Why I keep the Sabbath

[Cribstyl]

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

It looks very much here that righteousness is obedience to the law.

No, that's what you want it to say Aq.

Paul already made it crystal clear in the 3rd chapter, that from now on righteousness apart from the law is being made known (revealed)
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,

This text in Rom 3:21 should help you to know; that the law should not be what's written on our heart.
Again Angel, that text states and proves that change was already written in the law. So, when you quote Matt 5, that not one dot can change from the law and the prophets. If the law does not change God made a mistake.
To comment on the scriptures that you posted. What the law could not do.....should hint to you that God has a new way. It's called the gospel, It's by faith through grace, It's also called life in the spirit. We become subjected to the law of the spirit. That's what the context of Rom 8 calls the law of God.

 

[BobRyan]

Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Rom 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

It looks very much here that righteousness is obedience to the law.

Isn't it "instructive" then that even the majority of pro-sunday scholarship claims that ALL TEN of the TEN commandments are included in the moral law of God binding upon all humanity - including the saints from Eden to this very day? #1

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Cribstyl]

edit..double

 

[Cribstyl]

Originally Posted by BobRyan

Isn't it "instructive" then that even the majority of pro-sunday scholarship claims that ALL TEN of the TEN commandments are included in the moral law of God binding upon all humanity - including the saints from Eden to this very day? #1

in Christ,

Bob​

You're claiming that an all-pro-team Sunday team agrees that the law was given at Eden.

Well let's take a look at the team they're up against? Shall we:

#10 Moses ....... He wrote about the Eden account and claims that noone before the Children of Israel had trecieved the ten commandment. Read Deut 4 account.
Deu 4:7
For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for?
Deu 4:8
And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

Deu 4:13
And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu 4:14
And the LORD commanded me at that time to teach you statutes and judgments, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go over to possess it.
Deu 4:32
¶For ask now of the days that are past, which were before thee, since the day that God created man upon the earth, and ask from the one side of heaven unto the other, whether there hath been any such thing as this great thing is, or hath been heard like it?
Deu 4:33
Did ever people hear the voice of God speaking out of the midst of the fire, as thou hast heard, and live?

 

[Shimshon]

He wrote about the Eden account and claims that noone before the Children of Israel had trecieved the ten commandment. Read Deut 4 account.
Deu 4:7
For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for?
Deu 4:8
And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

Deu 4:13
And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

Correct, none before Moses received 'all THIS law, which was set before you this day'. But we know it's a fact that God gave laws and statutes to Abraham, and a host of others. AND we know it's a fact that God gave Adam laws and commands, and that even before those God sanctified the seventh day as Holy among ALL of creation.

Your argument falls way short here. No other nation was given THAT law as was given THAT day, correct. But this in now way nullifies the holiness of the seventh day.

If you didn't spend so much time trying to negate the ways God gave Yisrael you may just learn that everything God does is on a schedule of 7's. In fact the entire nation of Yisrael and the Torah was defined around seven year periods. The Sabbath was made for Yisrael/man......

I found your proof text here completely lacking, if it was meant to prove that the sabbath was ONLY part of the law given at Sinai. God works in periods of sevens. Messiah's coming is directly related to the seventh day/year pattern. The very pattern speaks of Messiah. And both the sabbath and Messiah represent Yisrael. Without this revelation you are completely misunderstanding God and the One he sent. He IS our shabbat rest. You can not remove the shabbat/Yisrael from Messiah and still have the same witness. Not one apostle removed themselves from the nation of Yisrael and her patterns/laws, and taught non-Jews to do the same. Not one. Why does today's church do this?

 

[bbbbbbb]

[/color]

Correct, none before Moses received 'all THIS law, which was set before you this day'. But we know it's a fact that God gave laws and statutes to Abraham, and a host of others. AND we know it's a fact that God gave Adam laws and commands, and that even before those God sanctified the seventh day as Holy among ALL of creation.

Your argument falls way short here. No other nation was given THAT law as was given THAT day, correct. But this in now way nullifies the holiness of the seventh day.

If you didn't spend so much time trying to negate the ways God gave Yisrael you may just learn that everything God does is on a schedule of 7's. In fact the entire nation of Yisrael and the Torah was defined around seven year periods. The Sabbath was made for Yisrael/man......

I found your proof text here completely lacking, if it was meant to prove that the sabbath was ONLY part of the law given at Sinai. God works in periods of sevens. Messiah's coming is directly related to the seventh day/year pattern. The very pattern speaks of Messiah. And both the sabbath and Messiah represent Yisrael. Without this revelation you are completely misunderstanding God and the One he sent. He IS our shabbat rest. You can not remove the shabbat/Yisrael from Messiah and still have the same witness. Not one apostle removed themselves from the nation of Yisrael and her patterns/laws, and taught non-Jews to do the same. Not one. Why does today's church do this?

"a schedule of 7's" - that helps explain my siggy - bbbbbbb

 

[Cribstyl]

[/color]

Correct, none before Moses received 'all THIS law, which was set before you this day'. But we know it's a fact that God gave laws and statutes to Abraham, and a host of others.

Not in any disrespective tone, but you are getting some push back from me on these issues. You present no scripture to say what laws and statutes that Abraham had, but your implication is that he had the ten.com seem obvious.

Reading Genesis account indicates circumcision was given to Abraham as a law for all the people because it's written. It is logical to distinguish a commandment to sacrifice your son from a law which commands all people within limits. We read about what God commanded Abraham.

I presented Moses as my first star player, quoting from Deut 4 saying that the ten commandments are the words of the covenant.Deu 4:13
And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
I now post Duet 5 showing that Abraham had a different covenant and not the 10 commandments, my argument are proven by scriptures that Abraham did not have the ten.Deu 5:3
The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.

AND we know it's a fact that God gave Adam laws and commands, and that even before those God sanctified the seventh day as Holy among ALL of creation.

Your argument falls way short here. No other nation was given THAT law as was given THAT day, correct. But this in now way nullifies the holiness of the seventh day.

Dude, my debate with BobRyan is about the law at Eden. Dont drag me into into your emotional drama and confusion when my words were few and calculated.

If you didn't spend so much time trying to negate the ways God gave Yisrael you may just learn that everything God does is on a schedule of 7's. In fact the entire nation of Yisrael and the Torah was defined around seven year periods. The Sabbath was made for Yisrael/man......

WHat??? My argument has always been that God gave Sabbath and the law to Israel. Thanks for clarifying that the Sabbath was made for Israel... I did asked you earlier and thought you'd never admit it .
Sheeze... I did'nt even have to waterboard you.

I found your proof text here completely lacking, if it was meant to prove that the sabbath was ONLY part of the law given at Sinai. God works in periods of sevens. Messiah's coming is directly related to the seventh day/year pattern. The very pattern speaks of Messiah. And both the sabbath and Messiah represent Yisrael. Without this revelation you are completely misunderstanding God and the One he sent. He IS our shabbat rest. You can not remove the shabbat/Yisrael from Messiah and still have the same witness. Not one apostle removed themselves from the nation of Yisrael and her patterns/laws, and taught non-Jews to do the same. Not one. Why does today's church do this?

The scirptures says what I believe. What you want us to believe about Abraham and Adam contradicts sciptures that sez....... The law came by Moses.
Thanks but no thanks.

 

[Angelquill]

Crib, Sweetie...
The Ten Commandments were originally given to Israel, that is true.
It is also true that the New Covenant was originally promised to Israel.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

So, if you insist on claiming no part of the one, then you also have no part of the other.

 

[Cribstyl]

Crib, Sweetie...
The Ten Commandments were originally given to Israel, that is true.
It is also true that the New Covenant was originally promised to Israel.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

So, if you insist on claiming no part of the one, then you also have no part of the other.

I think you're making the point that the old covenant and the new covenant was given to the same people? Have your son ever bought you a ticket to Ophrah and you got a new car? Who's car is it?
My point is; Yes, God's gospel to save the world came through a promise to one nation. That's why, it's to the Jews first and secondly to the Gentile. Jesus came unto His own nation and they recieved Him not.

Well you should know that the everlasting covenant was the promise given to Abraham. The law was a covenant given 430yrs after that. The law came because the people with the promise sinned bytempting God after their freedom. So the law was a schoolmaster to keep them in pruned until the promise came. When the promise came were blind and rejected the promise..................So when God promise a new covenant it was to obtain the promise.......... I thought you knew the story. If you studied what God's covenent entails, you would know which one you're not under as a Gentile Christian....... Clue: Paul tells you that you were were strangers to the one given to the fathers. But the one given to Abraham can be claimed only by those with faith....... by the way Good luck with the law.

 

[Angelquill]

I find it absolutely fascinating how folks who want to holler about how we're "not under the law" never promote breaking even one of the rest of the Ten Commandments?

Crib, what about you? Do you, yourself, or do you advise anyone else to:

1. Worship any other gods besides our God?
2. Create idols or worship them?
3. Take the name of the Lord in vain?
________________________________
5. Dishonor their Mom and Dad?
6. Commit adultery?
7. Murder?
8. Steal?
9. Lie or gossip about other folks?
10. Drool over stuff that doesn't belong to you?

I will be very interested in hearing your answer, since I've asked this many times, and it always gets ignored...

 

[Ubuntu]

@Cribstyl

Gen 2:1
¶Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. Gen 2:2
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

What we should apply to wisdom from Gen 2:1-3 is; All God's works in creating the worlds was finished in 6 days. And God rested on the seventh day from all His work. Your answer in Gen 2:3 reinforces the reason why God blessed and sanctified that day because He had rested.

Truth is, the 14th, 21st, 28th days are not said to be blessed and sanctified because each of the 3 verses claim that God's works was finished is 6days thus he rested from all His work.

(1 point at a time is sufficient to discuss separately . I will respond to the rest of your post later)

So what you're really saying is that God only blessed the first seventh day and that the subsequent seventh days were not holy and blessed... But this idea is clearly refuted in the Sabbath commandment itself:

"For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy." - Exodus 20:11

Now, God himself rested on the seventh day, but here the day he blessed is called the Sabbath day, not one single seventh day. The Sabbath day is per definition a reoccurring day in a weekly 7 day cycle, so what you suggest is impossible.

 

[Angelquill]

I can't believe Crib would say something that lame. That sounds more like another member of the Lawless Ones...

 

[Cribstyl]

@Cribstyl



So what you're really saying is that God only blessed the first seventh day and that the subsequent seventh days were not holy and blessed... But this idea is clearly refuted in the Sabbath commandment itself:

"For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy." - Exodus 20:11

Now, God himself rested on the seventh day, but here the day he blessed is called the Sabbath day, not one single seventh day. The Sabbath day is per definition a reoccurring day in a weekly 7 day cycle, so what you suggest is impossible.

Not saying that. God also blessed the Sabbath Day. God's 7th day rest and the Sabbath are two different issues. The sabbath is a sign of God's rest.
Look again at verse 11. Contrary to commentary, every word of this text is a focus on acts taken by the creator, not one word about acts taken by man. This is a 2 part sentence, seperated by the word "therefore" which means "this is why".
Part 1a of the sentence tells us about 6 unrepeatable days. "For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them,
There is no question or doubt in Genesis 1 and this text reenforces 6 days of days work? Why would God go back to working and resting if He's finish?
Part1b says and he rested on the seventh day: It is a significant fact that God's day of rest did not end with morning and evening as stated about the first 6 days. It's appear as secret to some that; scriptures teach us that God's rest is the place that Christian are to enter. God's rest is His blessed and santified, never ending presence.
My point is: "The seventh day" is blessed and sanctifed because it's the place of God's rest. It cannot be defiled by man. It was made for God.

therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy."

This is why the Sabbath is a 24hr day of rest, blessed and sanctified by God, often defiled by man, it's a sign between God and the children of Israel, Need I say more?

So again to answer you question again: The sabbath is bless and sanctified but some put it on a high pedestal than God ever did.

Another star on my all star team in my point Gaurd #7 Jesus He made it clear that Moses commanded the Children of Israel to circumcise on the 8th day if it lands on the Sabbath day. His point was Sabbath did not have presidence over circumcision, because circumcision was passed down from the fathers. (kills that creation sabbath tale)

 

[Cribstyl]

I can't believe Crib would say something that lame. That sounds more like another member of the Lawless Ones...

I cant believe I said that either. Make sure you have truth before your bash your friends
Funny thing, is what you just posted in the covenant thread about loving one another. #6

 

[Angelquill]

Darling, that was me defending you....hardly bashing you.
However, if I was wrong, and you did say that, then I apologize most profusely.

Tone and expression don't come over too well when all you can see is a line of type, I guess.

 

[Cribstyl]

Darling, that was me defending you....hardly bashing you.
However, if I was wrong, and you did say that, then I apologize most profusely.

Tone and expression don't come over too well when all you can see is a line of type, I guess.

What a pal

 

[Angelquill]

What a pal

But you know I love ya, ya big lug!

 

[Cribstyl]

But you know I love ya, ya big lug!

shucks

 

[Angelquill]

What a pal
Originally Posted by Angelquill

But you know I love ya, ya big lug!​

shucks


Yeah, we get pretty silly in here sometimes.
Everyone knows that God tied the fourth commandment back to the beginning...and everyone knows that Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man.
The Sabbath was never meant to be a burden...it was meant to be a gift...

 

[mercy1061]

No, that's what you want it to say Aq.

Paul already made it crystal clear in the 3rd chapter, that from now on righteousness apart from the law is being made known (revealed)
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,

This righteousness has two or three witnessess, what is the purpose for having witnesses? Do men not have "two or three witnesses" to confirm his testimony for the people? You want to establish righteousness and murder the witnesses, the "the Law and the Prophets". This is why the old testament prophets were persecuted, the prophets preached the holy law to the people.

This text in Rom 3:21 should help you to know; that the law should not be what's written on our heart.

Were there any laws in Eden? What about the forbidden tree? Sin is the violation of the law.

Gen 4:7
If you are doing what is good, shouldn’t you hold your head high? And if you don’t do what is good, sin is crouching at the door — it wants you, but you can rule over it.”

Adam and Eve knew the difference between right and wrong. The law teaches us the difference between right and wrong.

Gen 3
22 Adonai, God, said, “See, the man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil. Now, to prevent his putting out his hand and taking also from the tree of life, eating, and living forever — ”

Again Angel, that text states and proves that change was already written in the law. So, when you quote Matt 5, that not one dot can change from the law and the prophets. If the law does not change God made a mistake.

To comment on the scriptures that you posted. What the law could not do.....should hint to you that God has a new way. It's called the gospel, It's by faith through grace, It's also called life in the spirit. We become subjected to the law of the spirit. That's what the context of Rom 8 calls the law of God.

Grace and mercy are legal terms.