WHO DO YOU FOLLOW , PETER OR PAUL ?

[BNR32FAN]

And Gal 2:7 says that Paul , having seen that I have been entrusted with the GOSPEL of the UNCIRCUMCISION .

Just as Peter ( was ) of the CIRCUMCISION .

And the Greek word THE // HO is a DEFINITE ARTICLE and it points to the GOSPEL of UNCIRCUNCISION . PERIOD !!

Notice that that Peter is called , just as Peter ( WAS , was added ) OF THE CIRCUMCISION .

Also notice , that it is not called a GOSPEL , Why , because , after ACTS 15 , Peter is not mentioned at all .

And in Gal 2:8 for the ONE having operated in Peter for Apostleship of the CIRCUMCISION ( MEANS JEWS ) operated also in me for the GENTILES .

There are two different GOSPELS , here , without a doubt !!

dan p

Here is Paul telling the gospel to Peter that is for both Jews and Gentiles.

”“We are Jews by nature and not sinners from among the Gentiles; nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.“
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭2‬:‭15‬-‭16‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

We are Jews not sinners like the Gentiles, nevertheless, which means regardless MAN is not justified by works of the law but thru faith in Jesus Christ. He didn’t say Gentiles are justified by faith he said MAN which means all men both Jews and Gentiles. That is the one gospel. Just because they were sent to preach to different groups doesn’t mean they preached a different gospel. Peter preached to gentiles and Paul preached to Jews. Cornelius and his household were Gentiles that Peter preached the gospel to. Paul preached to Jews on numerous occasions in the book of Romans. Romans 2:17-29

 

[Hazelelponi]

I give to the poor, via donations. We need to live in a world more like Acts 2:44-45, a communal society. But America has been poisoned by individualism. We can blame modern society for that, greedy companies, politicians and social media.

Very small groups can live in small communal groups together...

Millions cannot.

Wanting to go back to an acts church is hoping for the loss of a great many Christians..

Christians in the early church had all things in common because it was the only way they could even continue as a church. Christians lives were constantly at stake, not everyone could work and the wholesale killing of Christians left many widows and orphans without any means of support.

The world for them was like night and day to the world modern America lives in. It was closer to a small group of Christian converts (former Muslims) in Saudi Arabia or Bahrain trying to live as Christians. In hiding half the time, preaching the other half.

As cool as that might seem, what we have is actually more difficult. It's easy to die for your faith, it's far more difficult to live the day to day of it in a more peaceful land.

That is why we fail here. This is what's difficult

 

[Guojing]

Christians in the early church had all things in common because it was the only way they could even continue as a church. Christians lives were constantly at stake, not everyone could work and the wholesale killing of Christians left many widows and orphans without any means of support.

Actually, they were expecting Daniel 70th week to begin anytime, see Acts 2:17-21 and Daniel 9:26.

So when you are expecting the antichrist and the mark of the beast soon, giving away all your money and your possessions to share, is a sound strategy (James 5:1-8).

 

[AlexB23]

Very small groups can live in small communal groups together...

Millions cannot.

Wanting to go back to an acts church is hoping for the loss of a great many Christians..

Christians in the early church had all things in common because it was the only way they could even continue as a church. Christians lives were constantly at stake, not everyone could work and the wholesale killing of Christians left many widows and orphans without any means of support.

The world for them was like night and day to the world modern America lives in. It was closer to a small group of Christian converts (former Muslims) in Saudi Arabia or Bahrain trying to live as Christians. In hiding half the time, preaching the other half.

As cool as that might seem, what we have is actually more difficult. It's easy to die for your faith, it's far more difficult to live the day to day of it in a more peaceful land.

That is why we fail here. This is what's difficult

Well, 300M/30M = 10, so small communal groups can exist.

 

[Hazelelponi]

..

Well, 300M/30M = 10, so small communal groups can exist.

They can... Not saying they can't...

Usually most groups can't go over 30-50 for communal living.

 

[AlexB23]

..


They can... Not saying they can't...

Usually most groups can't go over 30-50 for communal living.

Yeah, 50 is a crowd.

 

[keepitsimple144]

And the DISPENSATION of the GRACE of God , was a MYSYERY , the one HAVING been kept secret from the ages in God , the one having created the all things by Jesus Christ .

And Rom 16:26 says But now having been clear as by prophetic scriptures according to the command of the everlasting God , having been known to all the GENTILES ( NOTICE that Jews are not mentioned ) for the OBEDIENCE OF FAITH and all want to be in the FAITH you have to believe and know what the MYSTERY is to be in the FAITH , PERIOD .

Now that faith has come - There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28

 

[ViaCrucis]

..


They can... Not saying they can't...

Usually most groups can't go over 30-50 for communal living.

It's been a while since I looked into it, or read about it; but a number of years ago I encountered the work of what some anthropologists were studying. They were looking at human society and comparing them to primate societies. Essentially the more intelligent the primate, the larger the social group; but larger up to a point because at a certain point social groups would divide. So you may have a group of chimpanzees that reaches a threshold, and the group splits. Basically there is an upper limit to how a group can be functional and coherrent. When applied to human beings, it was estimated that between 150-200 is the upper limit for a truly cohesive, functional group of people. Basically anything bigger than that and social cohesion breaks down--we can only remember so many times, have so many functioning relationships.

And when we look at "natural" human society, for example contemporary hunter-gatherer societies, this roughly holds true. We also see it elsewhere, for example if an Amish community reaches a threshhold, a new community is established. We are very good with living in a small village, we can have meaningful social relationships within that 100-200 range. But when we start getting a lot bigger than that, cohesion starts to break.

And even in larger societies, such as cities, this still has largely worked because we essentially lived in our "villages" within cities, we had our neighborhoods, our community within the larger social order. We had our towns, and our churches, and this was our "village". I don't want to go off topic and into a tangent--but I have a suspicion that much of the problems of modern society can be accounted for because of our lack of a village--our sense of loneliness in the world because we are chronically online and we lack a meaningful village. But again that's off topic.

More to the point, groups do lose cohesion after a certain threshold, so when you talk about the difficulty in communal living beyond a certain number of people, you're right. Human beings just aren't built for that, we are built for life in the village, our ancestors lived in communal groups as nomads, and later settled down. We function best when we have a village.

I actually think that this can be a very important thing we can learn and take away to how we "do church" in modern times. How can our churches be more like a village. or how can we as the Church create a sense of village in our communities, providing a sense of belonging and acceptance, and of care and compassion to the lonely and the hurting?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[RocK Guy]

WHO DO YOU FOLLOW , PETER OR PAUL ?

True Christians follow the Lord Jesus Christ

 

[fhansen]

Paul told us to"""" be a follower of me, as i follow Christ"

The unlearned, or the fake bible student will then scream..."i follow no man".

or.. "I won't be worshiping Paul"..

However Paul didnt tell you to worship Him, he told you to follow him, as Jesus chose Him to be the Teacher...

Where?

"In the time of the Gentiles'.. as "Paul is the apostle to the Gentiles"..

Are you a Gentile?

Then ...... that's for you., as we are "in the time of the Gentiles".. right now.

If you were hatched or born on Jupiter, then don't even consider it.

Or if you are a JEW, then Good for YOU, as Paul's Gospel, is for YOU too.... And, Shalom,Shalom... God bless you to see it, and receive it an be born again.

One problem with Paul is that he can be difficult to understand, as Peter mentions in 2 Pet 2:16.

 

[Aviel]

One problem with Paul is that he can be difficult to understand, as Peter mentions in 2 Pet 2:16.

Peter said that Paul's letters are ""SCRIPTURE...""

So, when dealing with Scripture..

1.) "rightly divide the word"

2.) "Study to show yourself approved"

3.) "the word of God (Scripture) must be Spiritually Discerned"

4.) "he that is spiritual discerneth/judgeth all things"..


#4 is the money verse, as that verse is dictating a fact about how to do #1-3.


Its this...

Jesus said....>"YOU..... MUST... be.... born again"...

And if the person is just water baptized and religious, then they are disqualified from the Bible's revelation.

 

[fhansen]

Peter said that Paul's letters are ""SCRIPTURE...""

Yes? And he also said they were difficult to understand. And Peter was right as many have 'dicernethed/judgethed' much in Scripture incorrectly, even many who've managed to view themselves as exclusively qualified.

 

[Aviel]

Yes? And he also said they were difficult to understand.

He said that 'some" are difficult, while you changed his words into your opinion.

You said. ""were", as it ALL.

I dont find them difficult to understand.

 

[fhansen]

He said that 'some" are difficult, while you changed his words into your opinion.

You said. ""were", as it ALL.

I dont find them difficult to understand.

Sorry if I wasn’t clear-obviously not all that Paul said was difficult. But I believe that Peter made a very important point regarding Paul even though Paul’s writings certainly aren’t the only ones that “ignorant and unstable people distort”. It’s quite possible that Peter was concerned with antinomianism rearing its head by some interpretations of Paul, which is not what Paul intended, of course.

But whatever the reason, focusing on one disciple to follow is unwise and to this day there are many who believe that Paul’s gospel was unique -and they choose to follow him almost exclusively, with others actually rejecting his message as false. He ends up being a controversial figure for many, for one reason or another.

 

[Grip Docility]

One problem with Paul is that he can be difficult to understand, as Peter mentions in 2 Pet 2:16.

I find that Peter and Paul align, perfectly... but you aren't kidding! I haven't been on this thread yet, so my answer to the OP question is... neither.. I follow Jesus... and I don't see Peter and Paul at theological odds, though, if speaking with hardcore dispensationalists, I would get beaten for not noting that one is to the Jews, while the other is to the Goyim.

Back to Paul being "difficult"... I do laugh when we read in Acts...

Acts 26:24 As he was saying these things in his defense, Festus exclaimed in a loud voice, “You’re out of your mind, Paul! Too much study is driving you mad.”

 

[Aviel]

I find that Peter and Paul align, perfectly...

They align perfectly starting in Acts 15, when they met, and Paul updated all the Apostles.

You can read Acts 10, and discover that Peter in Acts 10... and this is about a DECADE after Jesus is back in Heaven...
Peter still does not KNOW that Gentiles can be SAVED..

So, as Paul is the "Apostle to the Gentiles" it pretty obvious in Acts 10 that "peter and paul" didnt "align" at all..

= ZERO.

And another time.....Paul said this...."THEY walked not uprightly according to the TRUTH".

So that is "bad alignment" #2, according to the New Testament.... Galatians 2:14

I follow Jesus... and I don't see Peter and Paul at theological odds, t

Jesus is Lord and Messiah, but Paul is our NT Teacher who wrote the Church Doctrine.
So, we get our Doctrine from Paul, and that is another reason that Peter said that Paul's letters are SCRIPTURE..
Equal to the TORAH, as at that time there was no NT.
So, that is a OT Jew, Apostle, one of the original 12, classifying Paul's Writings, as equal to the OLD TESTAMENT.

 

[Grip Docility]

They align perfectly starting in Acts 15, when they met, and Paul updated all the Apostles.

You can read Acts 10, and discover that Peter in Acts 10... and this is about a DECADE after Jesus is back in Heaven...
Peter still does not KNOW that Gentiles can be SAVED..

So, as Paul is the "Apostle to the Gentiles" it pretty obvious in Acts 10 that "peter and paul" didnt "align" at all..

= ZERO.

And another time.....Paul said this...."THEY walked not uprightly according to the TRUTH".

So that is "bad alignment" #2, according to the New Testament.... Galatians 2:14




Jesus is Lord and Messiah, but Paul is our NT Teacher who wrote the Church Doctrine.
So, we get our Doctrine from Paul, and that is another reason that Peter said that Paul's letters are SCRIPTURE..
Equal to the TORAH, as at that time there was no NT.
So, that is a OT Jew, Apostle, one of the original 12, classifying Paul's Writings, as equal to the OLD TESTAMENT.

So... You disagree with Paul? (Tongue in Cheek)

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I urge you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree in what you say, that there be no divisions among you, and that you be united with the same understanding and the same conviction. 11 For it has been reported to me about you, my brothers, by members of Chloe’s household, that there is rivalry among you. 12 What I am saying is this: Each of you says, “I’m with Paul,” or “I’m with Apollos,” or “I’m with Cephas,” or “I’m with Christ.” Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius; 15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

 

[Aviel]

So... You disagree with Paul? (Tongue in Cheek)

The reason there are "divisions" is because "where strife is found, there is every evil work"

"can any 2 walk together unless they be AGREED"??

= NOPE.

And what Causes Strife, on Forums?

Its the same thing that has caused 45,000 denominations to appear on the earth, and all of them say.>>"we are right".

So, how did that happen?

Very simple....

You have people who are not actually born again, creating many of them.
And the others are created by people who are deceived by some MAN's teaching, that they believe is "of God".

Here is how that happened to them.

A.) They didnt do what Paul told them to do in Hebrews 13:9.

Paul told every believer to "establish your heart with Grace", ' or a "Doctrine of Devils" will get your MIND and you will stay there till you die, believing that what you are trusting, is of God, and its not.

AA.) How do you establish your heart with Grace?

First you have to understand what it is.... so that by this revelation, you will then recognize all the cult stuff., and all the religious stuff that is presented as "christianity" and is not.

READER...
Here is how you find out, if your heart IS NOT... established by Grace.

If its not, then #1 = you will Believe that you can lose your salvation.
And what does that Prove?
it proves that you have NO REAL FAITH IN CHRIST, as to have Real faith in Christ means, = you trust Him to KEEP YOU SAVED.

Notice this reader...

When you believe that you can LOSE YOUR SALVATION< then that is because you dont TRUST IN CHRIST to Keep you saved..

That is Broken Faith.

So, if you dont Trust in Christ ALONE< to KEEP YOU SAVED, then who do you trust to do it?'

Who do you TRUST to keep you saved, if you are not trusting in CHRIST alone to keep you saved.... FOREVER. ?

See the problem with your faith?
Take a good look, and get that resolved.

 

[Grip Docility]

The reason there are "divisions" is because "where strife is found, there is every evil work"

"can any 2 walk together unless they be AGREED"??

= NOPE.

And what Causes Strife, on Forums?

Its the same thing that has caused 45,000 denominations to appear on the earth, and all of them say.>>"we are right".

So, how did that happen?

Very simple....

You have people who are not actually born again, creating many of them.
And the others are created by people who are deceived by some MAN's teaching, that they believe is "of God".

Here is how that happened to them.

A.) They didnt do what Paul told them to do in Hebrews 13:9.

Paul told every believer to "establish your heart with Grace", ' or a "Doctrine of Devils" will get your MIND and you will stay there till you die, believing that what you are trusting, is of God, and its not.

AA.) How do you establish your heart with Grace?

First you have to understand what it is.... so that by this revelation, you will then recognize all the cult stuff., and all the religious stuff that is presented as "christianity" and is not.

READER...
Here is how you find out, if your heart IS NOT... established by Grace.

If its not, then #1 = you will Believe that you can lose your salvation.
And what does that Prove?
it proves that you have NO REAL FAITH IN CHRIST, as to have Real faith in Christ means, = you trust Him to KEEP YOU SAVED.

Notice this reader...

When you believe that you can LOSE YOUR SALVATION< then that is because you dont TRUST IN CHRIST to Keep you saved..

That is Broken Faith.

So, if you dont Trust in Christ ALONE< to KEEP YOU SAVED, then who do you trust to do it?'

Who do you TRUST to keep you saved, if you are not trusting in CHRIST alone to keep you saved.... FOREVER. ?

See the problem with your faith?
Take a good look, and get that resolved.

I'm confused. How does this answer my tongue and cheek response to you, about Paul himself saying it's bad to associate our beliefs with human names, other than our Lord God, Jesus Christ? If you are curious as to my various personal beliefs on any theological matter, I would be happy to answer any of your questions.

 

[Aviel]

What yu

I'm confused. How does this answer my tongue and cheek response to you, about Paul himself saying it's bad to associate our beliefs with human names, other than our Lord God, Jesus Christ?

What you posted to me was "tongue in cheek", so, what i posted to you wasn't.