Can a lay person preside over the Lord's Supper?

[Jay Sea]

I'd call that surprising since there is no theological reason for it not to be done in a home, so long as it doesn't amount to a private service.


With the understanding that you are engaging in a memorial with Bible reading, I don't see anything terribly controversial in that.

In Catholic teaching only priests can perform the Eucharist ( communion). The only sacraments that may be performed by lay people is Baptism if death of person is immanent and marriage where the couple are the ministers and the priest gives the churches blessing.

Happy Easter
in love
Jay

 

[pescador]

There is no reason that I know of that people can't partake of the Lord's supper whenever and where ever they want to. I, my family, and friends have done that often.

 

[Paul4JC]

Have we not installed a priesthood in place of the One who sat with us and ate.

"God and man at table are sat down"....

 

[bbbbbbb]

I do not understand what this means as a reply. Please say clearly what is in your heart to say.

Happy Easter
in love
Jay

I apologize for the confusion. You posted -"However there is another point for a special commitment among fellow christians to journey along the way together, no priest is needed but we break bread and drink wine or their equivalents and we say the words that Jeshua spoke for ourselves "This is my body....... This is my blood......." with the intention of facing whatever comes our way for the sake of others: are we prepared to take these words as putting our lives on the line with Jeshua. I do not know how strong I am, I might chicken out at the last minute but I intend to try."

That is a classic expression of what, in England, is known as Dissent. Dissent is to go outside the authorized (Church of England) structure and follow God, as you believe Him to lead you. Dissenters in England were once heavily persecuted and today are tolerated, having all legal rights once denied to them. They include all other Protestants, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, atheists, agnostics, and all manner of cults.

Thus it is that Dissenters have gone outside the religious camp to follow Jesus which is metphorically related to the verses I quoted in Hebrews 13.

 

[JIMINZ]

Thank you. However, you did assert that in order to have communion in our group we needed to have an elder or a deacon present. Do you actually believe that?

Sorry but I didn't say anything like that, as a matter of fact, I said the complete opposite.

You do not need anyone to officiate over your group, you are all children of God.
Someone get the box of Matzo, someone else get the Wine (Grape Juice) someone serve the Matzo, and another the Wine.

All the body can join in the Communion Service.

Is there then any need for a Pastor, Priest, Elder, Deacon, NO!

 

[Jay Sea]

I apologize for the confusion. You posted -"However there is another point for a special commitment among fellow christians to journey along the way together, no priest is needed but we break bread and drink wine or their equivalents and we say the words that Jeshua spoke for ourselves "This is my body....... This is my blood......." with the intention of facing whatever comes our way for the sake of others: are we prepared to take these words as putting our lives on the line with Jeshua. I do not know how strong I am, I might chicken out at the last minute but I intend to try."

That is a classic expression of what, in England, is known as Dissent. Dissent is to go outside the authorized (Church of England) structure and follow God, as you believe Him to lead you. Dissenters in England were once heavily persecuted and today are tolerated, having all legal rights once denied to them. They include all other Protestants, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Jews, atheists, agnostics, and all manner of cults.

Thus it is that Dissenters have gone outside the religious camp to follow Jesus which is metphorically related to the verses I quoted in Hebrews 13.

Thank you for your explanation. Then I am a dissenter, in the path of the Begines, the Cathars, who tried in there honesty to follow Jeshua where the "Church" did not in love make room for them. I take strength in that Jeshua did said that the one who healed in his name was with him not against him. So I struggle upon the way trusting in Jeshua's compassion and hospitality to a wanderer.

in love
Jay

 

[bbbbbbb]

Sorry but I didn't say anything like that, as a matter of fact, I said the complete opposite.

You do not need anyone to officiate over your group, you are all children of God.
Someone get the box of Matzo, someone else get the Wine (Grape Juice) someone serve the Matzo, and another the Wine.

All the body can join in the Communion Service.

Is there then any need for a Pastor, Priest, Elder, Deacon, NO!

Did you or did you not post this in #113?

Those qualifications would cover a whole bunch if not more Laypeople, there isn't anything special about the person having a Doctor of Divinity Degree, from some Seminary.

Thank you for your explanation. Then I am a dissenter, in the path of the Begines, the Cathars, who tried in there honesty to follow Jeshua where the "Church" did not in love make room for them. I take strength in that Jeshua did said that the one who healed in his name was with him not against him. So I struggle upon the way trusting in Jeshua's compassion and hospitality to a wanderer.

in love
Jay

Thank you. We are fellow dissenters, indeed.

 

[JIMINZ]

Did you or did you not post this in #113?

Those qualifications would cover a whole bunch if not more Laypeople, there isn't anything special about the person having a Doctor of Divinity Degree, from some Seminary.

I'm sorry for you misunderstanding of my post.

I was discussing with Albion the Scriptural qualifications of a bishop, Elder, and Deacon, that is all.

I was in no way saying that there had to be any of these persons present before a group such as yours could hold a Communion service in you home.

You as a Child of God have all the qualifications needed in order for you to officiate over such an service.

Anyone who would condemn you for doing so would just be Religiously Legalistic.....A modern day Pharisee.

In other words, there is no Biblical grounds for such a demand being made before a person such as yourself could hold such a service in you own home or the home of someone else.

A Layperson to me is someone who isn't a Bishop, Elder, Deacon but a normal regular churchgoer.

 

[bbbbbbb]

I'm sorry for you misunderstanding of my post.

I was discussing with Albion the Scriptural qualifications of a bishop, Elder, and Deacon, that is all.

I was in no way saying that there had to be any of these persons present before a group such as yours could hold a Communion service in you home.

You as a Child of God have all the qualifications needed in order for you to officiate over such an service.

Anyone who would condemn you for doing so would just be Religiously Legalistic.....A modern day Pharisee.

In other words, there is no Biblical grounds for such a demand being made before a person such as yourself could hold such a service in you own home or the home of someone else.

A Layperson to me is someone who isn't a Bishop, Elder, Deacon but a normal regular churchgoer.

Thank you for clarifying my misunderstanding. I apologize for my unwarranted posts. I am pleased that we are in agreement on this issue.

 

[Albion]

JIMINZ wrote:

Anyone who would condemn you for doing so would just be Religiously Legalistic.....A modern day Pharisee.

In other words, there is no Biblical grounds for such a demand being made before a person such as yourself could hold such a service in you own home or the home of someone else.[/quote

A Layperson to me is someone who isn't a Bishop, Elder, Deacon but a normal regular churchgoer.

Thank you for clarifying my misunderstanding. I apologize for my unwarranted posts. I am pleased that we are in agreement on this issue.

Just a minute, folks. A group of Christian gathered for prayer, a sermon, or etc. is not the same as a congregation celebrating the Lord's Supper/Holy Communion.

The belief that it doesn't take a deacon, priest, or bishop for there to be a prayer meeting, etc. does not address the matter of officiating at the Eucharist, the sacrament by which the consecration of the bread and wine and the distribution of it to the people occurs.

Yet that is the subject of this forum and this thread, not whether Christians can gather for some other purpose.

 

[JIMINZ]

JIMINZ wrote:



Just a minute, folks. A group of Christian gathered for prayer, a sermon, or etc. is not the same as a congregation celebrating the Lord's Supper/Holy Communion.

The belief that it doesn't take a deacon, priest, or bishop for there to be a prayer meeting, etc. does not address the matter of officiating at the Eucharist, the sacrament by which the consecration of the bread and wine and the distribution of it to the people occurs.

Yet that is the subject of this forum and this thread, not whether Christians can gather for some other purpose.

I take it that you are in disagreement with us then, am I correct?

 

[timothyu]

Who turned an act into a ritual, one thing born from another? Who laid claim to that ritual? Can anyone lay claim to an act or is it open to all?

 

[Albion]

I take it that you are in disagreement with us then, am I correct?

I thought I'd covered the issue adequately in that post, so I'll have to ask which part of the "with us" you are referring to. I don't know that I am in disagreement, but what are you addressing?

 

[JIMINZ]

I thought I'd covered the issue adequately in that post, so I'll have to ask which part of the "with us" you are referring to. I don't know that I am in disagreement, but what are you addressing?

It is our contention, if a person has a group meeting at his house, or the house of someone else, there does not need to be a Bishop, Priest, Elder, Deacon present in order for that person to hold a Communion Service.

The person officiating only needs to be a Christian in order for him to administer Communion to others.

 

[Albion]

It is our contention, if a person has a group meeting at his house, or the house of someone else, there does not need to be a Bishop, Elder, Deacon present in order for that person to hold a Communion Service.

Well, you know...almost every slant on every religious subject that the mind of man can come up with is accepted by someone. We have Roman Catholics and then we have Quakers and both are considered Christian although their worship practices are as far apart as can be imagined.

So the answer is "you can do whatever you want."

But IF the question is "Which way is the right way, Scripturally speaking?" the answer probably is that we need to have a duly called presbyter in order to officiate at a Communion service IF the idea is that it is considered to be a sacrament and more than just a memorial.

But if you think passing around bread and a cup with some accompanying prayers about this reminding the people of Christ's sacrifice, there's no reason not to go ahead. And I have the impression that such is what you have in mind.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Well, you know...almost every slant on every religious subject that the mind of man can come up with is accepted by someone. We have Roman Catholics and then we have Quakers and both are considered Christian although their worship practices are as far apart as can be imagined.

So the answer is "you can do whatever you want."

But IF the question is "Which way is the right way, Scripturally speaking?" the answer probably is that we need to have a duly called presbyter in order to officiate at a Communion service IF the idea is that it is considered to be a sacrament and more than just a memorial.

But if you think passing around bread and a cup with some accompanying prayers about this reminding the people of Christ's sacrifice, there's no reason not to go ahead. And I have the impression that such is what you have in mind.

Most denominations, including the Roman Catholic denomination, are in agreement that, if necessary, a sacrament such as baptism, can be administered by a layman, as in the case of Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch. I think most also believe that such an event, although biblically valid, is the exception and not the rule.

Concerning communion, one can use the same exception and say that under ordinary conditions, an elder or even a deacon is normally present in a church when the church does meet to remember our Lord in this manner. In the present circumstances churches such as the Catholic Church are unable to administer communion to their congregations except for the standard homebound communicants who would otherwise receive communion privately.

Dissenters, such as myself, see things differently, as you know. Thus, we continue to obey our Lord in remembering His death, burial, and resurrection through the breaking of bread. Whether or not you and/or the Anglican Church considers our actions (as you know, our communion is never recognized as being valid whether or not we have elders or deacons present) is of really no concern to me.

I am sorry that you are being deprived of this sacrament under the current circumstances and hope and pray that the restrictions will end sooner than later.

 

[Albion]

Most denominations, including the Roman Catholic denomination, are in agreement that, if necessary, a sacrament such as baptism, can be administered by a layman, as in the case of Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch. I think most also believe that such an event, although biblically valid, is the exception and not the rule.

Concerning communion, one can use the same exception and say that under ordinary conditions, an elder or even a deacon is normally present in a church when the church does meet to remember our Lord in this manner.

Well, that's a convenient rationalization, but I've already said people can do whatever they want. No one is going to break up the meeting and haul anyone off to the Inquisition.

But if what is wanted is the acceptable, the historic, and the Scriptural answer, no, the Eucharist is not administered under the same "rules" as Baptism.

In the present circumstances churches such as the Catholic Church are unable to administer communion to their congregations except for the standard homebound communicants who would otherwise receive communion privately.

Dissenters, such as myself, see things differently, as you know. Thus, we continue to obey our Lord in remembering His death, burial, and resurrection through the breaking of bread.

Whether or not you and/or the Anglican Church considers our actions (as you know, our communion is never recognized as being valid whether or not we have elders or deacons present) is of really no concern to me.

I seem to be getting a lot of correspondence trying to justify to me, and from several different angles, the practice that you are defending, however.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Well, that's a convenient rationalization, but I've already said people can do whatever they want. No one is going to break up the meeting and haul anyone off to the Inquisition.

But if what is wanted is the acceptable, the historic, and the Scriptural answer, no, the Eucharist is not administered under the same "rules" as Baptism.

I seem to be getting a lot of correspondence trying to justify to me, and from several different angles, the practice that you are defending, however.

I think you understand our position and I hope we understand yours. The significance, of course, is not our disagreement but whether or not God validates our actions. On my part, I respect your position and appreciate your forthright posts. Thank you.