Okay, that's what I thought, but now I'm confused. In your first post you say Clement taught the soul isn't immortal & was teaching heresy. Now you're saying he didn't teach that?
I'm trying to Google what he taught on this. It seems, like w/ every thing, & church fathers especially, people try to spin what he says to fit their own beliefs. I read what they quote he said & don't see what they're saying he said. For example, the first Google result is trying to argue because he says 'death' a lot, that's proof he's teaching the soul dies, but I don't really think that means that at all.
Hey partner..the truth is it doesn’t matter what those people taught. Whole lot of extra writings and readings we do not need. And some of them did indeed have false teachings. Otherwise, we wouldn’t have thousands of manmade denominations in weekend religion. In fact, the title ‘church fathers’ that they’ve been given by the gatekeepers of corporate building-based religion is in opposition to what Christ taught.
“And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.”
—Matthew 23:9
Of course that only applies within a spiritual context, you can call your dad ‘father’ if you prefer lol. And whatever truth they did teach, it can all be found somewhere in between Genesis & Revelation. That’s all we need, God’s Word, and the Spirit, as the scripture another poster mentioned earlier:
“But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.” —1 John 2:27
Mark 9:43-48 makes it clear that the souls of the wicked are eternal. It was unbiblical manmade religions that teach in opposition to this biblical truth..like the Jehovah Witness religion, which was invented by a freemason named Charles Taze Russell, and the 7th day adventist religion which was founded by 2 proven false prophets William Miller and an occultist named Ellen White who is said to have been involved in Druidic witchcraft. Her writings do in fact contain New Age terminology such as ‘mother earth’ and ‘vital force’.
At any rate, we had a thread here going on about the role of women, I do find it interesting what some of these unbiblical ‘church fathers’ had to say about women..of course I do not personally agree with this slop they preach. God’s word teaches that women should in fact teach other women (Titus 2:3-5). Christ Himself treated women with dignity, gentleness, kindness, and respect all during His earthly ministry..not so much with these ‘church fathers’ (so-called). I surely do not wish to be a member of this ‘church’ that they fathered haha.
ORIGEN
“Men should not sit and listen to a woman … ‘For it is improper for a woman to speak in an assembly,’ no matter what she says, even if she says admirable things, or even saintly things, that is of little consequence, since they come from the mouth of a woman.”
Fragments on 1 Corinthians 74
“What is seen with the eyes of the Creator is masculine, and not feminine, for God does not stoop to look upon what is feminine and of the flesh.”
Selecta in Exodum (Fragments on Exodus), Patrologia Graeca 12, Column 296–297
TERTULLIAN
”And do you not know that you are (each) an Eve? The sentence of God on this sex of yours lives in this age: the guilt must of necessity live too. You are the devil’s gateway: you are the unsealer of that (forbidden) tree: you are the first deserter of the divine law: you are she who persuaded him whom the devil was not valiant enough to attack. You destroyed so easily God’s image, man. On account of your desert—that is, death—even the Son of God had to die. And do you think about adorning yourself over and above your tunics of skins?”
De Cultu Feminarium (On the Apparel of Women), Chapter 1
JOHN CHRYSOSTOM
“The woman taught once, and ruined all. On this account therefore he says, let her not teach. But what is it to other women, that she suffered this? It certainly concerns them; for the sex is weak and fickle, and he is speaking of the sex collectively.”
Homily 9 on First Timothy
“Man was first formed, and elsewhere he shows their superiority.”
Homily 9 on First Timothy
“God maintained the order of each sex by dividing the business of life into two parts, and assigned the more necessary and beneficial aspects to the man and the less important, inferior matter to the woman.”
“Hearken about the women of old; they were great characters, great women and admirable; such were Sarah, Rebekah, Rachel, Deborah, and Hannah; and such there were also in the days of Christ. Yet did they in no case outstrip the men, but occupied the second rank.”
Homily 13 on Ephesians
EPIPHANIUS
While denouncing the female prophets Quintilla, Maximilla, and Priscilla, Epiphanius makes this remark: “Women are unstable, prone to error, and mean-spirited.”
Panarion (also known as, Against Heresies) 79.1.6
Another translation which is often quoted is, “In very truth, women are a feeble race, untrustworthy and of mediocre intelligence.”
WOW! So women are another race? Haha, yeah I would say that is heretical. Furthermore:
AUGUSTINE
“I don’t see what sort of help woman was created to provide man with, if one excludes procreation. If woman is not given to man for help in bearing children, for what help could she be? To till the earth together? If help were needed for that, man would have been a better help for man. The same goes for comfort in solitude. How much more pleasure is it for life and conversation when two friends live together than when a man and a woman cohabitate?”
De Genesi ad literam (The Literal Meaning of Genesis) 9.5.9
“… woman was given to man, woman who was of small intelligence and who perhaps still lives more in accordance with the promptings of the inferior flesh than by superior reason. Is this why the apostle Paul does not attribute the image of God to her?”
De Genesi ad literam Book 11.42
Interesting stuff to say the least. I am not seeing this attitude in the interactions The Lord Jesus Christ had with women. TL;DR..take the ‘church fathers‘ (so-called) writings, and use them to build a campfire haha; and stick to God’s Word. All it takes is that one lil tablet of rat poison, you gonna drink from that punch bowl? Regard your soul with infinite times more caution than this earthly life.
