WWJD Did Jesus Pray to Mary?

[prodromos]

And exactly Who is The righteous Man? Only Jesus, Who God is well pleased with

Bad eisegisis. The verse in James says "the prayers of a righteous man", not "the prayers of the righteous man". Christ is not the context referred to in that verse.

 

[disciple Clint]

For one thing we are not told to or given an example in the Bible.

James 5:16 ESV
Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working.
1 Timothy 2:1 ESV
First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people,
Revelation 5:8 ESV
And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.
It appears that we are to pray for one another and that the elders in heaven pray for us.
So for us to ask for the intersession of the saints in heaven seems to be in accordance with the scripture and not any different than asking for our pastor or anyone else to pray for us.

 

[disciple Clint]

Nothing about praying to dead people in those verses

Where did the prayers come from that the 24 elders are offering up to God, obviously they are interceding for those praying on earth.

 

[BPPLEE]

James 5:16 ESV
Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working.
1 Timothy 2:1 ESV
First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people,
Revelation 5:8 ESV
And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.
It appears that we are to pray for one another and that the elders in heaven pray for us.
So for us to ask for the intersession of the saints in heaven seems to be in accordance with the scripture and not any different than asking for our pastor or anyone else to pray for us.

There is nothing in the scriptures you gave about praying to Saints. Do you pray to the four living creatures and the 24 elders ?

 

[BPPLEE]

Where did the prayers come from that the 24 elders are offering up to God, obviously they are interceding for those praying on earth.

So you pray to the 24 elders? Do you know who they represent?

 

[disciple Clint]

There is nothing in the scriptures you gave about praying to Saints. Do you pray to the four living creatures and the 24 elders ?

Who do you think the 24 elders are?

 

[disciple Clint]

So you pray to the 24 elders? Do you know who they represent?

They are men
Who are the twenty-four (24) elders in Revelation? | GotQuestions.org

 

[BPPLEE]

They are men
Who are the twenty-four (24) elders in Revelation? | GotQuestions.org

They represent the Church and the events in Revelation haven't happened yet.If you pray to Saints that is your business but it's not Biblical. This is from your source Is prayer to saints / Mary biblical? | GotQuestions.org

 

[Psalm 27]

Bad eisegisis. The verse in James says "the prayers of a righteous man", not "the prayers of the righteous man". Christ is not the context referred to in that verse.

Romans 3
22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Righteousness comes by The Lord Jesus. It's His righteousness.

as Jesus rose from the dead on the third day, (and ascended in bodily form acts 1), He is alive. He's not in the grave like saints, mary etc. so, we can pray directly to Him.

The effective fervent prayers of a righteous man avails much.

 

[timothyu]

He's not in the grave like saints, mary etc. so, we can pray directly to Him.

But but.. that would detract from the original model of hero worshipping humans past and present in a secular setting. We can't have the Kingdom not resemble the world the Adversary and man has made in our own image, he said tongue in cheek.

 

[Cis.jd]

This is the first I have ever heard of Jews praying to Elijah. Were Saints taken to Heaven in like manner? Otherwise what is the connection?

The connection is that people who are in heaven were never believed to be dead because they are alive spiritually.
It was an actual practice for jews to involke Elijah, remember when Jesus was on the cross and he cried "Eli Eli" and the people who heard it thought he was calling Elijah (Matt 27:47). Showing this was a common practice.

Here: Elijah the Prophet and the Passover Seder: Intergenerational Questions and Connections - Hebrew College

 

[Cis.jd]

Romans 3
22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Righteousness comes by The Lord Jesus. It's His righteousness.

as Jesus rose from the dead on the third day, (and ascended in bodily form acts 1), He is alive. He's not in the grave like saints, mary etc. so, we can pray directly to Him.

The effective fervent prayers of a righteous man avails much.

Your reply doesn't contradict his point. Anyway for your second sentence, you practically rebuked john 3:16, good job.

 

[disciple Clint]

They represent the Church and the events in Revelation haven't happened yet.If you pray to Saints that is your business but it's not Biblical. This is from your source Is prayer to saints / Mary biblical? | GotQuestions.org

The error here is the use of the word prayer, to pray is to ask, plead or beseech and not to worship. Nothing different from asking your friend or pastor to pray for you or to make a pleading to a judge, certainly the judge is not being worshiped.
Pray Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
The meaning of PRAY is entreat, implore —often used as a function word in introducing a question, request, or plea. How to use pray in a sentence. ... plead (to), solicit, supplicate; Visit the Thesaurus for More . Examples of pray in a Sentence. There's little else to do now but hope and pray.
Note the word worship is nowhere in the above.

 

[prodromos]

Romans 3
22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Righteousness comes by The Lord Jesus. It's His righteousness.

So are you claiming that the prayers of the Saints are actually Jesus's prayers, since their righteousness is actually Jesus righteousness?
Do you realise you are actually arguing for the intercessory prayers of the Saints?

as Jesus rose from the dead on the third day, (and ascended in bodily form acts 1), He is alive. He's not in the grave like saints, mary etc. so, we can pray directly to Him.

Where did Jesus say the thief on the cross would be that day? In the grave? Where are Abraham, Isaac and Jacob? Are they dead? What does Jesus say?
Do you not understand that it is out of humility that we ask the Saints to pray? Certainly we can ask Christ directly but you seem to forget that God loves the humble. There are many Christians who consider their own prayers to be worthless and so seek the prayers of those whom God has revealed to be righteous. This is obviously pleasing to God as He has blessed such intercessory prayer abundantly throughout the history of the Church.

The effective fervent prayers of a righteous man avails much.

As I have already stated.

 

[timothyu]

Where did Jesus say the thief on the cross would be that day?

Man later added a comma so you and others can make that claim. That is applying tradition to scripture

 

[prodromos]

But but.. that would detract from the original model of hero worshipping humans past and present in a secular setting. We can't have the Kingdom not resemble the world the Adversary and man has made in our own image, he said tongue in cheek.

So it is ok for you to mock other Christians with your strawman attack, but if someone calls out your hypocrisy you report them?

 

[prodromos]

Man later added a comma so you and others can make that claim. That is applying tradition to scripture

There is no comma in the Greek. It doesn't change that the thief is in Paradise.

 

[timothyu]

So it is ok for you to mock other Christians with your strawman attack, but if someone calls out your hypocrisy you report them?

I've never reported anyone. That is childish.

 

[timothyu]

There is no comma in the Greek. It doesn't change that the thief is in Paradise.

Right there is no comma but if it had been put as shown below, it would have an entirely different meaning, therefore you have no proof which is right other than falling on existing tradition

Verily I say unto thee today, shalt thou be with me in paradise.

 

[prodromos]

Right there is no comma but if it had been put as shown below, it would have an entirely different meaning, therefore you have no proof which is right other than falling on existing tradition

Verily I say unto thee today, shalt thou be with me in paradise.

There is no ambiguity in the Greek. You are completely wrong in this.