Baptism of the Holy Ghost

[retired firefighter]

are Pentecostal Churches today teaching Baptism of the Holy Spirit, do we see gifts of the Holy Spirit evident in todays Church ?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

are Pentecostal Churches today teaching Baptism of the Holy Spirit, do we see gifts of the Holy Spirit evident in todays Church ?

Gifts or fruits? The priority should be to teach about the Holy Spirit Baptism. It could be clouded though by flesh driven musicians or money oriented leadership.
That being said....
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

 

[retired firefighter]

Gifts or fruits? The priority should be to teach about the Holy Spirit Baptism. It could be clouded though by flesh driven musicians or money oriented leadership.
That being said....
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

i believe you missed my question , are churches teaching about the Holy Spirit Baptism ?

 

[Maria Billingsley]

i believe you missed my question , are churches teaching about the Holy Spirit Baptism ?

For sure all Pentecostal congregations . Not sure about others.

 

[Hermeneutico]

are Pentecostal Churches today teaching Baptism of the Holy Spirit, do we see gifts of the Holy Spirit evident in todays Church ?

Hello brother,

Years ago, I was a part of the AOG (late 70s, early 80s), and they were still entirely Pentecostal in practice. The last few times I visited an AOG church, although they officially ascribe to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in their doctrines, it reminded me of visiting a basic Baptist church.

I consider myself a new breed of Classical Pentecostal.

 

[retired firefighter]

Hello brother,

Years ago, I was a part of the AOG (late 70s, early 80s), and they were still entirely Pentecostal in practice. The last few times I visited an AOG church, although they officially ascribe to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in their doctrines, it reminded me of visiting a basic Baptist church.

I consider myself a new breed of Classical Pentecostal.

sorry to say i find that the AOG has become more of an entertainment venue ,and less an Pentecostal church

 

[retired firefighter]

For sure all Pentecostal congregations . Not sure about others.

that's interesting ,as far as AOG churches i find the opposite

 

[retired firefighter]

Hello brother,

Years ago, I was a part of the AOG (late 70s, early 80s), and they were still entirely Pentecostal in practice. The last few times I visited an AOG church, although they officially ascribe to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in their doctrines, it reminded me of visiting a basic Baptist church.

I consider myself a new breed of Classical Pentecostal.

i agree

 

[retired firefighter]

i agree

Please describe a new breed of Pentecostal

 

[Blade]

are Pentecostal Churches today teaching Baptism of the Holy Spirit, do we see gifts of the Holy Spirit evident in todays Church ?

There are allot of them I cannot speak for all but from what I do know yes praise GOD! What a great question! Once we get out of the USA we find more and more of the gifts flowing since they simply believe. Hard for the holy Spirit when there is much doubt

 

[retired firefighter]

There are allot of them I cannot speak for all but from what I do know yes praise GOD! What a great question! Once we get out of the USA we find more and more of the gifts flowing since they simply believe. Hard for the holy Spirit when there is much doubt

why have US churches gotten away from salvation, baptism in water then baptism of the Holy Ghost ?

 

[Hermeneutico]

Please describe a new breed of Pentecostal

I coined "Orthodox-Pentecostal" to represent a particular "kind" or "breed" of Classical Pentecostal. It is also termed the Pentecostal Convergence Movement. There are two key passages that, when linked, explain some of the underpinnings for the entire Convergence Movement.

1) "Therefore, every teacher of the law who has been instructed about the kingdom of heaven is like the owner of a house who brings out of his storeroom new treasures as well as old." - Mat. 13:52

2) “I do not ask for these only, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me. The glory that you have given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, I in them and you in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that you sent me and loved them even as you loved me.” – John 17:20-23.

It is a movement of a fresh converging of various streams throughout the worldwide Church, offering treasures of new and treasures of old. It recognizes that His Church did not begin a few weeks ago, nor even a few hundred years ago. It was established by Christ two thousand years ago. Yet, Christ is still building His Church, and He does not lie. Both the ancient and modern Church have valuable insights to contribute to the larger body of Christ that needs to be appreciated while maintaining traditional morals. Some see the convergence movement as an answer to the prayer of Christ for unity being answered. As Boosahda and Sly explain,

…this emerging movement appears to many, both observers and participants, to be another contemporary evidence of God's continuing activity in history to renew, replenish and unify His people in one heart and purpose in Christ. Arising out of a common desire and hunger to experience the fullness of Christian worship and spirituality, the Convergence Movement seeks to blend or merge the essential elements in the Christian faith represented historically in three major streams of thought and practice: the Charismatic, Evangelical/Reformed and Liturgical/ Sacramental. An increasing number of local congregations and leaders from many backgrounds are finding "treasures old and new" in the spiritual heritage of the church universal.

One thing should be assumed – the prayers of Christ are always answered. No one can question that Jesus definitively prays by the will of the Father. Could this convergence be a part of that plan?

Although I have begun writing a lengthy article on "Orthodox-Pentecostalism," in essence, it is the converging three streams:

1. Classic Pentecostal theology surrounding the core understanding and need for Baptism with the Holy Spirit, gifts of the Spirit, and the five-fold ministry.
2. Evangelical theology surrounding the core need for evangelism and the priesthood of all believers.
3. Sacramental theology surrounding the biblical importance of the Lord's Supper-Real Presence, apostolic succession, and a lite-modified liturgy.

Much more could be said, but this is the basics.

 

[retired firefighter]

I coined "Orthodox-Pentecostal" to represent a particular "kind" or "breed" of Classical Pentecostal. It is also termed the Pentecostal Convergence Movement. There are two key passages that, when linked, explain some of the underpinnings for the entire Convergence Movement.



It is a movement of a fresh converging of various streams throughout the worldwide Church, offering treasures of new and treasures of old. It recognizes that His Church did not begin a few weeks ago, nor even a few hundred years ago. It was established by Christ two thousand years ago. Yet, Christ is still building His Church, and He does not lie. Both the ancient and modern Church have valuable insights to contribute to the larger body of Christ that needs to be appreciated while maintaining traditional morals. Some see the convergence movement as an answer to the prayer of Christ for unity being answered. As Boosahda and Sly explain,



One thing should be assumed – the prayers of Christ are always answered. No one can question that Jesus definitively prays by the will of the Father. Could this convergence be a part of that plan?

Although I have begun writing a lengthy article on "Orthodox-Pentecostalism," in essence, it is the converging three streams:

1. Classic Pentecostal theology surrounding the core understanding and need for Baptism with the Holy Spirit, gifts of the Spirit, and the five-fold ministry.
2. Evangelical theology surrounding the core need for evangelism and the priesthood of all believers.
3. Sacramental theology surrounding the biblical importance of the Lord's Supper-Real Presence, apostolic succession, and a lite-modified liturgy.

Much more could be said, but this is the basics.

let me ask this do you attend AOG or another Pentecostal church ? here in this part of Oklahoma we have several different Pentecostal churches, the most adhere to the old ministry are Holiness, Aog who have really moderated , some Full Gospel , and non denominal who get some material and have AOG back ground, and Pentecostal Church of God

 

[Hermeneutico]

let me ask this do you attend AOG or another Pentecostal church ? here in this part of Oklahoma we have several different Pentecostal churches, the most adhere to the old ministry are Holiness, Aog who have really moderated , some Full Gospel , and non denominal who get some material and have AOG back ground, and Pentecostal Church of God

I no longer attend any AOG Church. Many God-loving people are in the AOG, but I have gone in another direction. I am in the process of incorporating a unique Pentecostal "Denomination." We have about twenty churches in agreement at this point. After the Secretary of State finalizes the incorporation paperwork, I will invite people who agree with our doctrinal focus to begin home groups or churches worldwide.

 

[retired firefighter]

I no longer attend any AOG Church. Many God-loving people are in the AOG, but I have gone in another direction. I am in the process of incorporating a unique Pentecostal "Denomination." We have about twenty churches in agreement at this point. After the Secretary of State finalizes the incorporation paperwork, I will invite people who agree with our doctrinal focus to begin home groups or churches worldwide.

may i ask which direction are you headed that's different from other Pentecostal churches ?

 

[mourningdove~]

Years ago, I was a part of the AOG (late 70s, early 80s), and they were still entirely Pentecostal in practice. The last few times I visited an AOG church, although they officially ascribe to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in their doctrines, it reminded me of visiting a basic Baptist church.

That was my experience also ... my last few years in the AOG church.
Not much different from a Baptist Church, or any other non-denominational church.

We are truly 'missing it' when we neglect, or ignore, the Holy Spirit and His many gifts ...

 

[Hermeneutico]

may i ask which direction are you headed that's different from other Pentecostal churches ?

1. I embrace apostolic succession. Actual authority was to be passed down through the centuries through the laying on of hands.
2. I teach that the Lord's Supper, according to Scripture, is to be taken weekly and that Scripture should be believed "This is my body. This is my blood." I do not have to explain it, but I do have to believe what Scripture explicitly says.
3. I teach that there are true Apostles today and that Prophet, Evangelist, Pastor, and Teachers are to work in union with them.
4. I teach that salvation is a lifelong process, not a mere event.
5. I teach that we begin our relationship with the Holy Spirit at regeneration. Still, one does not receive the GIft/Indwelling of the Holy Spirit until one receives Him - like Pentecost.
6. I believe in the doctrines of worship surrounding the Tabernacle of David.
7. I do not believe in the modern novel rapture teaching that only began in the 1800s.
8. I believe in Ancestral Sin, not Original Sin.
9. I do not believe tithing is commanded for New Testament believers.
10. I believe that the Lord's Supper includes natural wine. Grape juice was introduced in popular form through Dr. Welsh, which helped sell his new product. It is not Biblical. For 1700 years, EVERY church had real alcoholic wine until Welsh's invention.
11. ALL of the Gifts of the Spirit are to be active and used within the Local Church and beyond.
12. We not only believe in general prophecy from the congregation, but we also believe in moderated personal prophecy for receiving Gifts of the Spirit and direction confirmation by those who are called Prophets. (1 Timothy 4:14-16;1 Timothy 1:18-19; Acts 13:1-4; Acts 21; Romans 1:11).
13. We believe that healing is in the atonement but not fully guaranteed while on this earth.


Those are just a few...

 

[Hermeneutico]

That was my experience also ... my last few years in the AOG church.
Not much different from a Baptist Church, or any other non-denominational church.

We are truly 'missing it' when we neglect, or ignore, the Holy Spirit and His many gifts ...

When I visit an AOC church these days (I am not saying all our like this...), I barely see any tongue speaking, let alone any gift of the Holy Spirit, such as prophecy. It is quite fascinating.

 

[retired firefighter]

we're now attending an non denominational church that's located here in Eastern Okla. their back ground is AOG, the Pastor preached a couple sermons on the fruits of the Holy Ghost they do still call to the alter for praying, healing, ect. they still anoint will oil and practice the laying on of hands , praying in the spirit is evident , but haven't witness the gift of prophecy , but i'm sure i just have not been in there long enough

 

[Hermeneutico]

we're now attending an non denominational church that's located here in Eastern Okla. their back ground is AOG, the Pastor preached a couple sermons on the fruits of the Holy Ghost they do still call to the alter for praying, healing, ect. they still anoint will oil and practice the laying on of hands , praying in the spirit is evident , but haven't witness the gift of prophecy , but i'm sure i just have not been in there long enough

Oh, you just reminded me. We have another distinctive teaching. We not only believe in general prophecy from the congregation, but we also believe in moderated personal prophecy for receiving Gifts of the Spirit and direction confirmation by those who are called Prophets. (1 Timothy 4:14-16;1 Timothy 1:18-19; Acts 13:1-4; Acts 21; Romans 1:11).