Biblical command to 'turn the other cheek' doesn't mean Christians should 'tolerate tyranny'

[BPPLEE]

And you said the same for the Old. That's why I was saying that about you.

I explained that my pastors exegenesis led me to an understanding that makes sense for me.

Funny you mention that verse. My father has a schizophrenic friend who believed that verse was meant to be taken literally (as...APPARENTLY. you do too). He literally cut off his hand just above the wrist. He's in our province's most supportive mental health ward.

Poor guy. Dad still sees him weekly when he's in Edmonton.

I don’t believe Jesus intended for us to cut off our hands, pluck out our eyes or allow ourselves to be beaten to death

 

[DaisyDay]

Not be clearer about what? Letting someone beat you up or kill you and just standing there and not defending yourself? Letting someone rape your wife and not defending her? Letting someone molest your children and just forgiving them?
God also gave you a brain and he intended for you to use it. The Old Testament gives us insight into the nature of God and God has approved of defending yourself and defeating your enemies.

I think that you are reading too much into it: just because Jesus said to turn the other cheek doesn’t mean that He meant that literally or only if you were not really harmed.

 

[BPPLEE]

Did you know Jesus and many great spiritual leaders in that time used figurative language commonly?

Maybe you can find some figurative language somewhere in the new testement where Jesus tells us to beat people?

Mat 11:12 - And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

 

[BPPLEE]

I think that you are reading too much into it: just because Jesus said to turn the other cheek doesn’t mean that He meant that literally or only if you were not really harmed.

Some pexple are taking it literally evidently

 

[rambot]

I don’t believe Jesus intended for us to cut off our hands, pluck out our ey

He didn't. He was comparing the punishment of sin to the removal of limb and indicating which was worse.

It was not a command to do so.

Mat 11:12 - And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

OK. So you've found a verse with the word "violence" in it. Jesus is talking about a fairly small window of time and nothing about this verse suggests partaking in violence at all; merely Describing the state of violence that men are competing.miring against heaven.

As IF God couldn't handle that.....do you believe we are called to that b3cause God can't manage? Cause there's no indication in the verse.

 

[rambot]

I think that you are reading too much into it: just because Jesus said to turn the other cheek doesn’t mean that He meant that literally or only if you were not really harmed.

I take it literally because I ha ent seen good exegenesis to back up anything else.

Why would. Hriat command us to break our love for fellow man? It's just our life. If we die we come to Christ. If we commit violence against others then what?


I mean, the Amish have been around for a good long while.

 

[BPPLEE]

I take it literally because I ha ent seen good exegenesis to back up anything else.

Why would. Hriat command us to break our love for fellow man? It's just our life. If we die we come to Christ. If we commit violence against others then what?


I mean, the Amish have been around for a good long while.

Well I guess all this time in Law Enforcement and Security I have been disobedient for over 30 years. I guess I should be like the Jehovah's Witnesses and refuse to serve in the military or Law Enforcement huh?

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I could more easily accept maltreatment for myself than witness and allow maltreatment on others, especially those closest to me.

 

[rambot]

Well I guess all this time in Law Enforcement and Security I have been disobedient for over 30 years. I guess I should be like the Jehovah's Witnesses and refuse to serve in the military or Law Enforcement huh?

Listen. You can make as many of these comments as you like. I don't care. Fill your boots.

You still haven't provided biblical justification for violence....let alone anything specifically in the new Testament.

All these side comments dont change that fact.

 

[BPPLEE]

Listen. You can make as many of these comments as you like. I don't care. Fill your boots.

You still haven't provided biblical justification for violence....let alone anything specifically in the new Testament.

All these side comments dont change that fact.

This is what I used for my job

Rom 13:3 - For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same.

Rom 13:4 - For he is God’s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.

 

[BPPLEE]

I take it literally because I ha ent seen good exegenesis to back up anything else.

Why would. Hriat command us to break our love for fellow man? It's just our life. If we die we come to Christ. If we commit violence against others then what?


I mean, the Amish have been around for a good long while.

The right hand was for regular use but the left was used when dealing with unclean things. Striking someone as an act of accusation was done with the back of the right hand. To turn the other cheek would force the other if they continued with their accusation, to use the left hand. This would not only render the accuser unclean for the allotted time but also would render the accusation as unclean. Turning the cheek was an act of defiance and a matter of procedural self defense. Gentiles really need to look at things from the perspective of the Jews before they go running off with Gentile meanderings. Probably why so many gentiles speak out against the law.
Thanks @timothyu

 

[ViaCrucis]

No. No one ever died from a slap. We shouldn’t respond to disrespect. That doesn’t mean letting someone beat you to death and not defending yourself

You think Jesus was saying turn the other cheek only applies to a slap? That's it? Really?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[BPPLEE]

You think Jesus was saying turn the other cheek only applies to a slap? That's it? Really?

-CryptoLutheran

See post 171

 

[ViaCrucis]

Protestants have always struggled to make sense of the Sermon on the Mount.

I understand it as Jesus person and preaching are not two separate things, the Sermon on the Mount reflects Jesus', and by extension, God's character. There isn't some dispensation in the future where "turn the other cheek" becomes true, but today can simply be ignored.

That's where I think Bonhoeffer has been especially important and useful. The Sermon on the Mount has to mean something for Christian discipleship, otherwise it means nothing.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

See post 171

I'll stick to Jesus, and the ancient fathers, on how to understand Jesus rather than modern attempts to lessen Jesus' hard sayings.

This is like trying to pretend Jesus wasn't referring to His flesh and blood in John ch. 6, Jesus meant what He said.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[BCP1928]

Not be clearer about what? Letting someone beat you up or kill you and just standing there and not defending yourself? Letting someone rape your wife and not defending her? Letting someone molest your children and just forgiving them?
God also gave you a brain and he intended for you to use it. The Old Testament gives us insight into the nature of God and God has approved of defending yourself and defeating your enemies.

What's disturbing is the number of Christians who have come to dwell excessively on the possibility, imagining lurid shoot-out scenarios and arming themselves with military-style weapons.

 

[BPPLEE]

What's disturbing is the number of Christians who have come to dwell excessively on the possibility, imagining lurid shoot-out scenarios and arming themselves with military-style weapons.

Are Christians doing that?

 

[BCP1928]

Are Christians doing that?

Big time. Start a thread on assault weapons bans and see.

 

[rambot]

What's disturbing is the number of Christians who have come to dwell excessively on the possibility, imagining lurid shoot-out scenarios and arming themselves with military-style weapons.

So...American conservative Christians...

 

[rambot]

The right hand was for regular use but the left was used when dealing with unclean things. Striking someone as an act of accusation was done with the back of the right hand. To turn the other cheek would force the other if they continued with their accusation, to use the left hand. This would not only render the accuser unclean for the allotted time but also would render the accusation as unclean. Turning the cheek was an act of defiance and a matter of procedural self defense. Gentiles really need to look at things from the perspective of the Jews before they go running off with Gentile meanderings. Probably why so many gentiles speak out against the law.
Thanks @timothyu

Great. OK.

So we can agree that Jesus does not condone violence against others then.

After all the michatacterizations you have given in this thread its pretty rich to speak pejortively to anyone other topic of perpetuating violence