the closed thread on "True" Orthodoxy

[rusmeister]

Publicly repping Orthosdoxa's post.

 

[SeraphimSarov]

I have never seen any of the members here express the slightest urge to "modernize" and enumenicize the principles and tenets of the Church.

God forbid. How do you think I got here from Catholicism?

 

[Vasileios]

I formally request that OIT's post be deleted.
Thank you for bringing your love and unity into our forum.

Let me just say that I have just had it with people who think they know better than the entire mount Athos and two of our greatest saints of these days, the elders Porphyrios and Paisios.

These groups know fully well what these holy men have said but chose to ignore it and come up with all sorts of excuses as to "why the holy father said it". Protestantism at it's finest and they dare claim to be Orthodox.

I for one, will not show the same tolerance and respect that some posters here do for the "good, loving old calendarists". I think they are misguided souls who cause harm to the Body of Christ with schisms, with spreading of lies (albeit most of them like Michael do not know they are lies) and with presenting a false picture of Orthodoxy in general.

I have lost count of how many heterodox were turned off by the old calendarists, who show up willingly only when everything is bad to point their finger at the mess.

Like the elder Paisios said, they resemble the flies, always looking for filth to sit upon, and in a field of flowers they would not even know there are flowers around them, they would only know about the filth, because that is their desire and all they care about.

Personally, and with respect to jckstraw, if Michael has decided that he knows better than the elders and that he has better discernment than them, and wants to spread his old calendarist propaganda here, I say we do not let him.

My opinion of course.

 

[Ioan cel Nou]

I formally request that OIT's post be deleted.
Thank you for bringing your love and unity into our forum.

Let me just say that I have just had it with people who think they know better than the entire mount Athos and two of our greatest saints of these days, the elders Porphyrios and Paisios.

These groups know fully well what these holy men have said but chose to ignore it and come up with all sorts of excuses as to "why the holy father said it". Protestantism at it's finest and they dare claim to be Orthodox.

I for one, will not show the same tolerance and respect that some posters here do for the "good, loving old calendarists". I think they are misguided souls who cause harm to the Body of Christ with schisms, with spreading of lies (albeit most of them like Michael do not know they are lies) and with presenting a false picture of Orthodoxy in general.

I have lost count of how many heterodox were turned off by the old calendarists, who show up willingly only when everything is bad to point their finger at the mess.

Like the elder Paisios said, they resemble the flies, always looking for filth to sit upon, and in a field of flowers they would not even know there are flowers around them, they would only know about the filth, because that is their desire and all they care about.

Personally, and with respect to jckstraw, if Michael has decided that he knows better than the elders and that he has better discernment than them, and wants to spread his old calendarist propaganda here, I say we do not let him.

My opinion of course.

I second this. I couldn't agree more.

James

 

[xristos.anesti]

Schism is the biggest sin against the Church -

that is all.

 

[Oblio]

Those who follow the Schismatics are like Protestants who follow the Pope. They do what is right in their own eyes to follow a Bishop who has left the Church.

 

[kamikat]

hey i just wanted to say that i think its pretty lame that we have a rule that doesnt allow Michael to state his views -- like it or not, Ecumenism, the calendar, the schism churches, are issues in the modern Orthodox world and we should be allowed to talk about them.

This is why we have been discussing the possiblity of a subforum specifically for debate. As you can tell from that thread, several of the inquirers to ORthodoxy mentioned that that particular thread was causing them confusion and to stumble in their inquirery. That is why we need to have that kind of discussion in a place set aside for it.

 

[Greg the byzantine]

I formally request that OIT's post be deleted.
Thank you for bringing your love and unity into our forum.

Let me just say that I have just had it with people who think they know better than the entire mount Athos and two of our greatest saints of these days, the elders Porphyrios and Paisios.

These groups know fully well what these holy men have said but chose to ignore it and come up with all sorts of excuses as to "why the holy father said it". Protestantism at it's finest and they dare claim to be Orthodox.

I for one, will not show the same tolerance and respect that some posters here do for the "good, loving old calendarists". I think they are misguided souls who cause harm to the Body of Christ with schisms, with spreading of lies (albeit most of them like Michael do not know they are lies) and with presenting a false picture of Orthodoxy in general.

I have lost count of how many heterodox were turned off by the old calendarists, who show up willingly only when everything is bad to point their finger at the mess.

Like the elder Paisios said, they resemble the flies, always looking for filth to sit upon, and in a field of flowers they would not even know there are flowers around them, they would only know about the filth, because that is their desire and all they care about.

Personally, and with respect to jckstraw, if Michael has decided that he knows better than the elders and that he has better discernment than them, and wants to spread his old calendarist propaganda here, I say we do not let him.

My opinion of course.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Vasileios again.

 

[RobNJ]

I formally request that OIT's post be deleted.
.

THAT is what that little button marked "REPORT" is for!

 

[nestoj]

I formally request that OIT's post be deleted.
Thank you for bringing your love and unity into our forum.

Let me just say that I have just had it with people who think they know better than the entire mount Athos and two of our greatest saints of these days, the elders Porphyrios and Paisios.

These groups know fully well what these holy men have said but chose to ignore it and come up with all sorts of excuses as to "why the holy father said it". Protestantism at it's finest and they dare claim to be Orthodox.

I for one, will not show the same tolerance and respect that some posters here do for the "good, loving old calendarists". I think they are misguided souls who cause harm to the Body of Christ with schisms, with spreading of lies (albeit most of them like Michael do not know they are lies) and with presenting a false picture of Orthodoxy in general.

I have lost count of how many heterodox were turned off by the old calendarists, who show up willingly only when everything is bad to point their finger at the mess.

Like the elder Paisios said, they resemble the flies, always looking for filth to sit upon, and in a field of flowers they would not even know there are flowers around them, they would only know about the filth, because that is their desire and all they care about.

Personally, and with respect to jckstraw, if Michael has decided that he knows better than the elders and that he has better discernment than them, and wants to spread his old calendarist propaganda here, I say we do not let him.

My opinion of course.

Is there something wrong with old calendar?

I’m also troubled with most of concerns Michael and OIT have, only difference is I’m not abandoning The Church because I don’t like something that some Bishop has to say.

nestoj
God helps

 

[RobNJ]

Is there something wrong with old calendar?

nestoj
God helps

No, there are legitimate canonical groups using the old calendar. It's just that some schismatic groups, who have broken away from their legitimate jurisdictions, have taken up the calendar issue as a "rallying point"

 

[Emmanuel-A]

I often lurk on a french forum

www.forum-orthodoxe.com

Given their traditionalist position, the mods first made the choice to let everyone post (ie including "GOC" of various kind). They soon had to change their minds. Dialogue soon turned sour because GOC were incapable of respecting those who made the choice to stay in canonic jurisdictions. Slander was the only answer they could bring when their contradictions were exposed.

I respect some GOC for their publishing work and have friends among them, but in the end, dialogue is often a dead end because of their pre-existing schismatic attitude (any serene exam of their canonic situation is impossible, and they often hide behind this peculiar ecclesiology : "whatever the human passions that explain our ailing canonic situation, at least we're not oecumenists").

 

[Macarius]

Is there something wrong with old calendar?

I’m also troubled with most of concerns Michael and OIT have, only difference is I’m not abandoning The Church because I don’t like something that some Bishop has to say.

nestoj
God helps

I must second the notion that there is nothing whatsoever wrong with the Old or New calander. My SF uses the Old Calander! He just isn't old calander-IST. It's the schism, not the calander, that is the issue.

I agree that Orthodox Christians could discuss whether or not we should use the old or new calander. But a schismatic does not belong at the table. They have left the church.

 

[Macarius]

I must second the notion that there is nothing whatsoever wrong with the Old or New calander. My SF uses the Old Calander! He just isn't old calander-IST. It's the schism, not the calander, that is the issue.

I agree that Orthodox Christians could discuss whether or not we should use the old or new calander. But a schismatic does not belong at the table. They have left the church.

I also wish to say that this thread should be moved to the new forum or closed as soon as the debate forum is available. I don't want it confusing more people than it already has...

Just my opinion though.

 

[nestoj]

No, there are legitimate canonical groups using the old calendar. It's just that some schismatic groups, who have broken away from their legitimate jurisdictions, have taken up the calendar issue as a "rallying point"

I know, mine is one of them - canonical groups using the old calendar.

I was just getting the feeling that, in order to defend Orthodox Church, attack was made on any use of old calendar – that’s a same thing schismatics are doing – find something you don’t like and attack everything because of that. I know what I don’t like, but since I maybe wrong, and I KNOW that Church will always triumph and separate right from wrong, I restrain my judgment. I suggest rest of the brethren with similar concerns do the same.

nestoj
God helps

 

[RobNJ]

I know, mine is one of them - canonical groups using the old calendar.

I was just getting the feeling that, in order to defend Orthodox Church, attack was made on any use of old calendar – that’s a same thing schismatics are doing – find something you don’t like and attack everything because of that. I know what I don’t like, but since I maybe wrong, and I KNOW that Church will always triumph and separate right from wrong, I restrain my judgment. I suggest rest of the brethren with similar concerns do the same.

nestoj
God helps

I usually make an effort to make a firm distinction between the Old Calendar people & the Old Calendarist people

 

[SeraphimSarov]

As you can tell from that thread, several of the inquirers to ORthodoxy mentioned that that particular thread was causing them confusion and to stumble in their inquirery. That is why we need to have that kind of discussion in a place set aside for it.

Emphasis mine. Doesn't that say it all?

 

[nestoj]

I usually make an effort to make a firm distinction between the Old Calendar people & the Old Calendarist people

It wasn't you. I just quoted your post cause you ware first to respond to my question. And I completely agree with you.

*Sigh*, maybe it's good that we don't have any faith reasons to argue, so we find them in politics....

nestoj
God helps

 

[ma2000]

It wasn't you. I just quoted your post cause you ware first to respond to my question. And I completely agree with you.

*Sigh*, maybe it's good that we don't have any faith reasons to argue, so we find them in politics....

nestoj
God helps

I hope it wasn't me, because I have a great respect on the Serbian Orthodox Church and the other canonical Orthodox Churches.
Forgive me.

God bless!

 

[jckstraw72]

well lets rock a debate sub-forum then, that sounds like a good idea.