School Field Trip to Teacher's Lesbian Wedding Sparks Controversy

[EnemyPartyII]

It definitely happens. I've seen kids of this background go overboard in reaction to the sheltering they received as children.

Of course, I've seen how some members of far-right Christian sects are beginning to look at arranging marriages for some of these kids.

I've met a couple of home schooled or "alternately" (e.g. Steiner schooled)schooled young adults... And not one of them has been able to integrate into mainstream workplaces or higher education without problems.

Some of these problems are relatively minor, but some are significant.

All of the ones I have met have difficulty understanding appropriate social boundaries, which tends to get them labelled as odd, and is a barrier to them achieving genuine friendship, not to mention the damage it can do to a career if they don't overcome it, but the real tragic cases are the kids who leave home, where they've had a parent filtering their imput from the outside world for the past 18 years, suddenly confronted with the modern world in all its sumpuous, tactile, lurid glory, who come completely off the rails, and end up pregnant, nuked on drugs, financially ripped off, abused, or all of the above within months of leaving home.

I understand the desire to shield your kids from unpleasantness, but the world is an unpleasant place, and you can't be there to hold juniors hand all the time...

 

[Crazy Liz]

Is it wrong for students to go to a field trip to a native american dance or ceremony?
(I went to several of these as a student)

Is it wrong for students to learn about the horrors of the holocaust with a field trip to the Museum of Tolerance?
(I went there 3 times as a student)

Is it wrong to attend a puritan or quaker colony recreation and learn about their beliefs in a sort of live interactive theater style?

Is it wrong for students to attend the wedding of their heterosexual teacher as a field trip?

Is it wrong for students to attend the funeral (let's say a catholic funeral for this example) of a teacher or follow student as a field trip?

let's remember that field trips always require parent approval...

so how is a same sex wedding different than these?

My questions, as well.

 

[*Starlight*]

What exactly were the educational benefits of such a trip?

There are very big. The children could see for real that love between homosexuals is the same as the love between heterosexuals, and they express it in the same way. That would make at least some of them more accepting towards differences among people, so as a result it makes them better people.

 

[No Swansong]

There are very big. The children could see for real that love between homosexuals is the same as the love between heterosexuals, and they express it in the same way. That would make at least some of them more accepting towards differences among people, so as a result it makes them better people.

Hello my young friend how have you been? Cola and I were talking about you just the other day.

I'll think you may have missed that I used this question to introduce that indeed there would be much to learn from such a field trip.

 

[Texas Lynn]

Easy to say when it's not your children in the line of fire.

In my case, mine are.

I don't know if you know what Brooklyn is like but since before the Depression (well, maybe not before the Depression of 1893) it's been sterotyped as a Gangsta's Paradise and there has been some truth in that.

Of course, the bulk of school shootings occur in the Heartland---places like Jonesboro, Arkansas, and Paducah, Kentucky. And it's not the values of Hollywood and Brooklyn causing those, but values those kids learned right in their own Heartland homes. One of those values is intolerance and the idea bullying of LGBTs is a good thing to do. Efforts such as this one are designed to counter the hatred against LGBTs though I agree it is a little bit overreaching but the intent was good. The intent to keep kids out of public schools due to things like this however, is a form of hatred and most unfortunate.

 

[Zaac]

In my case, mine are.

I don't know if you know what Brooklyn is like but since before the Depression (well, maybe not before the Depression of 1893) it's been sterotyped as a Gangsta's Paradise and there has been some truth in that.

Of course, the bulk of school shootings occur in the Heartland---places like Jonesboro, Arkansas, and Paducah, Kentucky. And it's not the values of Hollywood and Brooklyn causing those, but values those kids learned right in their own Heartland homes. One of those values is intolerance and the idea bullying of LGBTs is a good thing to do. Efforts such as this one are designed to counter the hatred against LGBTs though I agree it is a little bit overreaching but the intent was good. The intent to keep kids out of public schools due to things like this however, is a form of hatred and most unfortunate.

What is a form of hatred is the belief that anything that does not promote the liberal agenda is spurred on by hatred.

Do liberals hate conservatives so much that the best they can do is call them hateful for disagreeing with their values or lack thereof?

Liberals are doing the same thing with the election. If you disagree with Obama, you're branded hateful and a racist.

Frankly, I don't care if liberals think I hate LGBTs. I'd much rather stand before God's throne with assurance that I shared His truth in love than to not share His truth and be accused of hate.

 

[No Swansong]

In my case, mine are.

I don't know if you know what Brooklyn is like but since before the Depression (well, maybe not before the Depression of 1893) it's been sterotyped as a Gangsta's Paradise and there has been some truth in that.

Of course, the bulk of school shootings occur in the Heartland---places like Jonesboro, Arkansas, and Paducah, Kentucky. And it's not the values of Hollywood and Brooklyn causing those, but values those kids learned right in their own Heartland homes. One of those values is intolerance and the idea bullying of LGBTs is a good thing to do. Efforts such as this one are designed to counter the hatred against LGBTs though I agree it is a little bit overreaching but the intent was good. The intent to keep kids out of public schools due to things like this however, is a form of hatred and most unfortunate.

And how many shootings at your childrens' school, that they were present for? And even if they were; it is your choice to keep your children in harms way. I was not willing to do so. My responsibility to them is greater than my responsibility to every one else. By the way not everything is about sexuality, there is no reason to compound these tragedies by trying to attach them to your social cause.

 

[Crazy Liz]

And how many shootings at your childrens' school, that they were present for? And even if they were; it is your choice to keep your children in harms way. I was not willing to do so. My responsibility to them is greater than my responsibility to every one else. By the way not everything is about sexuality, there is no reason to compound these tragedies by trying to attach them to your social cause.

You have no clue at all about Lynn's children.

And I'll bet, unlike you, she doesn't have the option to take them out of public school, even if she wanted to.

 

[Texas Lynn]

What is a form of hatred is the belief that anything that does not promote the liberal agenda is spurred on by hatred.

Do liberals hate conservatives so much that the best they can do is call them hateful for disagreeing with their values or lack thereof?

Kiberals are doing the same thing with the election. If you disagree with Obama, you're branded hateful and a racist.

Frankly, I don't care if liberals think I hate LGBTs. I'd much rather stand before God's throne with assurance that I shared His truth in love than to not share His truth and be accused of hate.

It is genrally undestood that rhetorical questions do not require answers.

 

[Zaac]

It is genrally undestood that rhetorical questions do not require answers.

It is also generally understood that when you ask a question, you follow it with a QUESTION MARK.

And if you carefully look, your statement to which I responded to which you just responded, did not ask a question. You made STATEMENTS.

 

[Texas Lynn]

And how many shootings at your childrens' school, that they were present for? And even if they were; it is your choice to keep your children in harms way. I was not willing to do so. My responsibility to them is greater than my responsibility to every one else. By the way not everything is about sexuality, there is no reason to compound these tragedies by trying to attach them to your social cause.

Well, this is what I can say about that: we lived in Central Texas in 1991 when there was a mass murder by a crazed gunman at Luby's Cafeteria in Killeen. After the restaurant reopened, many people refused to go there and eventually the location closed for good in 2000. A Chinese Buffet now is operating in the location but no doubt some still refuse to go there. Those people who refused to go there were stupid. There is no place on God's green earth that is in that sense free from "harm's way". Sure, there was the remote possibility of a copycat, but, there's a remote possibility you'll be shot at at the gas station. The only alternative is go live in a cave with Bigfoot.

Blaming school shootings on the public schools is just as stupid.

Sure, not everything is about sexuality. But some others were advocating taking kids out of public schools due to this incident in the thread. It was you who brought up school shootings. Nice attempt to change the subject but it doesn't fool anybody.

 

[Texas Lynn]

You have no clue at all about Lynn's children.

And I'll bet, unlike you, she doesn't have the option to take them out of public school, even if she wanted to.

Well, money's tight, but it's tough all over. Our kids are trained in the use of firearms. I suppose we have the option to send 'em to segregation academies if we wanted to if we'd just eat more beans and rice.

The public schools are the foundation of America's greatness and should not be abandoned due to irrational fear.

 

[No Swansong]

You have no clue at all about Lynn's children.

And I'll bet, unlike you, she doesn't have the option to take them out of public school, even if she wanted to.

I made no comment whatsoever about Lynn's children. What would even prompt a comment like that from you? As for the option to take them out or not I had to create that option. Our lives were dramatically turned upside down with the decision to home school. Schedules and jobs had to be changed. I had to postpone my education etc. I am not attacking Lynn for not homeschooling I am defending my choice to do so after she commented that taking my children out of harms way was the "inappropriate" choice.

 

[No Swansong]

Well, this is what I can say about that: we lived in Central Texas in 1991 when there was a mass murder by a crazed gunman at Luby's Cafeteria in Killeen. After the restaurant reopened, many people refused to go there and eventually the location closed for good in 2000. A Chinese Buffet now is operating in the location but no doubt some still refuse to go there. Those people who refused to go there were stupid. There is no place on God's green earth that is in that sense free from "harm's way". Sure, there was the remote possibility of a copycat, but, there's a remote possibility you'll be shot at at the gas station. The only alternative is go live in a cave with Bigfoot.

Sure there is even the possibility that I could be shot in my own home but the likelihood of that happening is much less than if I walk through an area of town known to be a haven for crack dealers and their customers. I might even agree with you if there were only one isolated incident but instead there were three IN ONE WEEK!

Blaming school shootings on the public schools is just as stupid.

I agree, please note I didn't blame the school. These incidents happened just off school grounds. But bullets fly as those who were bystanders and were shot can attest to.

Sure, not everything is about sexuality. But some others were advocating taking kids out of public schools due to this incident in the thread.

While I would not do so, I support a parents right to decide differently.

It was you who brought up school shootings. Nice attempt to change the subject but it doesn't fool anybody.

I made no such attempt to change the subject. Please notice I brought up the shootings at the school as an answer to YOUR question. You asked me specifically what harm I was protecting my children from.

 

[No Swansong]

The public schools are the foundation of America's greatness and should not be abandoned due to irrational fear.

Agreed public schools are important to the U.S. and I am one "conservative" that actually supports our public schools in very tangible ways. I also advocate for a more accessible higher public education. However if your "irrational" comment was directed towards my situation I would ask what is irrational about assuming that there will be more incidents of violence in a location that had 3 in one week?

 

[Texas Lynn]

I might even agree with you if there were only one isolated incident but instead there were three IN ONE WEEK!

Okay, it's off topic. You're right.

While I would not do so, I support a parents right to decide differently.

They have a right but that doesn't make it the right thing to do. When hatred is taught to the next generation eventually somebody has to correct it.

 

[brightmorningstar]

To Texas Lynn,

They have a right but that doesn't make it the right thing to do. When hatred is taught to the next generation eventually somebody has to correct it.

What some people see as hatred others see as dysfuctional perversion and child abuse. I think I would rather see a discussion on it before anyone suggests ditching one for the other.

 

[Texas Lynn]

To Texas Lynn,
What some people see as hatred others see as dysfuctional perversion and child abuse. I think I would rather see a discussion on it before anyone suggests ditching one for the other.

I agree. People who would do things like withdraw kids from school over such a thing are a "classic "dysfunctional family" as much as that term is a redundancy and it is emotionally abusive to kids to teach them to hate but in the present reality not too much can be done about it until they grow into adults. It is certainly a "perversion" to have such extremist views. LGBT kids are often victims of child abuse, targeted by homophobic parents and caretakers.

 

[Crazy Liz]

LGBT kids are often victims of child abuse, targeted by homophobic parents and caretakers.

Maybe this is a subject for another thread, but this sentence intrigued me. I have seen some studies that correlate various forms of child abuse with children growing up to identify as LGBT. Usually, these are considered in the nature/nurture arguments as if the causal relationship, if any, must be abuse -> LGBT.

Are you thinking that there is some characteristic of being LGBT that can be recognized in young children that may prompt others to abuse them? So that rather than the abuse having some causative effect on the child becoming LGBT, it is the other way around, and the child being LGBT somehow triggers abusive behavior toward them?

 

[Texas Lynn]

Maybe this is a subject for another thread, but this sentence intrigued me. I have seen some studies that correlate various forms of child abuse with children growing up to identify as LGBT. Usually, these are considered in the nature/nurture arguments as if the causal relationship, if any, must be abuse -> LGBT.

Are you thinking that there is some characteristic of being LGBT that can be recognized in young children that may prompt others to abuse them? So that rather than the abuse having some causative effect on the child becoming LGBT, it is the other way around, and the child being LGBT somehow triggers abusive behavior toward them?

I wish I had some studies in front of me but yes and yes. The idea that there's validity to the vampire theory of homosexuality (i.e., it's caused by child sexual abuse) has long since been thoroughly discredited. It is still being pushed by persons motivated by ideology over science though.

The three major types of child maltreatment (physical abuse, sexual abuse, and neglect) are all positively correllated with the children being LGBT. Physical abuse occurs after a child's sexual orientation becomes known. Children are subjected to sexual assault as a punishment for being LGBT, and a good portion of "throwaway" kids are LGBT, I've seen research stating 45% but some say higher.