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The Danger of "Keeping Sabbath."

Mercy Shown

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So the very law given by the pre incarnate Jesus on Sinai was broken by Jesus? He didn't keep His own law? You just keep getting into stranger and stranger positions. The only human being that never sinned broke the 10 commandments, A very weird idea.

You don't believe Jesus is our Savior? How can He be if He is also a sinner?
Do you always make it a habit to tell others what they have said, whether or not they did? This is a strange position. Since the premise of this post is false, what follows is also false. If you address what I posted, I would be glad to respond.

For my life, I can't figure out where you got this from.
 
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Mercy Shown

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@Mercy Shown

Here is more from Paul and Peter.

Romans 12: 1 I BESEECH you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
You are assuming that Sabbath keeping is God's perfect will. God fulfilled the law for us, so is it his will for us to try to fulfill it? Is it his will that we try to redo what Christ has done?

The will of God for us is laid out all through the Bible. In places like 1 Peter 2:15 and 1 Thessalonians 4:3, we won't know what it is unless we have renewed minds. The human mind can and will take the words of scripture and braid whips out of them to beat our brothers and sisters with because we think we have God's truth when, in fact, we have only our own.

Are you under the law or grace? Keeping a day holy is neither bad nor good of itself. Why one keeps it or doesn't is the issue. The same is true with all of the other commands. If I do not kill because I do not want to be punished, there is no merit in that. If I do not commit adultery because I do not want the shame of it, there is no merit in that.

God wiped away all my sins on the cross, not mine only but the sins of the whole world. Nothing can improve on that. There is no motive left to obey other than love.
Philippians 2: 5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

2Peter 1: 3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
Neither of these texts addresses the law. They address the will of God. God wants a willing, submissive, humble heart to mold into the likeness of His son. Keeping commandments to achieve that will always fail. Keeping His commands because we have been saved and renewed has already succeeded before the fact.
 
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Gary K

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You are assuming that Sabbath keeping is God's perfect will. God fulfilled the law for us, so is it his will for us to try to fulfill it? Is it his will that we try to redo what Christ has done?

The will of God for us is laid out all through the Bible. In places like 1 Peter 2:15 and 1 Thessalonians 4:3, we won't know what it is unless we have renewed minds. The human mind can and will take the words of scripture and braid whips out of them to beat our brothers and sisters with because we think we have God's truth when, in fact, we have only our own.

Are you under the law or grace? Keeping a day holy is neither bad nor good of itself. Why one keeps it or doesn't is the issue. The same is true with all of the other commands. If I do not kill because I do not want to be punished, there is no merit in that. If I do not commit adultery because I do not want the shame of it, there is no merit in that.

God wiped away all my sins on the cross, not mine only but the sins of the whole world. Nothing can improve on that. There is no motive left to obey other than love.

Neither of these texts addresses the law. They address the will of God. God wants a willing, submissive, humble heart to mold into the likeness of His son. Keeping commandments to achieve that will always fail. Keeping His commands because we have been saved and renewed has already succeeded before the fact.
Finally something we can agree on. What is a mind conformed to the likeness of Jesus' mind? One that views the law of God as He does. One that hates iniquity.

Hebrews 12: 6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

There is the mind of Jesus.
 
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Mercy Shown

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Finally something we can agree on. What is a mind conformed to the likeness of Jesus' mind? One that views the law of God as He does. One that hates iniquity.

Hebrews 12: 6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

There is the mind of Jesus.
And all of this is imputed by faith to those who believe. PTL
 
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guevaraj

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And all of this is imputed by faith to those who believe. PTL
Brother, the word "faith" in the New Testament is encoded where you need Paul's decoding of the word's ambiguous meaning to not be deceived by those who twist the scriptures, taking advantage of this ambiguous word. Paul cites "believed" using the word translated for "faith" in Greek for Abraham's having "believed" in the original Hebrew, Paul revealing in the Greek New Testament that the word for "faith" in Greek is ambiguous between "faith" and "belief" in Hebrew. Paul uses the word in Greek for "faith" to refer to "believed" in Hebrew, making this Greek word ambiguous for two different Hebrew words. Given Paul's revelation about the use of "faith" in the Greek New Testament to sometimes refer to "belief" instead of "faith", James at the end of the post tells us we are not made right with God by "belief" alone when you understand that the word translated as "faith" is ambiguous for "belief" in the Greek New Testament.
  1. And Abram believed (aman) the LORD, and the LORD counted it to him as righteousness. (Genesis 15:6 NLT fixed)
  2. “Look at the proud! They trust in themselves, and their lives are crooked. But the righteous will live by their faith (emunah). (Habakkuk 2:4 NLT fixed)
The two passages below in Greek quote the two Hebrew passages above using the same word in Greek for two different words in Hebrew. Both words "believed" and "faith" are translated from the same word in Greek when they are different words in Hebrew, deliberately making this Greek word ambiguous for the two different words in Hebrew.
  1. Now, is this blessing (makarios) only for the Jews, or is it also for uncircumcised Gentiles? Well, we have been saying that Abraham, having believed (pistis), was credited as righteousness (noun). (Romans 4:9 NLT fixed)
  2. This Good News tells us how God makes us right in his sight. This is accomplished from start to finish by faith. As the Scriptures say, “It is through faith (pistis) that a righteous person has life.” (Romans 1:17 NLT)
I have corrected the untrue translation of a Greek quote based on the Hebrew because of the use of a deliberately made ambiguous word in Greek. This ambiguous word that translators have used to give a false translation is corrected in the original Hebrew and verified to be false by having contradicted the below passage in James. There exists no "faith" without having done at least one act of God's given works of "righteousness", like circumcision, but only a "belief" which has yet to do at least one act of God's given works of "righteousness", like circumcision, to turn your having "believed" into "faith".

FAITH (noun) = BELIEVED (verb) + RIGHTEOUSNESS (noun)

Except in the beginning of our faith when God credits your having believed as your first act of "righteousness", which completes your faith without having done a single act of God's given regular works of "righteousness", like circumcision in the case of Abraham. In the case of David receiving this blessing again at the beginning of his new faith, it means that all his previous acts of God's given works of "righteousness" were forgotten and David would have died for his sin had God not brought him into a new faith through the prophet Nathan.

“Do you think that I like to see wicked people die? says the Sovereign LORD. Of course not! I want them to turn from their wicked ways and live. However, if righteous (adjective) people turn from their righteousness (noun) and start doing sinful things and act like other sinners, should they be allowed to live? No, of course not! All their righteous acts will be forgotten, and they will die for their sins. (Ezekiel 18:23-26 NLT fixed)​

James does not use the ambiguous word revealed in Romans 4:9, citing Abraham's passage in Hebrew with the word for "belief", confirming that "belief" is not "faith" rather than using the same word for "faith" as in Romans 4:9, again verifying the deliberate use of "faith" as ambiguous for "belief" in the Greek New Testament. Having understood that the word for "faith" in Greek can also mean "belief", because it was revealed to be ambiguous for those two Hebrew words in Romans 4:9, allows us to translate the following passage even more clearly when sometimes it refers to "faith" and other times to "belief".

You say you have faith (pistis), for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror. How foolish! Can’t you see that faith (pistis) without good deeds is inactive? Don’t you remember that our ancestor Abraham was shown to be right with God by his actions when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see, his BELIEF (pistis) and his actions worked together. His actions made his faith (pistis) complete. And so it happened just as the Scriptures say: “Abraham believed (pisteuó) God, and God credited to him as righteousness (noun).” He was even called the friend of God. So you see, we are shown to be right with God by what we do, not by BELIEF (pistis) alone. (James 2:19-24 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Mercy Shown

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Brother, the word "faith" in the New Testament is encoded where you need Paul's decoding of the word's ambiguous meaning to not be deceived by those who twist the scriptures, taking advantage of this ambiguous word. Paul cites "believed" using the word translated for "faith" in Greek for Abraham's having "believed" in the original Hebrew, Paul revealing in the Greek New Testament that the word for "faith" in Greek is ambiguous between "faith" and "belief" in Hebrew. Paul uses the word in Greek for "faith" to refer to "believed" in Hebrew, making this Greek word ambiguous for two different Hebrew words. Given Paul's revelation about the use of "faith" in the Greek New Testament to sometimes refer to "belief" instead of "faith", James at the end of the post tells us we are not made right with God by "belief" alone when you understand that the word translated as "faith" is ambiguous for "belief" in the Greek New Testament.
  1. And Abram believed (aman) the LORD, and the LORD counted it to him as righteousness. (Genesis 15:6 NLT fixed)
  2. “Look at the proud! They trust in themselves, and their lives are crooked. But the righteous will live by their faith (emunah). (Habakkuk 2:4 NLT fixed)
The two passages below in Greek quote the two Hebrew passages above using the same word in Greek for two different words in Hebrew. Both words "believed" and "faith" are translated from the same word in Greek when they are different words in Hebrew, deliberately making this Greek word ambiguous for the two different words in Hebrew.
  1. Now, is this blessing (makarios) only for the Jews, or is it also for uncircumcised Gentiles? Well, we have been saying that Abraham, having believed (pistis), was credited as righteousness (noun). (Romans 4:9 NLT fixed)
  2. This Good News tells us how God makes us right in his sight. This is accomplished from start to finish by faith. As the Scriptures say, “It is through faith (pistis) that a righteous person has life.” (Romans 1:17 NLT)
I have corrected the untrue translation of a Greek quote based on the Hebrew because of the use of a deliberately made ambiguous word in Greek. This ambiguous word that translators have used to give a false translation is corrected in the original Hebrew and verified to be false by having contradicted the below passage in James. There exists no "faith" without having done at least one act of God's given works of "righteousness", like circumcision, but only a "belief" which has yet to do at least one act of God's given works of "righteousness", like circumcision, to turn your having "believed" into "faith".

FAITH (noun) = BELIEVED (verb) + RIGHTEOUSNESS (noun)

Except in the beginning of our faith when God credits your having believed as your first act of "righteousness", which completes your faith without having done a single act of God's given regular works of "righteousness", like circumcision in the case of Abraham. In the case of David receiving this blessing again at the beginning of his new faith, it means that all his previous acts of God's given works of "righteousness" were forgotten and David would have died for his sin had God not brought him into a new faith through the prophet Nathan.

“Do you think that I like to see wicked people die? says the Sovereign LORD. Of course not! I want them to turn from their wicked ways and live. However, if righteous (adjective) people turn from their righteousness (noun) and start doing sinful things and act like other sinners, should they be allowed to live? No, of course not! All their righteous acts will be forgotten, and they will die for their sins. (Ezekiel 18:23-26 NLT fixed)​

James does not use the ambiguous word revealed in Romans 4:9, citing Abraham's passage in Hebrew with the word for "belief", confirming that "belief" is not "faith" rather than using the same word for "faith" as in Romans 4:9, again verifying the deliberate use of "faith" as ambiguous for "belief" in the Greek New Testament. Having understood that the word for "faith" in Greek can also mean "belief", because it was revealed to be ambiguous for those two Hebrew words in Romans 4:9, allows us to translate the following passage even more clearly when sometimes it refers to "faith" and other times to "belief".
So you corrected the Bible? You did something God didn't do. Are you saying that God did not protect His word, so you had to do it? Did God sit on His hands while translators corrupted His word?
You say you have faith (pistis), for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror. How foolish! Can’t you see that faith (pistis) without good deeds is inactive?
It is, but you can not activate it with works. Faith without a change in one's life is not faith. But you can't breathe life into dead faith by your works.
Don’t you remember that our ancestor Abraham was shown to be right with God by his actions when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see, his BELIEF (pistis) and his actions worked together.
No, they did not. His actions came from His faith. They were the fruit of His faith. The proof that His faith was real.
His actions made his faith (pistis) complete.​
No, his actions proved he had faith because he could not and would not have done these works unless he had been saved by faith and lived by faith.
And so it happened just as the Scriptures say: “Abraham believed (pisteuó) God, and God credited to him as righteousness (noun).” He was even called the friend of God. So you see, we are shown to be right with God by what we do, not by BELIEF (pistis) alone. (James 2:19-24 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
Yes, we believe alone, allowing God to become our intimate Father. This opens up an unbelievable love that motivates us to obey because we desire to not for gain or avoidance of punishment. If we do not love first, our obedience is fake, and we don't know it.
 
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guevaraj

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So you corrected the Bible? You did something God didn't do. Are you saying that God did not protect His word, so you had to do it? Did God sit on His hands while translators corrupted His word?
Brother, translators are not guaranteed to be inspired by the Holy Spirit. God guaranties the inspiration of His original word in the original language by the Prophets, but not the many translations into other languages. The correction of the Sabbath from human tradition in the book of Hebrews is a good example where the King James Version (KJV) misidentified "Joshua" before David as "Jesus", forcing the message to seem to refer to the present after Jesus when the original message was about a past mistake in the understanding of the Sabbath by Joshua when they transitioned to a different Sabbath without Manna in the Promised Land. For forty years, when they kept the seventh day with Manna, God tells us in Hebrews that He had punished them not to enter His "day" of rest available since the first week of creation, the Sabbath, which they later entered within the Promised Land at an earlier time than the seventh day of the week. Joshua did not pay any attention to the change from a day of the week from morning to morning, to the evening to evening Sabbath and assumed wrongly that this earlier Sabbath, from evening to evening, was also the seventh day of the week in the Promised Land, overlooking the fact that the days of the week were in the desert from morning to morning for 40 years.

For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. (Hebrews 4:8 KJV)​

The above blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus is later corrected without correcting its forced twisting effect on the rest of the passage.

For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. (Hebrews 4:8 NKJV)​

This blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus hid the true message of the book of Hebrews for generations of readers of the English translation of the scriptures when Jesus wanted us to keep His first week's Sabbath "day" corrected from human tradition since Joshua, where Joshua wrongly thought the Sabbath in Jerusalem was the seventh day of the week when the Sabbath is fixed in the time zone of Eden and falls at a different time in Jerusalem, half a day before the seventh day of the week. The KJV twisted the message of the passage to fit their misidentification that many other translations followed even after the misidentification was corrected, but not corrected was its effect on the rest of the message in the book of Hebrews. Many translations continue the error started by the KJV's misidentification of Joshua as Jesus in Hebrews, chapter 4, when Jesus was not before David to make the "good news" of entering the Sabbath be mistranslated as the "gospel" of Jesus. The wrong translation of "gospel" for the phrase the "good news" of entering the Sabbath has influenced wrongly many other Bible translations after the KJV. The newer NKJV fixes the misidentification of Joshua as Jesus but not its effect on the rest of the passage, like the "gospel" of Jesus (not possible before David), for the phrase, the "good news" of entering the Sabbath, first heard by those that died in the desert.

For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. (Hebrews 4:2 NKJV)​

The blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus changed the below "good news" of entering the Sabbath to the above "gospel" of Jesus, forcing the message to seem to be about the present when it is about a past misunderstanding of the Sabbath. The New Living Translation (NLT) was a complete effort from the original languages which finally corrected this twisting of the scriptures by the KJV that influenced so many other translations.

For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. (Hebrews 4:2 NLT)​

Those, like Joshua, who first heard the "good news", that God had prepared this rest" since the first week of creation, were punished not to enter the Sabbath by an "oath" near the Promised Land with Manna, that Joshua later entered before the seventh day of the week from evening to evening, having been prevented from entering the Sabbath with Manna for 40 years from morning to morning near the Promised Land. In the following Hebrews passage corrected from the blunder of the KJV, "another day" refers to a different day than the one thought for the Sabbath since Joshua: not the seventh day of the week everywhere, but the seventh day of the first week of creation remembered in the time zone of creation half a day before the seventh day in Jerusalem. We do not automatically enter the "day" of rest by accepting the "good news" of entering the Sabbath "announced to us just as it was to them" in the desert, like the KJV mistranslated. What we "can" enter is the "day" of rest in the new covenant "announced to us just as it was to them" by understanding how God prevented Joshua from entering the Sabbath for 40 years in the desert by punishing them by having them keep the seventh day of the week near the Promised Land when the Sabbath is entered earlier than the Seventh day of the week in the Promised Land.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. God announced this through David much later in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Mercy Shown

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God guaranties the inspiration of His original word in the original language by the Prophets, but not the many translations into other languages.
So, if you can't read the original geek, you are out of luck. Sorry, I don't buy that. God cares about His word too much to drop the ball on protecting the translations.
 
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Mercy Shown

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For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. (Hebrews 4:8 KJV)
The above blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus is later corrected without correcting its forced twisting effect on the rest of the passage.

For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. (Hebrews 4:8 NKJV)
My friend. just as Jorge and George are the same name, one in Spanish and the other in English, so are Jesus and Joshua. One is the English name Joshua from the Hebrew Yeshua, and the other is from the Greek translation of Yeshua as Iēsous, from which we get the English Jesus. In other words, Jesus and Joshua are the same name, meaning YHWY is salvation. So, as you can see the KJV was not incorrect. It was just a matter of choosing between the two iterations of the same name.
 
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Mercy Shown

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This blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus hid the true message of the book of Hebrews for generations of readers of the English translation of the scriptures when Jesus wanted us to keep His first week's Sabbath "day" corrected from human tradition since Joshua, where Joshua wrongly thought the Sabbath in Jerusalem was the seventh day of the week when the Sabbath is fixed in the time zone of Eden and falls at a different time in Jerusalem, half a day before the seventh day of the week. The KJV twisted the message of the passage to fit their misidentification that many other translations followed even after the misidentification was corrected, but not corrected was its effect on the rest of the message in the book of Hebrews. Many translations continue the error started by the KJV's misidentification of Joshua as Jesus in Hebrews, chapter 4, when Jesus was not before David to make the "good news" of entering the Sabbath be mistranslated as the "gospel" of Jesus. The wrong translation of "gospel" for the phrase the "good news" of entering the Sabbath has influenced wrongly many other Bible translations after the KJV. The newer NKJV fixes the misidentification of Joshua as Jesus but not its effect on the rest of the passage, like the "gospel" of Jesus (not possible before David), for the phrase, the "good news" of entering the Sabbath, first heard by those that died in the desert.
Since your premise was wrong, this post is wrong. Jesus and Joshua are the same name, only derived from two different languages.
This blunder of misidentifying Joshua as Jesus hid the true message of the book of Hebrews for generations of readers of the English translation of the scriptures when Jesus wanted us to keep His first week's Sabbath "day" corrected from human tradition since Joshua, where Joshua wrongly thought the Sabbath in Jerusalem was the seventh day of the week when the Sabbath is fixed in the time zone of Eden and falls at a different time in Jerusalem, half a day before the seventh day of the week. The KJV twisted the message of the passage to fit their misidentification that many other translations followed even after the misidentification was corrected, but not corrected was its effect on the rest of the message in the book of Hebrews. Many translations continue the error started by the KJV's misidentification of Joshua as Jesus in Hebrews, chapter 4, when Jesus was not before David to make the "good news" of entering the Sabbath be mistranslated as the "gospel" of Jesus. The wrong translation of "gospel" for the phrase the "good news" of entering the Sabbath has influenced wrongly many other Bible translations after the KJV. The newer NKJV fixes the misidentification of Joshua as Jesus but not its effect on the rest of the passage, like the "gospel" of Jesus (not possible before David), for the phrase, the "good news" of entering the Sabbath, first heard by those that died in the desert.

None of this can be backed by scripture. Nowhere does it say Joshua switched the time of the Sabbath. Jesus kept the same Sabbath as Joshua did.
 
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Gary K

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And all of this is imputed by faith to those who believe. PTL
You don't understand scripture as well as you think you do.

1Corinthians 1: 30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Righteousness is translated from the Greek word:

[*StrongsGreek*]
01343
δικαιοσύνη dikaiosýnē, dik-ah-yos-oo'-nay
from 1342;
equity (of character or act); specially (Christian) justification:--righteousness.

There is another form of righteousness that comes from Jesus, sanctification. which is imparted righteousness. That is the changing of our behavior. As both come from Jesus they are inseparable. We can't pick and choose which type of righteousness we want and reject that which we don't want. Bad news for your beliefs.
 
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Are you saying that you keep God’a law which would mean that you are without sin?

So, do you keep it like Jesus did?

So you no longer sin? This appears to be your claim but I’m asking just to clarify it.

I can say with boldness that Jesus saved me from all my sins. Past, present, and future.
That's an outlandish claim.

I give you scripture that disagrees with your beliefs and you claim it teaches sinlessness. This is once again a very strange idea. The entire Bible teaches just the opposite. Your idea that we must sin has been thoroughly debunked by scripture.

Why anyone would want to claim sin has more power than an infinite God is beyond me. Sin came from a created being which makes Lucifer a finite being and sin of finite power and yet you continue making outlandish claims as to the power of sin. Seems to me you love sin more than you love God.
 
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Mercy Shown

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You don't understand scripture as well as you think you do.

1Corinthians 1: 30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Righteousness is translated from the Greek word:

[*StrongsGreek*]
01343
δικαιοσύνη dikaiosýnē, dik-ah-yos-oo'-nay
from 1342;
equity (of character or act); specially (Christian) justification:--righteousness.

There is another form of righteousness that comes from Jesus, sanctification. which is imparted righteousness. That is the changing of our behavior. As both come from Jesus they are inseparable. We can't pick and choose which type of righteousness we want and reject that which we don't want. Bad news for your beliefs.
No, it is great news. My righteousness is Jesus, not myself nor my works. My sanctification is Jesus, not myself or my works. As Paul told the Romans, And those whom He thus foreordained, He also called; and those whom He called, He also justified (acquitted, made righteous, putting them into right standing with Himself). And those whom He justified, He also glorified [raising them to a heavenly dignity and condition or state of being] Romans 8:30 If He is for me, who can be against me. In him, my righteousness exceeds that of the Pharisees.

If God calls me clean, then who can call me unclean? Amen!

It is amazing how many people think you can't get into heaven doing what you want to do. But will you get into heaven doing what you don't want to do? I think there is a relationship dysfunction for those who want to sin but try not to get to heaven. Those who think they can't do what they want and get to heaven need to ask themselves what they want.
 
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Gary K

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No, it is great news. My righteousness is Jesus, not myself nor my works. My sanctification is Jesus, not myself or my works. As Paul told the Romans, And those whom He thus foreordained, He also called; and those whom He called, He also justified (acquitted, made righteous, putting them into right standing with Himself). And those whom He justified, He also glorified [raising them to a heavenly dignity and condition or state of being] Romans 8:30 If He is for me, who can be against me. In him, my righteousness exceeds that of the Pharisees.

If God calls me clean, then who can call me unclean? Amen!

It is amazing how many people think you can't get into heaven doing what you want to do. But will you get into heaven doing what you don't want to do? I think there is a relationship dysfunction for those who want to sin but try not to get to heaven. Those who think they can't do what they want and get to heaven need to ask themselves what they want.
If what you said here is true why do you insist we cannot stop sinning?
 
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Mercy Shown

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That's an outlandish claim.
Heb 10:14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified. Do you merely hum the tune in church when they sing "Blessed Assurance?" This should be good news for you and for everyone.

How many of our sins were laid upon Him?
We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all. Is 53:6
I give you scripture that disagrees with your beliefs and you claim it teaches sinlessness. This is once again a very strange idea. The entire Bible teaches just the opposite. Your idea that we must sin has been thoroughly debunked by scripture.
No, it hasn't. It has been debunked in your imagination but not by scripture. You seem to think that God has a grading system, and if you can manage to get a high enough score, you will make it through the Pearly Gates. What is the standard? 90% and above? How much less than perfect is OK with God?
Why anyone would want to claim sin has more power than an infinite God is beyond me. Sin came from a created being which makes Lucifer a finite being and sin of finite power and yet you continue making outlandish claims as to the power of sin. Seems to me you love sin more than you love God.
You should not teach power over sin when you still sin. I have noticed that you will not declare yourself sinless, yet you lay that burden upon others as if you were sinless. God has eradicated my sins, completely destroyed them, and condemned them in the flesh. Even though I am being sanctified, I am counted as perfect for all time because of Christ's Righteousness. He has eradicated yours also if you will grasp His gift by faith.
 
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Mercy Shown

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If what you said here is true why do you insist we cannot stop sinning?
The difference between a born-again Christian and a sinner is that the born-again Christian knows when he/she sins and hates it, whereas a sinner is unaware of most of their sins and loves them. When we repent, we turn away from sin toward the one we love, but we still have a body of death, and there is still a war in our members. At one time, we loved what we did, but when we are saved sometimes what we want to do we do not do, but what we hate we do. And if we do what we do not want to do, we agree that the law is good. As it is, it is no longer we who do it, but it is sin living in us.
 
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Gary K

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Heb 10:14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified. Do you merely hum the tune in church when they sing "Blessed Assurance?" This should be good news for you and for everyone.

How many of our sins were laid upon Him?
We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all. Is 53:6

No, it hasn't. It has been debunked in your imagination but not by scripture. You seem to think that God has a grading system, and if you can manage to get a high enough score, you will make it through the Pearly Gates. What is the standard? 90% and above? How much less than perfect is OK with God?

You should not teach power over sin when you still sin. I have noticed that you will not declare yourself sinless, yet you lay that burden upon others as if you were sinless. God has eradicated my sins, completely destroyed them, and condemned them in the flesh. Even though I am being sanctified, I am counted as perfect for all time because of Christ's Righteousness. He has eradicated yours also if you will grasp His gift by faith.
You don't understand the difference between not sinning and sinlessness? Sinlessness means I would have had to live my entire life without sin, you know, like Jesus. That would make make me God. You either deliberately misunderstand me or your powers of reasoning are sadly lacking.

To not sin means through developing a strong relationship with Jesus He enables me to not continue to sin. He makes us a partaker, as Peter says, of His divine nature. And His divine nature overcomes sin in our lives. But that does not clear our past record of sin.

I am counted as perfect too, but I'm not left to continue to suffer the consequences of continued sinning. You are. You will continue to lie to people, to cheat them, commit adultery, hate, etc... with all the negative consequences of those behaviors damaging your relationships with other people. Plus, and worst of all, your life will allow people to point at Christians and mock us as hypocrites. That's what the Pharisees were as Jesus called them that again and again. It's called having a form of Godliness but denying the power thereof.

2Timothy 3: 1 THIS know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
 
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@Mercy Shown

Here is what God told the people of Judah before Jerusalem was destroyed.

Jeremiah 1: 1 THE word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord, saying,
2 Stand in the gate of the Lord’s house, and proclaim there this word, and say, Hear the word of the Lord, all ye of Judah, that enter in at these gates to worship the Lord.
3 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, Amend your ways and your doings, and I will cause you to dwell in this place.
4 Trust ye not in lying words, saying, The temple of the Lord, The temple of the Lord, The temple of the Lord, are these.
5 For if ye throughly amend your ways and your doings; if ye throughly execute judgment between a man and his neighbour;
6 If ye oppress not the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, and shed not innocent blood in this place, neither walk after other gods to your hurt:
7 Then will I cause you to dwell in this place, in the land that I gave to your fathers, for ever and ever.
8 ¶ Behold, ye trust in lying words, that cannot profit.
9 Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not;
10 And come and stand before me in this house, which is called by my name, and say, We are delivered to do all these abominations?

What you're telling me is that it is impossible to not oppress the the stranger, the fatherless, the widow and not shed innocent blood. And that it is also impossible to not steal, murder, commit adultery, swear falsely, worship idols and follow other gods other than the God, and then stand before Him and say I am delivered to do all these abominations.

This is very sad.
 
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