deception is what they practice.
Lies, blaspheme about God, blaspheme about His tabernacle and blaspheme about them that dwell beyond the sky.

The "tongue" on the NASA logo is a stylized wing which also looks like a forward pointing arrow and implies motion. NASA does not care enough about your god to blaspheme it.

 

[Astrophile]

Going back to the stars,
if this is supposed to be the truth:

View attachment 345672

That we are orbiting around a sun that is traveling 448,000 mph through space.

Then throughout the generations of man, we should have been seeing the stars move, and different stars.
Polaris should have moved from where it is by now. It should not remain generally in the center through thousands of years.

Even ancient peoples tracked Aquarius and the other constellations in the same positions they are in today.

In scientific units this is 200 km/s; it is the Sun's orbital speed around the Galactic centre, not the Sun's speed relative to nearby stars. Nearby stars are travelling in similar orbits around the Galactic centre, so the Sun's speed relative to these stars is about 18 km/s. Even 448,000 mph (200 km/s) amounts to only 0.20 parsecs (0.63 light-years) in a thousand years, and this distance is insignificant compared to the distances of most stars.

The motion of the Sun, and of the other stars, does produce detectable changes (called proper motion) in the positions of the stars, but for most stars these changes are so small that they can be detected only over periods of decades and with specialised instruments.

 

[johansen]

Even ancient peoples tracked Aquarius and the other constellations in the same positions they are in today.

Over 1000 years its enough to notice. So much so that every 1000 years or so a new temple was built on malta at the new angle. There are something like 15 temples..

 

[essentialsaltes]

Over 1000 years its enough to notice. So much so that every 1000 years or so a new temple was built on malta at the new angle. There are something like 15 temples..

In another 11,000 years, they can go back to the first one, once a precession cycle is complete!

 

[Astrophile]

Colonel Jeffrey Williams has just retired from NASA. He's seen and photographed the earth from space. He is a committed Christian. If you are FE or need convincing that the earth is a globe, please watch the interview.

First, Colonel Williams appears to have forgotten Isaiah 11:3; 'he will not judge by what he sees with his eyes'. Second, the fact that he is a committed Christian does not necessarily mean that his interpretation of what the Bible says about the shape of the Earth is correct.

It would be interesting to know whether Colonel Williams also believes that the Earth is less than 10,000 years old or that the sedimentary rocks, with their fossils, were deposited by Noah's flood. If he does, then we can safely reject his opinion on any scientific matter.

Note: I do not believe that the Earth is flat. I am merely trying to demonstrate that your trust in Colonel Williams's opinion on this point may not be as well founded as you think it is.

 

[Astrophile]

The Bible does not say the earth is flat.

If the Bible did say that the Earth is flat, what shape would you think it is? Would you accept the opinion of Colonel Williams, based on the evidence of his own eyes, or what the Bible says?

As I understand it, the Sumerian and Babylonian astronomers of the last three millennia BCE adopted a flat-Earth cosmology in which the sky, or firmament, was a solid vault, with the Sun, Moon and stars moving across it., with water both below the flat Earth and above the firmament (see diagram below). The authors of Genesis 1, writing during or shortly after the Babylonian captivity, simply adopted this cosmology and fitted it to the Jewish religion.

That's why. You also are a sinful man. So why should I take any notice of what you say? It does not matter who is speaking, truth is still truth. Why can't you accept the proof before you very eyes, something that has been known for over 2,000 and confirmed by countless scientific and empirical observations? 2+2=4. The Bible does not say that either. But it is a fact. The earth is a globe. That is a fact. Get over it.

You have put yourself in a difficult situation. Your version of Christianity requires you to believe everything in the Bible. However, the overwhelming scientific evidence that the Earth is spherical, or, more accurately, an oblate spheroid, contradicts the implied statements in the Bible that the Earth is flat and the sky is a solid vault. You can therefore maintain your form of Christianity only by denying that the Bible says that the Earth is flat.

 

[prodromos]

You have put yourself in a difficult situation. Your version of Christianity requires you to believe everything in the Bible. However, the overwhelming scientific evidence that the Earth is spherical, or, more accurately, an oblate spheroid, contradicts the implied statements in the Bible that the Earth is flat and the sky is a solid vault. You can therefore maintain your form of Christianity only by denying that the Bible says that the Earth is flat.

Excuse me? What do you mean by "your version of Christianity" in reference to @Aussie Pete who identifies as Non Denom?

Also, you are responding to the beginning of a thread that is now over 1000 posts. You are a bit late to the party and I doubt you've taken the time to read all the responses. Do you honestly think you are bringing something new to the discussion?

 

[Ophiolite]

Surely all views can be accomodated via agreement that the Earth is the shape of a geoid?

 

[Dan1988]

Surely all views can be accomodated via agreement that the Earth is the shape of a geoid?

I came across an ammeter astronomer, who claims to have strong evidence to suggest that the earth is actually banana shaped. He said, people are laughing at me now, but I will have that last laugh when humans invent a rocket that can fly high enough to see the whole of the earth.
But that technology will only be developed in the distant future, maybe in 500 years for now. So the debate will continue to rage long after we're all dead.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

You can therefore maintain your form of Christianity only by denying that the Bible says that the Earth is flat.

Or denying that the Bible requires a literal interpretation in Genesis.
Why is it that a non literal interpretation is so hard to accept for some people?

One must distinguish between the form and the content.

 

[Ophiolite]

Why is it that a non literal interpretation is so hard to accept for some people?

It has always struck me as weird. Metaphor is at the heart of language. To my knowledge this has been so for millenia. We tell tales using all kinds of rhetorical devices and images and comparisons and analogies, in order to tell a greater truth and yet all of the power and richness and diversity is discarded and denied in place of a dry, empty literal desert. How sad.