The so-called "biblical" view on slavery ...

[2PhiloVoid]

... alright. Enough of the horse-hockey that so many non-Christians who come here keep proffering about slavery and the Bible.

Instead, I propose we watch an episode of an atheist podcast for an additional angle on the "biblical" slavery issue. The following video is a recent episode of SHANNON Q, an atheist, who recently had Old Testament scholar Dr. Josh Bowen and New Testament scholar Laura Robinson (a new scholar who is presently working on her PhD at Duke University) on her show to discuss and elaborate upon the issue of slavery in the bible, addressing what it is as a social problem in the biblical text(S) and providing some discussion that will perhaps unsettle some of my fellow Christians but also provide some insight into this topic for non-believers just passing through ....

Shannon Q - Biblical Views on Slavery

[Note: Laura Robinson has tech issues off and on during the first 35 minutes of the video, so bear with it and you'll find that things stream a bit better for her ...]​

[As an aside, I really don't care that the video is an hour and a half long. If you don't have time to watch it, then you don't have time to jibber jabber about this topic either, mainly because if you're consistent, then you don't have the time to have read up-teen hundreds of pages of academic work on the subject by which you'd have anything of any real substance or knowledge to say something ...]

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

... alright. Enough of the horse-hockey that so many non-Christians who come here keep proffering about slavery and the Bible.

Instead, I propose we watch an episode of an atheist podcast for an additional angle on the "biblical" slavery issue. The following video is a recent episode of SHANNON Q, an atheist, who recently had Old Testament scholar Dr. Josh Bowen and New Testament scholar Laura Robinson (a new scholar who is presently working on her PhD at Duke University) on her show to discuss and elaborate upon the issue of slavery in the bible, addressing what it is as a social problem in the biblical text(S) and providing some discussion that will perhaps unsettle some of my fellow Christians but also provide some insight into this topic for non-believers just passing through ....

Shannon Q - Biblical Views on Slavery

[As an aside, I really don't care that the video is an hour and a half long. If you don't have time to watch it, then you don't have time to jibber jabber about this topic either, mainly because if you're consistent, then you don't have the time to have read up-teen hundreds of pages of academic work on the subject by which you'd have anything of any real substance or knowledge to say something ...]

So instead of reading the actual biblical text as I provided you want to use an atheist YouTube channel as your source to begin a discussion on biblical slavery? All I did was quote the scripture. Why not engage that?

 

[topher694]

... alright. Enough of the horse-hockey that so many non-Christians who come here keep proffering about slavery and the Bible.

Instead, I propose we watch an episode of an atheist podcast for an additional angle on the "biblical" slavery issue. The following video is a recent episode of SHANNON Q, an atheist, who recently had Old Testament scholar Dr. Josh Bowen and New Testament scholar Laura Robinson (a new scholar who is presently working on her PhD at Duke University) on her show to discuss and elaborate upon the issue of slavery in the bible, addressing what it is as a social problem in the biblical text(S) and providing some discussion that will perhaps unsettle some of my fellow Christians but also provide some insight into this topic for non-believers just passing through ....

Shannon Q - Biblical Views on Slavery

[As an aside, I really don't care that the video is an hour and a half long. If you don't have time to watch it, then you don't have time to jibber jabber about this topic either, mainly because if you're consistent, then you don't have the time to have read up-teen hundreds of pages of academic work on the subject by which you'd have anything of any real substance or knowledge to say something ...]

Oh

 

[Caliban]

... alright. Enough of the horse-hockey that so many non-Christians who come here keep proffering about slavery and the Bible.

Instead, I propose we watch an episode of an atheist podcast for an additional angle on the "biblical" slavery issue. The following video is a recent episode of SHANNON Q, an atheist, who recently had Old Testament scholar Dr. Josh Bowen and New Testament scholar Laura Robinson (a new scholar who is presently working on her PhD at Duke University) on her show to discuss and elaborate upon the issue of slavery in the bible, addressing what it is as a social problem in the biblical text(S) and providing some discussion that will perhaps unsettle some of my fellow Christians but also provide some insight into this topic for non-believers just passing through ....

Shannon Q - Biblical Views on Slavery

[As an aside, I really don't care that the video is an hour and a half long. If you don't have time to watch it, then you don't have time to jibber jabber about this topic either, mainly because if you're consistent, then you don't have the time to have read up-teen hundreds of pages of academic work on the subject by which you'd have anything of any real substance or knowledge to say something ...]

I love Shannon Q. I also subscribe to Bowen and Robinson's podcast called NT Review. It is pretty good. I will watch the clip when I get a chance. Verrrry interesting topic.

 

[Caliban]

So instead of reading the actual biblical text as I provided you want to use an atheist YouTube channel as your source to begin a discussion on biblical slavery? All I did was quote the scripture. Why not engage that?

Check out Shannon Q--she is pretty great. I think you might appreciate her. We will definitely be explicating the text and showing that the Bible does advocate slavery in several places. I think the best argument a Christian has is that Jesus overturned the practice. Even that is not clear.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Check out Shannon Q--she is pretty great. I think you might appreciate her. We will definitely be explicating the text and showing that the Bible does advocate slavery in several places. I think the best argument a Christian has is that Jesus overturned the practice. Even that is not clear.

I am subscribed to ShannanQ. She is great. It is hard to make a case that God is good if he regulated slavery, never abolished it and Paul says things like slaves obey your masters. Nowhere does it tell anyone to free a slave, not even Philemon.

 

[Caliban]

I am subscribed to ShannanQ. She is great. It is hard to make a case that God is good if he regulated slavery, never abolished it and Paul says things like slaves obey your masters. Nowhere does it tell anyone to free a slave, not even Philemon.

You're right. This is a funny situation because usually non-believers are accused of borrowing our morality from established Judeo-Christian morals. In this case, it appears that modern Christians are trying to lay claim to Enlightenment ideals and pass them off as Christian.

 

[.Mikha'el.]

I personally think the Bible has no real position on slavery. It seems to be just an accepted part of society with no moral judgement attached to it either way.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You're right. This is a funny situation because usually non-believers are accused of borrowing our morality from established Judeo-Christian morals. In this case, it appears that modern Christians are trying to lay claim to Enlightenment ideals and pass them off as Christian.

This is a really good point.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

I personally think the Bible has no real position on slavery. It seems to be just an accepted part of society with no moral judgement attached to it either way.

Do you have a moral position on slavery as described in the Bible?

 

[Caliban]

I personally think the Bible has no real position on slavery. It seems to be just an accepted part of society with no moral judgement attached to it either way.

The 20th chapter of Exodus provides lists the ten commandments. Christians tend to consider the ten Commandments binding on the Hebrews. Verses 21-26 provide laws about Alters. Christians tend to think these laws were also binding on the Hebrews. Who ultimately established these laws. Moses or Yahweh? Most Christians will say Yahweh.


The next chapter (21) concerns laws about slaves. What changed between chapter 20 and 21. Did not the same God who gave the Ten Commandments and laws concerning the appropriate use of alters also provide his laws for how slaves should be treated? There is no reason to suppose God was just acknowledging an accepted part of society. He was giving his law—the law he established by which his people would walk in righteousness. By what criteria is slavery “just accepted” and the laws concerning Alters a reflection of Gods will?

 

[Tra Phull]

Did Paul violate Torah by sending Onesimus back to Philemon?

Torah said don't return an escaped slave to his master.

 

[Broken Fence]

Sold
Loved
Accepted
Victorious
Eternity

Joseph clear example. God says the slave believer is God's freeman. The free believer is God's slave. Wake up!

1 Corinthians 7:22

 

[Caliban]

Did Paul violate Torah by sending Onesimus back to Philemon?

Torah said don't return an escaped slave to his master.

No one is concerned with the passages that don't advocate slavery--it's the ones that do. The books of the Bible have different theological perspectives. Many Christians think it is all one harmonious book.

 

[Caliban]

Sold
Loved
Accepted
Victorious
Eternity

Joseph clear example. God says the slave believer is God's freeman. The free believer is God's slave. Wake up!

1 Corinthians 7:22

What are we waking up to???

 

[Broken Fence]

What are we waking up to???

Your a slave to God if your a believer. Your suppose to be anyway. Your bought and paid for.

 

[Caliban]

Your a slave to God if your a believer. Your suppose to be anyway. Your bought and paid for.

Well that sounds awful. I got free.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

So instead of reading the actual biblical text as I provided you want to use an atheist YouTube channel as your source to begin a discussion on biblical slavery? All I did was quote the scripture. Why not engage that?

You know why! For the same reason I've been spouting at you and cvanwey (among others) for the past year and two years, respectively. Fortunately, I don't have to repeat myself on all of that. You should have gotten it the first half dozen times I went over those reasons, but here you are....yet again....questioning me.

All I'm going to say is that I do NOT believe the Bible documents were written in a vacuum. Oops. Let me stop right there and correct myself. I should have said that I KNOW the Bible was not written in a vacuum. And so, it is inextricably tied to many other contexts, both intertextual and extra-biblical in nature. If you ignore this fact and commence to "just read the Bible as it is," then you're not actually engaging the Biblical concepts on a deeper level. This fact I'm telling you here applies to many topics in the Bible, including that of slavery. For people to flat out ignore this is...well.... as cliche as it may sound...... ignorant.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I love Shannon Q. I also subscribe to Bowen and Robinson's podcast called NT Review. It is pretty good. I will watch the clip when I get a chance. Verrrry interesting topic.

I've enjoyed listening to her off and on. As you likely know, she's appeared on several of the various atheist talk shows on Youtube. However, for me it's my coming across Laura Robinson a few months ago that has my earned my attention. I've seen a couple of her podcast as well.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

I'm afraid I can't see the video you posted, Philo. But if we're considering the question of "Does the Bible support slavery?" it has already been thoroughly answered both in the past and in the present. Yes, the Bible does.