Did Jesus have siblings?

[tonychanyt]

Luke 2:

7a And she gave birth to her firstborn, a Son.

Presumably, Mary would have her 2nd born after the firstborn.

Jesus knew Luke 4:

24 "Truly I tell you," he continued, "no prophet is accepted in his hometown."

Jesus was becoming popular, but his family didn't believe him. Mark 3:

20 Jesus entered a house, and again a crowd gathered so that he and his disciples were not even able to eat. 21 When his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, “He is out of his mind.”

Jesus' hometown and family were some key terms that pointed to Jesus' biological family.

Matt 12:

46 While Jesus was still speaking to the crowds, His mother

Was this Jesus' biological mother?

Yes.

and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to Him.

Were these Jesus' biological brothers?

I think so.

47 Someone told Him, “Look, Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to You.”

His biological family members stood outside, in contrast to his disciples:

48 But Jesus replied, “Who is My mother, and who are My brothers?” 49 Pointing to His disciples, He said, “Here are My mother and My brothers. 50 For whoever does the will of My Father in heaven is My brother and sister and mother.”

Jesus' disciples, spiritual brothers and sisters, and mother were listening to his teachings inside.

Later in Matt 13:

53 When Jesus had finished these parables, he went away from there, 54 and coming to his hometown he taught them in their synagogue,

The "home" in "hometown" refers to the biological family.

so that they were astonished, and said, “Where did this man get this wisdom and these mighty works? 55 Is not this the carpenter’s son?

i.e., familial son

Is not his mother called Mary?

i.e., the biological mother

And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?

More evidence of biological/familial terms. The context was very much localized to Jesus' family and hometown. It was very specific about his father, his genetic mother, and the names of 4 gene-related brothers. Joseph Junior was named after Joseph the Senior.

56 And are not all his sisters with us? Where then did this man get all these things?” 57And they took offense at him. But Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor except in his hometown and in his own household.”

Look at all the bold words. The evidence is strong that these referred to Jesus' half-brothers by name. They were fathered by Joseph through Mary.

He was getting too popular. His enemies wanted to kill Jesus, John 7:

1 After this, Jesus went around in Galilee. He did not want to go about in Judea because the Jewish leaders there were looking for a way to kill him.

That was serious. Still, no sympathy from his half-brothers:

2 "Now the feast of the Jews, the Feast of Booths, was near. therefore his brothers said to Him,

i.e., his biological half-brothers

'Leave here and go into Judea, so that Your disciples also may see Your works which You are doing.

As opposed to his half-brothers

4 For no one does anything in secret when he himself seeks to be known publicly. If You do these things, show Yourself to the world.' 5 For not even his [half] brothers were believing in Him."

What kind of hometown brothers were these?

I think it was a case of sibling jealousy. They dared him to go to Jerusalem, where the Jewish leaders were expecting him:

11 Now at the festival the Jewish leaders were watching for Jesus and asking, “Where is he?”
12 Among the crowds there was widespread whispering about him. Some said, “He is a good man.”
Others replied, “No, he deceives the people.” 13 But no one would say anything publicly about him for fear of the leaders.

For his half-brothers, it was a case of familiarity that breeds contempt.

After Jesus died on the cross, James, one of his half-brothers, did have a change of heart.

There is some archaeological evidence concerning James Ossuary:

The James Ossuary is a 1st-century limestone box that was used for containing the bones of the dead. An Aramaic inscription meaning "Jacob (James), son of Joseph, brother of Jesus" is cut into one side of the box. Professor Camil Fuchs of Tel Aviv University stated that, other than the James Ossuary, there has so far only been one found, amongst thousands of ossuaries, that contains a reference to a brother, concluding that "there is little doubt that this [naming a brother or son] was done only when there was a very meaningful reason to refer to a family member of the deceased, usually due to his importance and fame." He produced a statistical analysis of the occurrence of these three names in ancient Jerusalem and projected that there would only have been 1.71 people named James, with a father named Joseph and a brother named Jesus, expected to be living in Jerusalem around the time at which the ossuary was produced.

There is a good chance that this James was the half-brother of Jesus.

Did Jesus have siblings?

The probability that he had siblings is comfortably higher than that he had no siblings. I don't think Mary was a perpetual virgin.

 

[Diamond72]

After Jesus died on the cross, James, one of his half-brothers, did have a change of heart.

We are told that James is Josephs son from a previous marriage. He was 12 and Mary raised him for Joseph. Josephs other sons were older and married at the time. He was still alive when Jesus was 12 but we do not hear anything about Joseph after that story in Luke.

 

[David Lamb]

We are told that James is Josephs son from a previous marriage. He was 12 and Mary raised him for Joseph. Josephs other sons were older and married at the time. He was still alive when Jesus was 12 but we do not hear anything about Joseph after that story in Luke.

You say that we are told this, but who tells us this? I think we'd look in vain for anything in the bible to indicate that James was Joseph's son from a previous marriage (or even that Joseph had been married before), that James was 12, or that Joseph's other sons (from his supposed previous marriage) were older and married. We surely need to make sure that we base our beliefs on God's word.

 

[Diamond72]

You say that we are told this, but who tells us this?

The Gospel of James (also known as the Protoevangelium of James), written about 150 AD, presents Joseph as an old man chosen by God to watch over the Virgin. Jesus' brothers are presented as Joseph's children by an earlier marriage.[70]

The History of Joseph the Carpenter, written in the 5th century and framed as a biography of Joseph dictated by Jesus, describes how Joseph, aged 90, a widower with four sons and two daughters, is given charge of the twelve-year-old Mary, who then lives in his household raising his youngest son James the Less (the supposed author of the Protoevangelium) until she is ready to be married at age 14½. Joseph's death aged 111, attended by angels and asserting the perpetual virginity of Mary, takes up approximately half the story.[71]

Saint Joseph - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Gospel of James - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

We surely need to make sure that we base our beliefs on God's word.

Yes, the book of James is not cannon. They do find contradictions so it is excluded. The Bible has to 100% harmonize and there can be no contradictions. Still people talk about not throwing the baby out with the bath water. Why do we not hear about Joseph after Jesus was 12 years old. If he was as young as Mary then He should have been alive when Jesus was 30 years old.

 

[David Lamb]

The Gospel of James (also known as the Protoevangelium of James), written about 150 AD, presents Joseph as an old man chosen by God to watch over the Virgin. Jesus' brothers are presented as Joseph's children by an earlier marriage.[70]

The History of Joseph the Carpenter, written in the 5th century and framed as a biography of Joseph dictated by Jesus, describes how Joseph, aged 90, a widower with four sons and two daughters, is given charge of the twelve-year-old Mary, who then lives in his household raising his youngest son James the Less (the supposed author of the Protoevangelium) until she is ready to be married at age 14½. Joseph's death aged 111, attended by angels and asserting the perpetual virginity of Mary, takes up approximately half the story.[71]

Saint Joseph - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Gospel of James - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yes, the book of James is not cannon. They do find contradictions so it is excluded. The Bible has to 100% harmonize and there can be no contradictions. Still people talk about not throwing the baby out with the bath water. Why do we not hear about Joseph after Jesus was 12 years old. If he was as young as Mary then He should have been alive when Jesus was 30 years old.

Sorry, but why do you think Joseph must have been alive when Jesus was 30 if he was roughly the same age as Mary? We are simply not told in the bible when or why Joseph died. Even today, with the advantages of modern health-care, some people die at younger ages than others.

 

[Diamond72]

Sorry, but why do you think Joseph must have been alive when Jesus was 30 if he was roughly the same age as Mary? We are simply not told in the bible when or why Joseph died. Even today, with the advantages of modern health-care, some people die at younger ages than others.

We are told that people are given 70 years or if for reason of strength 80. I do not deserve to be alive but if I am then how much more a righteous person like Joseph. The righteous do not die an early death before their time. I know the world says the good die young but it is the opposite that the good are given a long life.

Psalm 91
16With long life I will satisfy him and show him My salvation.”

Proverbs 3 1My son, do not forget my teaching, but let your heart keep my commandments; 2for they will add length to your days, years and peace to your life.

 

[David Lamb]

We are told that people are given 70 years or if for reason of strength 80. I do not deserve to be alive but if I am then how much more a righteous person like Joseph. The righteous do not die an early death before their time. I know the world says the good die young but it is the opposite that the good are given a long life.

Psalm 91
16With long life I will satisfy him and show him My salvation.”

Proverbs 3 1My son, do not forget my teaching, but let your heart keep my commandments; 2for they will add length to your days, years and peace to your life.

Yes, the usual age of death after the flood is given in the bible as 70 years, but it's not absolute, otherwise you and I would be in heaven, both of us being over seventy, and nobody would die under that age. We just don't know from the bible how old Joseph was when he died.

 

[Diamond72]

We just don't know from the bible how old Joseph was when he died.

That sure would not be the case today. We know when everyone dies, why they died and what they had for breakfast that day. Makes you wonder if anyone can be trusted if there is so much dispute over an issue like that. Esp when Luke does a complete investigation and tells us so much about the mother.

 

[David Lamb]

That sure would not be the case today. We know when everyone dies, why they died and what they had for breakfast that day. Makes you wonder if anyone can be trusted if there is so much dispute over an issue like that. Esp when Luke does a complete investigation and tells us so much about the mother.

I'm not really sure what point you are making (my fault, I expect, not yours!). Did you mean that the la ck of information in the bible about Joseph's age means that maybe the bible can't be trusted? There are many things that aren't mentioned in the bible (most of the childhood of Jesus, the ages of the apostles, the name of Peter's mother-in-law whom Jesus healed, for example). Had God thought it was important for us to know such things, then they would have been mentioned.

 

[Diamond72]

Did you mean that the la ck of information in the bible about Joseph's age means that maybe the bible can't be trusted?

The question has to do with the brothers and sisters of Jesus. According to the tradition of the Catholic Church Mary took a vow before God to remain a virgin all of her life. So they believe the brothers and sisters belonged to Joseph from a previous marriage. We do not have enough evidence one way or the other. Except my question is why do we not hear about Joseph. Mary was still alive and Joseph should have still been alive also. IF those were really his brothers and sisters why does he not want to talk to them and be a brother to them?

So the lack of information in the Bible means, we do not know.

 

[Stephen Andrew]

Peace to all,

Jesus was born flesh and born of spirit as the soul of His being.

to me, the logic is ,We do not become brothers of Jesus until baptism.

to me, the logic is Brothers, siblings share a body and a spirit in the sol of the being from the same parents

Peace always,
Stephen

 

[tonychanyt]

to me, the logic is ,We do not become brothers of Jesus until baptism.

Thanks for sharing.

When is a person born again? Before or after baptism?

 

[Stephen Andrew]

Thanks Toni,

Thsnks for helping in wording and logic with me, and all to make better as united in the Body of Christ all mankind, in the logic of the Holy Spirit. To help open teh Homeland to all mankind through The Christ in union, in faith and morality.

I am seeing so much power in the logic of Christ. To me, the logic becomes to the person pondering the gifts of the Holy Spirit. And, just for the logic information, the Dogmas of the Faith in Catholicism helps one, me, understand Christ before He was even born, as The Word and the mysteries of The Faith in Christ. The logic becomes to me so clear I cannot think of anything else during the day sometimes, and as of the past several days, weeks, newer things in the logic step out.

To me, the logic in Born again is in the transformation at Baptism from the corruptible and mortal flesh of Adam and Eve. To me, the logical story of Christ is the greatest story ever told, and the logic in the real information of The Christ gets clearer.

To me, the Logic in Baptism is explained through Paul's theology of the spirit is in the soul of the being in the Body. From the sacraments instituted by Christ to give grave, Baptism is logical for sanctification of the spirit in the soul of the being, without even understanding the Will of The Father. Just saying to God, please help me make it my will that it be your will. Coming into the Church, as Baptized into The Body Of Christ, we become reborn of the spirit through the flesh in the soul of the being, and if anytime right after Baptism and before sinning there is end of life, the Being will transfigure, sinless, as "This is "like My Son in whom I am well pleased." saved through Baptism and before the first sin. To become re-imaged as sanctified in the spirit and the flesh in the soul of the being, in logic, becoming the image of The Father, through the power of the Divine, "Holy" Spirit.

Thanks for your update in the words I use sometimes, you are so right in that we want to keep the Temple, the Church of Christ open to all mankind to eliminate mental hate and mental anger and mental fear. You, to me, are a crusader as a disciple for all seeking Christ as united in being in all mankind.

To me it is in the Logic, that Einstein did not have trying to explain eternity just using the finite disciplines, and he as rational being said, I do not know how eternity works. I think he tried to find a static state, but his finite reasoning could not define his quest. I thing heaven will be dynamic in divine nature, and unfailing in all aspects ot divine reality. We know no one can even imagine the glories of all of Heaven. In logic, we can see the unfailing state of information is in the Divine will of creation to never fail, in logic. And as mortal finite beings, we can logically assume the divine powers of the infinite disciplines excedes our capabilities by factors not computable in the real world.

The other sacrament of dead to life is penance, for the failed spirit that has sinned and wants to restore friendship back to the soul of the being as regenerated and re-sanctified in the Holy Spirit will of the being. To me this is also Born again and saved to be able to manifest from the immortal flesh and incorruptible in the soul of the being to be able again through confessing and making a firm commitment of amendment to offer the sacrifice of the Christs in the Church of The Body of Christ for atonement of sin. Can this be done outside of the Church? Through understanding Christ and all of His teaching, no one can judge others, but through the Knowledge of the tree of Good and Evil, we can judge ourselves. To me this is the autonomy of the being to stand self justified and self-righteous through the Will of the re-sanctified and reconfirmed Holy Spirit by the Power of the unfailing Holy Spirit information in the being that will never fail. Born again, saved is through the Baptism and Communion with the Christ following the pattern, the image of the Creator. God, The Father to manifest immortal and incorruptible, the Body becoming transfigured into the image of the Creator, God The Father, in Real Information Holy Spirit logic as What would Jesus do in all cases of fulfilled faith and morality? This is the will of the Father.

To me, I follow this logic, and some of it reappears and some of it is restated better an all seems to follow the logic of the Will of The Father.

To me, Tony, I apply this logic to the parables Christ teaches and the logic seems to follow. We are created mortal and corrupt we become saved as immortal and incorruptible and we become regenerated and re-sanctified becoming transfigured into the image of the Father. In logic, and I know there are many storied on the second coming of The Christ, but this seems to follow the logic of the Divine Will. This to me is the divine real information logical parable, as we know help in the understanding of the Promises of The Christ, the Body of God through logic teaching.

Thanks Tony in the wording from your input, that may help explain Born again saved so that even a child can understand it, then have the child perhaps explain it to an adult, for an example as real information "RI".

Peace always,
Stephen

 

[tonychanyt]

To me, the logic in Born again is in the transformation at Baptism from the corruptible and mortal flesh of Adam and Eve.

See my definition of born again and follow up there.

 

[David Lamb]

Peace to all,

Jesus was born flesh and born of spirit as the soul of His being.

to me, the logic is ,We do not become brothers of Jesus until baptism.

to me, the logic is Brothers, siblings share a body and a spirit in the sol of the being from the same parents

Peace always,
Stephen

Sorry, but why do you think it is logical to believe that we become brothers of Jesus at baptism? Where does the bible teach that? It's surely faith in Jesus Christ that brings one into a right relationship with Him and His heavenly Father:

“So they said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."” (Ac 16:31 NKJV)

 

[Stephen Andrew]

Peace to all,

Thanks to all, and to me the Logic is we become more and more brothers and sisters of The Christ through all of the mysteries of the faith and eventually transfigure as The Christ in the Second Coming. Not necessarily at Baptism, but through all of the wokings of Christ's tteaching do we become born again and saved.

Thanks on the input, David. Your words help unite us all, and thanks for your help in the wording and for your help in our understanding The Word correctly. To me, Christ has a soul with a sanctified spirit and as Baptized, His Holy Spirit is Baptized through the flesh to His soul, allowing Him, as us to through death resurrect glorified through the Power of the Holy Spirit The Christ shares in fellowship with all mankind, all become brotehrs and sisters through The Christ. This is in logic, i see and i understand what you are saying, thenks David fro teh input. You are correct in as Baptized brothers and sisters, and I wanted to reword the Logic I see in Baptism and introduction of the being into the Church through Baptism and Communion in the being.

To me the "RI" real intelligence is in the Will of the Father that will never fail US as "What would Jesus do in all cases of Faith and Morality." Reiaging is in the Power of the Holy Spirit to manifest the Body of Our Christ immortal and incorruptible glorified and tranfigured Bodies, the Shared Holy Spirit will in the soul of the being, in the Image of The Father, united as one in being.

Thanks to all, and we know the greatest story ever told is the Story of Jesus and humanity and becoming the image of the Father. Logically Born again and saved is from two unique happenings, and all of the wondrous mysteries of the Faith.

The Old Covenant Authorities know salvation is through the Temple of the Living Sacrifice and The Sacrifice in the Temple that atones and gives absolution for the sinner as identified with the sacrifice as the penance for atonement of sin. The penance loss was the animal that could have been used for food and clothing for the family. The penance is the work done proven sorrow and atones for the sin as sacrifice of the innocent to allow the guilty to go free. The logic of penance and sacrifice and reconfirming in the will of The Father regenerates the Holy Spirit will back to the spirit in the soul through Communion in fellowship in the saving grace of penance.

Jesus came to fulfill, not to remove any of the feature benefits from salvation. Today, the work done proven sorrow and atonement for the confessed sin is absolved through the New Living Sacrifice, The Body of Christ, through identification of sin and sin offering of The Christ in the Temple of the Living Sacrifice by the penance given by the New Earthly Priestly authority.

In both Baptism, dead to life in the spirit and flesh of the being and Communion, dead to life again in the spirit will of the being, regeneration and Confirmation of the Holy Spirit Person in the being through repentance and Penance in Communion. The two sacraments are from death to life in the Christ, from the Body of Mary, and through the Faith of Abraham and the Communion in fellowship and the atonement of sin through the Arc of the New Covenant fulfilled Living Sacrifice that allows US to identify ourselves with sin offering and repentance through a firm commitment of amendment by The Priestly Authority in the penance given through the good works of the flesh and hearing the words of absolution for the absolution of sin.

In both Old Covenant and New Covenant logic, what has to me re-imaged is the Will of The Father in the spirit of through the flesh to the soul of the being.

Without the logic of the Holy Spirit as real information for infallible certainty of the Church, The Body of Christ, the Holy Spirit Will of God can be re-confirmed in the being to manifest through immortality incorruptibility and can be glorified and transfigured. We know not to judge others, for we know through the knowledge of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil to judge ourselves, to be able to stand autonomously as justified and self-righteous as Born again and saved and able to become transfigured through Our own judgment before God.

The logic of, As Born again, living water to the spirit through flesh in the soul of the being, we become into both the immortal spirit and incorruptible flesh in the soul in the being. We become Baptized like Christ at the River Jordan when His Father, Our Father said, "Behold, This is my Son in whom I am well pleased." Here, logically we see the being in the Christ, sanctified in the Flesh and spirit in the Body of the Church, The Body of Christ. Just as a newborn child, Baptism gifts saving grace to the spirit through the flesh in the soul of the Being.

The logic of Saved is also from the sacrament of the dead to life in Penance. Reconfirmation of The Will of The Father is in The Communion in the spirit through the flesh on the soul of the being.

As Born again, through the Baptism of The Christ as Pleasing to God, immortal and incorruptible and sanctified in spirit and flesh in the soul of the being we are ready now for glorification and transfiguration into the image of the Father.

As Saved through the Communion and fellowship through the Holy Spirit will of the Father through the Sacrament of Death to Life again in the Spirit by the Communion and regeneration of the will of The Father to re-sanctify the spirit in the soul of The Baptized being.

We know through the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil the autonomy of self-justification and self-righteousness as sanctified in the spirit and flesh of Our Being in The Christ to become glorified and transfigured glorified through the Holy Spirit shared as one in being together with The Father and The Son with all mankind. We know we have the power of The Holy Spirit to judge ourselves and know not to judge others.

Today, through Teh Christ, the Body of God, all mankind shares the Holy Spirit from the Cross as united as one in being together with the Father and The Son, glorified and transfigured into the image of the Creator, God, The Father.

Thanks again, and please advise if I have writen anything not in line with the teachings of Christ, thanks to all.

Peace always,
Stephen