Indelible Mark? Help!!!!!

[babychrist]

Can anyone tell me what exactly an 'indelible mark' is? I know it last forever (at least in this lifetime), I'm assuming it's a grace...but beyond that I'm completely stumped.

If it's a grace, what 'category' does it fall under? e.g. 'habitual grace', 'actual grace'...?

Also, how can someone loose saving grace and still have this (ie, indelible mark) grace?

...I'm driving myself crazy trying to figure this out!

 

[Eucharisted]

It is the circumcision of the heart and the Name of God on the soul, just as circumcision is the indelible mark of a Jew and the Name of God is on the forehead of the Jewish High Priest.

 

[babychrist]

It is the circumcision of the heart and the Name of God on the soul, just as circumcision is the indelible mark of a Jew and the Name of God is on the forehead of the Jewish High Priest.

But isn't circumcision of the heart a morality thing? If someone falls from sanctifying grace, how are their hearts still circumcised?

Thanks for trying to help me figure this out. It's nice to have someone to talk to about this stuff.

BC

 

[Eucharisted]

But isn't circumcision of the heart a morality thing? If someone falls from sanctifying grace, how are their hearts still circumcised?

Thanks for trying to help me figure this out. It's nice to have someone to talk to about this stuff.

BC

Indelible doesn't mean the mark can't be dirtied by sin.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

what is indelible? baptism? priesthood?

 

[benedictaoo]

Both Monica.

Its a change the takes place in the soul, going from one way to another way.

Priest have this mark of change who is able to turn bread and wine into Christ- who is able to forgive sins, even if he is laicized or what ever. He will always be a priest- ie, have this ability to absolve and offer the sacrifice of the Mass for ever. Like the OT priest would act on behalf of God, on behalf of the ppl.

If he was laicized and then went back to ministry- he would not need a second ordination. Just like we do not need another baptism when ever we sin and break our relationship with God. Not that a laicized priest broke a relationship with God, just that he is no longer in ministry and agrees he will not perform these facilities with out permission, save an emergency.

So, its taking on in a very limited way certain aspects of Christ Himself.

No, that does not make the priest Christ in any way. Just that only in these areas he acts in Christ's person, IOW, when he does these two, he is Christ doing them, ie offering Mass, forgiving you.

A baptized person literally is born again. The second birth is going from Adam's seed of being born cut off from God devoid of any sanctifying grace and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, to being born of Christ's seed of being adopted by God, given sanctifying grace and the gift of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Needing_Grace]

what is indelible? baptism? priesthood?

Actually, there are three Sacraments that leave an indelible mark. The way I see it, an indelible mark is a characteristic or, kind of a "brand," on a person's soul that can only be applied once.

The first is Baptism. At baptism, all sins, Original, mortal and venial are forgiven, one is born into the family of God, becomes an adopted child of God and is infused with the very life of the Holy Trinity Himself (which is Sanctifying Grace). A person who dies immediately after baptism goes straight to heaven, no purgatory. One can lose Sanctifying Grace through mortal sin and we all know that one doesn't get baptized again (which would be a sacrilege), we go to Confession. (Compendium of the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Question 263, 299, 310)

The second is Confirmation. The best description I've heard to describe what happens at Confession is "Pentecost for the Soul." At Confirmation, one is given an increase in the graces of Baptism as well as "a special outpouring of the Holy Spirit like that of Pentecost." (Compendium 268)

The third is Holy Orders. As others have said, once a priest, always a priest. (Compendium 335)

Matrimony does something similar by creating a perpetual bond between the man and wife. (Compendium 346)