Sam Harris and Jordan Peterson on Dogma

Michie

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Whatever “dogma” is, Sam Harris certainly doesn’t like it. In his recent conversation with Jordan Peterson, Harris repeatedly condemns dogma, and Peterson repeatedly tries to moderate this condemnation. Harris notes correctly that dogma is “a Catholic term.” But what exactly is being condemned? The target is moving.

First, Harris defines dogma as “a belief that is held in spite of the fact that there’s no good evidence for it.” According to this definition, belief in God is not a dogma. If Aristotle, Augustine, Aquinas, Liebniz, Plantinga or William Lane Craig are right, there is good evidence to believe that God exists. Indeed, the Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches that, “By natural reason man can know God with certainty.”

But belief in God is not only a dogma, but is the fundamental dogma of the Catholic creed. So, Harris’ definition of dogma must differ radically from Catholic understandings of the term. In which case, his critique of “dogma” is a straw man of his own invention.

Harris offers a second understanding of dogma, “If I say to you, listen, I believe X and there’s nothing you can say to convince me otherwise, and no matter how good your evidence gets, no matter how good your arguments get, I’m not gonna want to hear it. And if you press the case, I’m gonna get angrier and angrier until the possibility of having a conversation about anything fully erodes.” “Dogma” in this sense means close-mindedness.

Yet close-mindedness is a characteristic that can afflict a believer or a skeptic, an atheist or a theist. As woke mobs show us, you could reject all “dogma” in the religious sense of the term and yet be utterly certain of your beliefs and closed off from learning from others. Moreover, you could believe in a dogma (let’s say, “God exists”) and also not get angry and indeed (as I do) even enjoy talking to people who see things differently. So, “close-mindedness” is a sloppy definition of dogma.

Continued below.
 

Cosmic Charlie

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Two people I don't care about, who have no academic standing on the subject they are discussing, arguing an obscure point from an indefensible position.

I liked the intnerwebs better before social media made EVERYBODY an expert.
 
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Michie

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Two people I don't care about, who have no academic standing on the subject they are discussing, arguing an obscure point from an indefensible position.

I liked the intnerwebs better before social media made EVERYBODY an ex
pert.
Well ignore them then. It just like random posters that consider themselves experts. No difference really.
 
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Michie

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Pretty much. Everyone that gets a platform tends to think they are more educated and expert than others. You got to admit, Peterson has credentials. Does it make him right? Not necessarily. But he is not the average guy off the street either.
 
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Cosmic Charlie

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Pretty much. Everyone that gets a platform tends to think they are more educated and expert than others. You got to admit, Peterson has credentials. Does it make him right? Not necessarily. But he is not the average guy off the street either.
Ok, but his credentials as in Clinical Psychology and his area of specialization appears to be in addiction.

This is hardly a basis to be sounding off about theology and gender identity and whatever the mercy sakes else he decided to sound off about.

The average guy on the street as at least as much credibility in monetary policy, and I've heard him blasting various fiscal policies.

Hey, I'm ok with this guy if you're ok with this guy but he does drive me insane.
 
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Michie

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Ok, but his credentials as in Clinical Psychology and his area of specialization appears to be in addiction.

This is hardly a basis to be sounding off about theology and gender identity and whatever the mercy sakes else he decided to sound off about.

The average guy on the street as at least as much credibility in monetary policy, and I've heard him blasting various fiscal policies.


Hey, I'm ok with this guy if you're ok with this guy but he does drive me insane.
Honestly, I’ve only listened to him once. I’ve read several articles about him and it comes off as a shtick to me. A money making venture. He seems to think he is an enigma wrapped in a mystery. So no, I find him quite pretentious most of the time. And yes, he’s made some good points but I am not crazy about how he seems to peddle himself as a prize or a notch in the belt to Christianity. In other words, I find him quite pompous. But just because I disagree with certain things concerning Peterson, I do not wipe him off the board completely.
 
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