The 24 Elders in Revelation

[Picklepie]

The twenty-four Elders in the book of Revelation bear a special signification. These Elders occupy a unique position described as “round about” the throne — yet UPON THRONES! In order to fully appreciate the scenery here drawn by the Spirit, we need to go back and examine the order established among the people of Israel after they came up out of the land of Egypt. The Camp of Israel as it was established in Sinai formed a hollow square. In the center of the hollow was the tabernacle of Moses.

Around the tabernacle Israel was divided into four camps: one camp of three tribes on the east side, another camp of three tribes on the south side, another camp of three tribes on the west side, and the last camp of three tribes on the north side. Then — in the open area between the camp of the tribes of Israel and the tabernacle was camped the tribe of Levi with its priesthood — “round about” the tabernacle. In order to go to the tabernacle from any of the tribes of Israel it was necessary to pass through the camp of the priests! This great truth reveals that God placed the camp of the priests directly between Himself and the people of Israel. It should be clear to any thinking mind that the priesthood camped “round about” the tabernacle corresponds precisely to the scene of the twenty-four Elders seated “round about” the throne of God! For you see, the Ark of the Covenant in the Most Holy Place of the tabernacle constituted the throne of Yahweh in the midst of His people! And “round about” that throne was His priesthood!

Further confirmation that the twenty-four Elders represent the ministry of priesthood lies in the fact that in I Chronicles chapter twenty-four we read of how, under king David, in preparation for their future ministry in the temple, the Levitical priesthood was divided into TWENTY-FOUR COURSES under the headship of TWENTY-FOUR ELDERS! The priesthood had become so numerous that all of those priests could not go into the house of the Lord at one time, so they were divided into courses and assigned to work shifts, each “course” of priests and Levites came on duty for a week at a time. It took all twenty-four courses to MAKE UP THE ENTIRE PRIESTHOOD OF GOD! The twenty-four Elders represent the whole priesthood of God, of which Jesus is the Head, our great High Priest!

Let us then stand assured of this marvelous truth: the four Living Creatures represent the ministry of kingship, for they dwell in the midst of the throne. The twenty-four Elders reveal within themselves the ministry of priesthood, for they are round about the throne, standing between the God of the throne and the vast multitude “before” the throne.

These are not two separate companies; these are rather two aspects of ministry that have their source and power in the throne. This is the KING-PRIEST MINISTRY OF THE MANIFEST SONS OF GOD! These are all sons of God in the power and outflow of life, glory, and power from the throne. God is raising up within each of His called and chosen elect the spirit and nature of sonship, the spirit and nature of kingship, and the spirit and nature of priesthood. These are the heavenly realities John beheld in the throne room!

The four Living Creatures — KINGS! The twenty-four Elders — PRIESTS! Together they bow low before the great King of kings and the High Priest over the house of priests, intoning this new song — “Thou hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign over the earth!” (Rev. 5:9-10). God’s meaning of a “song” is “message; revelation; experience.” All songs are meant to convey a message! Man calls anything a song, any weird beat, any unnatural accents, any harmonic dissonance, any melodic discord, the ba-ba-bu of the jungle, the raucous racket of rock music, the monotonous drone of hip-hop is merchandised as a song. A “new song” in spiritual language means a NEW REVELATION, a NEW MESSAGE, a NEW EXPERIENCE in God! A new song is born when men experience the inworking of a new message, the message and the messenger so becoming one until the messenger becomes the message.

Very awesome thoughts here.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

I had previously suggested that the 24 elders were OT saints who believed God, looking for His Christ. I refereneced the OT cloud of witnesses in Hebrews 11. I may have been close, but in looking at the elders' function, consider who they really are.

The 24 elders in Revelation hold bowls of incense, which are the prayers of the saints (Rev. 5:8).

In the OT, the High Priest would take the bowls of incense into the Holy of Holies once a year (Lev. 16:12-13).

In the NT, the veil is torn, our High Priest is Jesus Christ. The believer/saint today does not have any intercessor, but may go directly into the presence of our God through Jesus Christ.

Therefore, the 24 elders are the OT Levitical line of OT High Priests. Not all Bibles spell them exactly the same, but here they are from Ezra 7:1-5 and Nehemiah 12:10-11.

Keep in mind that Ezra closed the OT canon and there were no more prophets until John the Baptist, who "introduced" Jesus Christ. (As an aside, John the Revelator closed the NT canon.)

1) Aaron
2) Eleazor
3) Phineahas
4) Abishua
5) Bukki
6) Uzzi
7) Zerahiah
8) Meraioth
9) Azariah
10) Amariah
11) Ahitub
12) Zadok

13) Shallum
14) Hilkiah
15) Azariah
16) Seraiah
17) Ezra Jozadak
18) Jeshua
19) Joiakim
20) Eliashib
21) Joiada
22) Jonathan
23) Juddua
24) John the Baptist (parents were both Levites)

These are the 24 elders in Revelation.

sorry
so wrong in your thinking

rev 5:11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

 

[yeshuasavedme]

sorry
so wrong in your thinking

rev 5:11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

Yes, as I pointed out in my post.

The Watchers, who are "chiefs" are those angels of whom the seven stand before the God of the whole earth, and they are the "ancients" who dwell in Zion of the heavenlies and who intercede for men, and before whom the LORD Jesus reigns gloriously.

Isa 24:23 Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously.
If you really want to know about the angels who dwell in that city of God and who are called the "elect angels", and who pray and intercede for men, then read the Book of 1 Enoch.
Enoch saw them in that city and longed to go there, and was granted to go, in his translated to glory body.

1 Enoch chapter 39...
3 And in those days a whirlwind carried me off from the earth,
And set me down at the end of the heavens.
4 And there I saw another vision, the dwelling-places of the holy,
And the resting-places of the righteous.
5 Here mine eyes saw their dwellings with His righteous angels,
And their resting-places with the holy.
And they petitioned and interceded and prayed for the children of men,
And righteousness flowed before them as water,
And mercy like dew upon the earth:
Thus it is amongst them for ever and ever.
6a And in that place mine eyes saw the Elect One of righteousness and of faith,
7a And I saw his dwelling-place under the wings of the Lord of Spirits.
6b And righteousness shall prevail in his days,
And the righteous and elect shall be without number before Him for ever and ever.
7b And all the righteous and elect before Him shall be strong as fiery lights,
And their mouth shall be full of blessing,
And their lips extol the name of the Lord of Spirits,
And righteousness before Him shall never fail,
[And uprightness shall never fail before Him.]
8 There I wished to dwell,

And my spirit longed for that dwelling-place:
And there heretofore hath been my portion,
For so has it been established concerning me before the Lord of Spirits.
9 In those days I praised and extolled the name of the Lord of Spirits with blessings and praises, because He hath destined me for blessing and glory according to the good pleasure of the Lord of 10 Spirits. For a long time my eyes regarded that place, and I blessed Him and praised Him, saying: 'Blessed is He, and may He be blessed from the beginning and for evermore. And before Him there is no ceasing. He knows before the world was created what is for ever and what will be from 12 generation unto generation. Those who sleep not bless Thee: they stand before Thy glory and bless, praise, and extol, saying: "Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord of Spirits: He filleth the earth with 3 spirits."' And here my eyes saw all those who sleep not: they stand before Him and bless and say: 'Blessed be Thou, and blessed be the name of the Lord for ever and ever.' And my face was changed; for I could no longer behold.

​

That city is where all Believers have now "come to" and where the righteous go to dwell, at death.

Hbr 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Hbr 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Now, those Watchers intercede for men, as is shown in Rev. and in 1 Enoch above, and in 1 Enoch 14, when Enoch intercedes for the watchers who fell, God said this to them through Enoch;

And go, say to the Watchers of heaven, who have sent thee to intercede for them: "You should intercede" for men, and not men 3 for you: Wherefore have ye left the high, holy, and eternal heaven, and lain with women, and defiled yourselves with the daughters of men and taken to yourselves wives, and done like the children 4 of earth, and begotten giants (as your) sons? And though ye were holy, spiritual, living the eternal life, you have defiled yourselves with the blood of women, and have begotten (children) with the blood of flesh, and, as the children of men, have lusted after flesh and blood as those also do who die 5 and perish. ...

​

In the passage from Enoch where he gazed on the City of God, where the elect angels [the Watchers] dwell, and intercede for men from, and where Enoch longed to go to and was granted. The next part of that passage is the same scene in heaven which John reported, only Enoch saw it pre-incarnation and John saw it post resurrection and ascension.
One cannot understand Revelation without reading and understanding 1 Enoch, for Revelation is the "finish" of the things Enoch saw "from the beginning", when Enoch was taken to heaven and saw the Son of Man there, hidden, with God, and who was God, and who was to come, die, make an end of sin, descend to Sheol; rise, take the righteous from Sheol, ascend, and sit on the throne of Glory and return to earth to reign gloriously in the seventh Day of earth, before He regenerated the heavens and earth for the new creation.

Enoch 39 8 There I wished to dwell,
And my spirit longed for that dwelling-place:
And there heretofore hath been my portion,
For so has it been established concerning me before the Lord of Spirits.
9 In those days I praised and extolled the name of the Lord of Spirits with blessings and praises, because He hath destined me for blessing and glory according to the good pleasure of the Lord of 10 Spirits. For a long time my eyes regarded that place, and I blessed Him and praised Him, saying: 'Blessed is He, and may He be blessed from the beginning and for evermore. And before Him there is no ceasing. He knows before the world was created what is for ever and what will be from 12 generation unto generation. Those who sleep not bless Thee: they stand before Thy glory and bless, praise, and extol, saying: "Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord of Spirits: He filleth the earth with 3 spirits."' And here my eyes saw all those who sleep not: they stand before Him and bless and say: 'Blessed be Thou, and blessed be the name of the Lord for ever and ever.' And my face was changed; for I could no longer behold.
[Chapter 40]
1 And after that I saw thousands of thousands and ten thousand times ten thousand, I saw a multitude 2 beyond number and reckoning, who stood before the Lord of Spirits. And on the four sides of the Lord of Spirits I saw four presences, different from those that sleep not, and I learnt their names: for the angel that went with me made known to me their names, and showed me all the hidden things. 3 And I heard the voices of those four presences as they uttered praises before the Lord of glory. 4,5 The first voice blesses the Lord of Spirits for ever and ever. And the second voice I heard blessing 6 the Elect One and the elect ones who hang upon the Lord of Spirits. And the third voice I heard pray and intercede for those who dwell on the earth and supplicate in the name of the Lord of Spirits. 7 And I heard the fourth voice fending off the Satans and forbidding them to come before the Lord 8 of Spirits to accuse them who dwell on the earth. After that I asked the angel of peace who went with me, who showed me everything that is hidden: 'Who are these four presences which I have 9 seen and whose words I have heard and written down?' And he said to me: 'This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering: and the second, who is set over all the diseases and all the wounds of the children of men, is Raphael: and the third, who is set over all the powers, is Gabriel: and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel.' 10 And these are the four angels of the Lord of Spirits and the four voices I heard in those days.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Yes, as I pointed out in my post.
In the passage from Enoch where he gazed on the City of God, where the elect angels [the Watchers] dwell, and intercede for men from, and where Enoch longed to go to and was granted. The next part of that passage is the same scene in heaven which John reported, only Enoch saw it pre-incarnation and John saw it post resurrection and ascension.
One cannot understand Revelation without reading and understanding 1 Enoch, for Revelation is the "finish" of the things Enoch saw "from the beginning", when Enoch was taken to heaven and saw the Son of Man there, hidden, with God, and who was God, and who was to come, die, make an end of sin, descend to Sheol; rise, take the righteous from Sheol, ascend, and sit on the throne of Glory and return to earth to reign gloriously in the seventh Day of earth, before He regenerated the heavens and earth for the new creation.

After Enoch saw the City of God where the elect angels "watch" from, over earth, and intercede for men, from, and where the angels that fornicated and got sons of flesh of Adam from daughters of Adam, and were cursed because of, came from, he saw the same scene in heaven which John saw, as I said...
and Enoch and Revelation are two books that must be read together to understand "eschatology" the best, along with the living oracles, of course, which were committed only to the namesake people of the New Man name [Israel[, as Paul also expounds upon, for us.

[Chapter 40]
1 And after that I saw thousands of thousands and ten thousand times ten thousand, I saw a multitude 2 beyond number and reckoning, who stood before the Lord of Spirits. And on the four sides of the Lord of Spirits I saw four presences, different from those that sleep not, and I learnt their names: for the angel that went with me made known to me their names, and showed me all the hidden things. 3 And I heard the voices of those four presences as they uttered praises before the Lord of glory. 4,5 The first voice blesses the Lord of Spirits for ever and ever. And the second voice I heard blessing 6 the Elect One and the elect ones who hang upon the Lord of Spirits. And the third voice I heard pray and intercede for those who dwell on the earth and supplicate in the name of the Lord of Spirits. 7 And I heard the fourth voice fending off the Satans and forbidding them to come before the Lord 8 of Spirits to accuse them who dwell on the earth. After that I asked the angel of peace who went with me, who showed me everything that is hidden: 'Who are these four presences which I have 9 seen and whose words I have heard and written down?' And he said to me: 'This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering: and the second, who is set over all the diseases and all the wounds of the children of men, is Raphael: and the third, who is set over all the powers, is Gabriel: and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel.' 10 And these are the four angels of the Lord of Spirits and the four voices I heard in those days.

Men who deny the role of the angelic Watchers are biblicaly illiterate, besides being ignorant of the revelations of 1 Enoch which God gave us through Enoch to teach us these things, by.

Dan 4:13 "I saw in the visions of my head while on my bed, and there was a watcher, a holy one, coming down from heaven.
Dan 4:14 He cried aloud and said thus:

'Chop down the tree and cut off its branches,
Strip off its leaves and scatter its fruit.
Let the beasts get out from under it,
And the birds from its branches.
Dan 4:15 Nevertheless leave the stump and roots in the earth,
Bound with a band of iron and bronze,
In the tender grass of the field.
Let it be wet with the dew of heaven,
And let him graze with the beasts
On the grass of the earth.
Dan 4:16 Let his heart be changed from that of a man,
Let him be given the heart of a beast,
And let seven times[fn1] pass over him.

Dan 4:17 'This decision is by the decree of the watchers,
And the sentence by the word of the holy ones,
In order that the living may know
That the Most High rules in the kingdom of men,
Gives it to whomever He will,
And sets over it the lowest of men.'

Dan 4:23 And inasmuch as the king saw a watcher, a holy one, coming down from heaven and saying, 'Chop down the tree and destroy it, but leave its stump and roots in the earth, bound with a band of iron and bronze in the tender grass of the field; let it be wet with the dew of heaven, and let him graze with the beasts of the field, till seven times pass over him';
Dan 4:24 this is the interpretation, O king, and this is the decree of the Most High, which has come upon my lord the king:
Dan 4:25 They shall drive you from men, your dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field, and they shall make you eat grass like oxen. They shall wet you with the dew of heaven, and seven times shall pass over you, till you know that the Most High rules in the kingdom of men, and gives it to whomever He chooses.
Dan 4:26 And inasmuch as they gave the command to leave the stump and roots of the tree, your kingdom shall be assured to you, after you come to know that Heaven rules.
Dan 4:27 Therefore, O king, let my advice be acceptable to you; break off your sins by being righteous, and your iniquities by showing mercy to the poor. Perhaps there may be a lengthening of your prosperity."

Dan 4:28 All this came upon King Nebuchadnezzar.
Dan 4:29 At the end of the twelve months he was walking about the royal palace of Babylon.
Dan 4:30 The king spoke, saying, "Is not this great Babylon, that I have built for a royal dwelling by my mighty power and for the honor of my majesty?"
Dan 4:31 While the word was still in the king's mouth, a voice fell from heaven: "King Nebuchadnezzar, to you it is spoken: the kingdom has departed from you!
Dan 4:32 And they shall drive you from men, and your dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field. They shall make you eat grass like oxen; and seven times shall pass over you, until you know that the Most High rules in the kingdom of men, and gives it to whomever He chooses."

Watchers are chief angels, set over men, who intercede for men, and who dwell in Zion of the heavenlies, and there are 24 elders, ancients of them who are seen enthroned in Rev.
Seven of them stand before the God of the whole earth [God the Word, who is come in flesh], and one of them is over them all, Michael, the chief angel of the chief angels.

"This is by the decree of the Watchers", says Daniel, and "this is the decree of the Most High", says Daniel; for the Watchers rule over the world of men for the Most High God. They are the "Holy Ones" who do His will, and of them there are seven holy ones standing before God in His temple in heaven, and one of them is Chief of them all, standing before God, the Word, in His temple.

Then, in Enoch and in Rev, there are four who also bear the same names as four of the seven chief angels, and they are dreadful creatures of great power and glory, called "living creatures" and "beasts".

 

[Standing Up]

sorry
so wrong in your thinking

rev 5:11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

NASB: Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders; and the number of them was myriads of myriads, and thousands of thousands,
RSV: Then I looked, and I heard around the throne and the living creatures and the elders the voice of many angels, numbering myriads of myriads and thousands of thousands,

How many beasts (living creatures) previously introduced? four Rev. 5:8
How many elders previously introduced? twenty four Rev. 5:8
How many angels now introduced? myriads and thousands Rev. 5:11

Heb. But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels,

 

[Standing Up]

No, what Moses patterned on earth was after the heavenly things.

The Watchers, who are "chiefs" are those angels of whom the seven stand before the God of the whole earth, and they are the "ancients" who dwell in Zion of the heavenlies and who intercede for men, and before whom the LORD Jesus reigns gloriously.

-snip-

Like I said in the OP, there's numerous views out there.

You say, the Watchers number seven ....

This thread is about the 24 elders.

Like I said, there's lots of views out there.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Like I said in the OP, there's numerous views out there.

You say, the Watchers number seven ....

This thread is about the 24 elders.

Like I said, there's lots of views out there.

Apparently you did not read my replies at all, for no place did I say the "Watchers" numbered seven, only. That is totally fralsw of you to claim I said, and does show a complete lack of reading of the replies which answer you.


Please read my replies to your post, first, and then comment, with respect to the reply, which reply -and replies- use the written Word to answer your opinions.

In short, the Word does not leave us in the dark about the elders of Zion, in heaven.
Enoch saw them, and there are thousands and thousands and thousands of them, as Enoch reported and as John also saw.

 

[Standing Up]

Apparently you did not read my replies at all, for no place did I say the "Watchers" numbered seven, only. That is totally fralsw of you to claim I said, and does show a complete lack of reading of the replies which answer you.


Please read my replies to your post, first, and then comment, with respect to the reply, which reply -and replies- use the written Word to answer your opinions.

In short, the Word does not leave us in the dark about the elders of Zion, in heaven.
Enoch saw them, and there are thousands and thousands and thousands of them, as Enoch reported and as John also saw.

Okay, see my reply post #25 to address the assumption that 24 elders are the same as thousands of angels.

The Word is clear. Jesus Christ came in the flesh did He not?

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Okay, see my reply post #25 to address the assumption that 24 elders are the same as thousands of angels.

The Word is clear. Jesus Christ came in the flesh did He not?

You did not read my posts -are ye daft???
I did not say the 24 elders are the "same" -meaning equaling- the 24 elders.
Please read my replies from the beginning before making comments that do not apply to what I have said and stating that I say things I have not said.
This is a discussion forum, and if you want to discuss, read the replies made to you instead of making statements that are not true, about replies that you have not read.

I used ample Scripture to show the 24 elders are Watchers, and that there are thousands and thousands of Watchers. The seven archangels -chief angels- are Watchers, also, as the Word states.

"Jesus Christ is come", present tense, "in flesh of second human being creation", states the Word of God -so?

 

[Standing Up]

You did not read my posts -are ye daft???
I did not say the 24 elders are the "same" -meaning equaling- the 24 elders.
-snip-

I used ample Scripture to show the 24 elders are Watchers, and that there are thousands and thousands of Watchers. The seven archangels -chief angels- are Watchers, also, as the Word states.

"Jesus Christ is come", present tense, "in flesh of second human being creation", states the Word of God -so?

Okay, you say the 24 elders are Watchers, there are 1000s and 1000s of Watchers. The seven archangels are Watchers.

This thread is about the 24 elders.

What is "in flesh of second human being creation"?

 

[zeke37]

Okay, you say the 24 elders are Watchers, there are 1000s and 1000s of Watchers. The seven archangels are Watchers.

This thread is about the 24 elders.

What is "in flesh of second human being creation"?

you're opening a can of worms friend...

some here are deep in their beliefs...right or wrong...but real deep. this one puts faith in a book of Enoch...a book while in part may contain truth, most of cannot be cooberated.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Okay, you say the 24 elders are Watchers, there are 1000s and 1000s of Watchers. The seven archangels are Watchers.

This thread is about the 24 elders.

What is "in flesh of second human being creation"?

And my replies to you if you will read them, show that the 24 elders are Watchers, themselves, but you will have to go read the posts I made to understand what I said, the authority for saying it -the revelation of the Word of God- and why you are in error, according to the revelation of the Word of God.

The body prepared for YHWH the Word to come in flesh in, is the second creation human being body of flesh. His body of flesh which He donned as one dons a garment, at the incarnation, as Isaiah 59 shows, is the only created human being flesh Kinsman to Adam which is created. He put it on when He stripped Himself of the Glory and came in that flesh, which flesh was prepared in the womb of the virgin for His incarnation, so as to be the legal Kinsman/Redeemer of Adam and of the kingdom Adam sold.

The first man [human being], Adam, is of the earth -an earthling. The second Man [human being] is the LORD =YHWH- from heaven, as YHWH 59 shows and as Rev 19 also speaks of, when it shows that He is returning in that same body =garment, in which He was baptized in blood =immersed in death, in, rose in, ascended in, and is glorified in, and is seated on the Throne of Glory in the heavenlies, in.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

you're opening a can of worms friend...

some here are deep in their beliefs...right or wrong...but real deep. this one puts faith in a book of Enoch...a book while in part may contain truth, most of cannot be cooberated.

Jesus confirmed it, David confirmed it, Paul, James, Jude, Peter, Tertullien, Barnabas, and many, many more, confirmed it.

And the belief that the 24 elders as presented in the OP is not confirmed in the Word of God, but you thought it tickled the ear, though it is not in the Word!

You like doctrines which are not found in the Word of God, as you have proved in the past, and I use the Word of God for all that I write of; so bring on the battle, my friend, and let us see what is confirmed and what is not confirmed, by using the same authority Jesus used for His own Gospel of the Son of Man in heaven, who was from the beginning and who was with God and who was hidden, and who was to come, and who is come...

 

[Standing Up]

And my replies to you if you will read them, show that the 24 elders are Watchers, themselves,-snip-

and you said, "the elect angels [the Watchers] "

Michael is the Chief of them. Is that also Jesus or Christ?

 

[zeke37]

this one puts faith in a book of Enoch(one of many)...a book while in part may contain truth, most of cannot be cooberated.

knowing which book of enoch you follow might be helpful...


ps. I do think SOME of the details can be cooberated, but certainly not all..

 

[yeshuasavedme]

and you said, "the elect angels [the Watchers] "

Michael is the Chief of them. Is that also Jesus or Christ?

There are two called Michael in heaven, as Enoch shows.
Both are angelic creatures. One is the chief/arch of the chief/arch Watchers, as Enoch shows.
So you are into Ellen White? She's wrong, you know, biblically.

Jesus Christ is God the Word, to whom Michael answers and whom Michael stands before, in heaven, as one of the seven chief Watchers.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

knowing which book of enoch you follow might be helpful...


ps. I do think SOME of the details can be cooberated, but certainly not all..

I have always stated exactly that I read and believe and have tested the Book of 1 Enoch/ Enoch 1, which is also called the Ethiopian Enoch because the Ethiopian Orthodox Church kept it in its canon/list for the entire history of the NT Church among them in Ethiopia, for they never followed Rome nor accepted the 'lists' of Rome, being autonomous.
All the details of 1 Enoch are true, and Enoch speaks of "eschatology" before the flood, telling all things that will be because he saw them in the tablets of heaven and was given the revelations of the things to come and wrote them for all the generations of the world.
He saw the second consumation of sin on earth by the tribulation, and the first by the flood. He saw the rapture before the tribulation, and the Sabbath reign of Peace of the Son of Man, and the City of God in heaven, and all things which are foundations for all OT and NT doctrines.

 

[Standing Up]

There are two called Michael in heaven, as Enoch shows.
Both are angelic creatures. One is the chief/arch of the chief/arch Watchers, as Enoch shows.
So you are into Ellen White? She's wrong, you know, biblically.

Jesus Christ is God the Word, to whom Michael answers and whom Michael stands before, in heaven, as one of the seven chief Watchers.

Ahh.

Well, we're coming to it then, as I was thought.

No to answer your question. Like I said, lots of theories out there.

 

[zeke37]

He saw the rapture before the tribulation

well, that's all I needed to know about it then...thanks.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

well, that's all I needed to know about it then...thanks.

Don't worry, he also saw those who had not repented before the tribulation and who did not get glorified at the change before the tribulation, who then did repent and were saved by the compassion of the LORD of Glory, but they got no glory.
Enoch is written specifically for those who will be living in that day, when all the wicked and godless are to be removed by that great day of His wrath in the tribulation.
And Enoch tells about it before Jesus confirms it, and before John saw the things in heaven post ascension that Enoch saw pre-incarnation.

Enoch tells about the nations who gather against the Holy City and about their defeat long before John saw the things about that day which complement Enoch's revelations.

Anyone who attempts eschatology without the book written first, by Enoch, about the end of all things and the regeneration of the heavens and the earth, is without understanding, for the hiding of the Wisdom of God on these things which Enoch wrote for the world before the flood of Noah, even, which he also foretold.