Sinless : Saints of God

[Chaleb]

-
What is the difference between a Christian, and an unbeliever?
There are a few.

You, if you are born again, and not just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious) are going to heaven, and they are not.
You are born again, and they are not.
They have their sin, and Christ has all of yours.

2 Corinthians 5:21

Hebrews 10:14


Listen,

When you are working out your salvation, you are learning how to exist within it.
This is how you "work out". You work out, what you already possess. = "The Gift of Salvation".
Only The BORN Again have received this Gift, that is the "Gift of Righteousness".

Jesus said : ""You MUST be born.........again">........and water can't do that for you.


If you are born agian, then you HAVE Salvation.....You are not tryng to keep it, you are trying to learn how to exist within its particular rules....
= "work out your salvation".""...

Law Keeping and Commandment keeping are not involved., as this is the NEW Covenant.

The 1st rule, and most important, is to learn how to see yourself only as God sees you after you are born again.
This is a must do. As if you don't, you will never understand the New Testament, and you will never walk in the Spirit.
So, you have to get that "renewed mind" as Paul teaches.

Now, before you were born again, you had a "body that is dead because of sin".. and you still do..... and you were what Paul defines as the "old man". and your mind is Carnal. ("in the Flesh").
The carnal nature that is "flesh", is actually the nature of the devil. The devil's nature is "sin", and you were a sinner, before you were "saved" from this situation., as To be a sinner, is to have the devil's nature., and that is why Jesus said.."You are of YOUR Father, the devil, and the lusts of YOUR Father, you will do".
See that?? That is the SIN NATURE. That is the "fallen Adamic nature".
And THAT, is the "old man", or the carnal "Mind of the flesh.""

When you are born again, this carnal flesh old man dies with Christ. It , this flesh nature, the "old man" is "crucified with Christ" and is dead.
Paul tells you to understand that and to never again see yourself as that which is "dead". You are to "reckon it Dead".
And.....When you believe this, and you exist in the mind of this understanding, you faith is correct, and you are working out your salvation according to this Truth regarding who you have become as a born again, "New Creation" "In Christ".
You are learning to SEE YOURSELF as only God sees you, and THAT is how you learn to walk in the Spirit.
If you are just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious, then you are not working anything out. You are in fact, ... Lost.

Now where are you sins, if you are born again?
They are all gone.
You have no sin. None. ... See, If you had any, you would be the same as an unbeliever, and Christ would not have them, and you would still be damned.
However, because you are born again, this has happened.

2nd Corinthians 5:21
"For God made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, and we have become the righteousness of God in Him.""

Notice who has your sin.
Christ has your sin. He actually became and bore all your sin. He has them all, and you have ZERO.
When Jesus came out of the Grave, your sin stayed there., dead.
You are "the righteousness of God", because Jesus became your sin.
See that? That is SALVATION.

And because you have no sin , you are become these verses....

Romans 6:6....""For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the carnal nature (the old man) that was previously ruled by sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin-- and......

6:7 .."For he who has died has been freed from sin."""

So, Saint.. that is you now., if you are born again, and not just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious.
Christ has all you sin, died for them all, and you are made free from them, because they are on HIM.
He's already been JUDGED for them all, 2000 yrs ago.
And your carnal nature, that was your previous SELF, is now DEAD, and you have become a "new Creation". = Born again... And this New Creation is sinless. Your born again SPIRIT has no sin in you or on you, and your previous carnal nature is DEAD, DEAD, DEAD.

You are FREED.
You are freed from sin, because your old "sinning self is DEAD" and all your sin is taken by Christ, and you are no longer "under the Law" that previously defined you as a sinner.
You now remain, RIGHTEOUS, SINLESS, and born again.,, as a "new Creation" "In Christ"...."made righteous", as "the righteousness of GOD, in Christ".

That's the REAL You, if you are born again., and there is no other that GOD sees or knows.
He's only sees you as that SON/Daughter of God, at all times....."made righteous", "in Christ"...>"seated in Heavenly places"...>"ONE with God".

So, when you read verses that talk about having sin, and sinning, and confessing... then recognize that these verses are not directed at the born again.
The born again are :

1 John 3:9

The Born again are "complete in Him",... The BORN AGAIN are become the Righteousness of God, with no sin in us, and no sin on us.
We are "made righteous", "blood bought", and remain as pure as the Blood of Jesus for as long as God lives, as we live IN HIM....."One with God, and Christ".

That is our :

= ETERNAL LIFE

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Law Keeping and Commandment keeping are not involved., as this is the NEW Covenant.

This is what God said about His New Covenant and He is the Author...

Hebrews 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

Hebrews 10:16 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

So instead of deleting His laws from the Old Covenant, He writes them in the hearts and minds of His New Covenant believers. I would not want to write myself out of God's covenant promise or change our mind on what God placed there through love.

This is what scripture says about God's saints, so you seem to be having a disagreement with the Text.

Revelation 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus

 

[Chaleb]

Hebrews 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel

Not at all.
See, you just posted a verse that says "the house of Israel".

Well, the born again in the "time of the Gentiles' are not the House of Israel.
You dont know this, because you dont know anything about the NT.
This is why you posted a verse that talks about the HOUSE OF ISREAL, and not the """"Body of Christ""", SabbathBlessing.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Not at all.
See, you just posted a verse that says "the house of Israel".

Well, the born again in the "time of the Gentiles' are not the House of Israel.
You dont know this, because you dont know anything about the NT.
This is why you posted a verse that talks about the HOUSE OF ISREAL, and not the """"Body of Christ""", SabbathBlessing.

Perhaps that's the problem, only reading part of a verse....and leaving out the important context.

Hebrews 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

There is only One God and one people and if you are in Christ (His Covenant) we are grafted in through faith, not a nationality. There is no Jew or Gentile in God's covenant promise, just those with faith in Christ. Gal 3:26-28

 

[Chaleb]

Perhaps that's the problem,

I pointed out your "problem with tbe text"...

You dont understand the difference between the House of Israel and the gentile body of Christ.
I dont foresee you figuring that out anytime soon., but i'm certain you'll keep posting more of what you dont understand..... as people like you, always do, SabbathBlessing.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I pointed out your "problem with tbe text"...

You dont understand the difference between the House of Israel and the gentile body of Christ.
I dont foresee you figuring that out anytime soon., but i'm certain you'll keep posting more of what you dont understand..... as people like you, always do, SabbathBlessing.

Show me from scripture where God made a covenant with the Gentiles.

 

[BobRyan]

If you are born agian, then you HAVE Salvation.....You are not tryng to keep it, you are trying to learn how to exist within its particular rules....
= "work out your salvation".""...

Law Keeping and Commandment keeping are not involved., as this is the NEW Covenant.

more Bible - less supposition please.

1 Cor 9:
16 For if I preach the gospel, I have nothing to boast of, for I am under compulsion; for woe is me if I do not preach the gospel. 17 For if I do this voluntarily, I have a reward; but if against my will, I have a stewardship entrusted to me. 18 What then is my reward? That, when I preach the gospel, I may offer the gospel without charge, so as not to make full use of my right in the gospel.
19 For though I am free from all men, I have made myself a slave to all, so that I may win more. 20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, so that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law though not being myself under the Law, so that I might win those who are under the Law; 21 to those who are without law, as without law, though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ, so that I might win those who are without law. 22 To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak; I have become all things to all men, so that I may by all means save some. 23 I do all things for the sake of the gospel, so that I may become a fellow partaker of it.
24 Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win. 25 Everyone who competes in the games exercises self-control in all things. They then do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable. 26 Therefore I run in such a way, as not without aim; I box in such a way, as not beating the air; 27 but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached the gospel to others, I myself will not be disqualified from it

Matt 18:
32 Then summoning him, his lord *said to him, ‘You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?’ 34 And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him. 35 My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.”

Rom 11:18 do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

Gal 5:4 You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

 

[BobRyan]

Law Keeping and Commandment keeping are not involved., as this is the NEW Covenant.

More Bible - less supposition when addressing the topic of the NEW Covenant

Start by actually quoting the NEW Covenant rather than holding the details of it at such a great distance.

Jer 31
31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord. 33 “But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord, “I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the Lord, “for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”

It is the exact same- unchanged - verbatim - in the New Testament - Heb 8:6-12

Rom 3:31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.

 

[timothyu]

So instead of deleting His laws from the Old Covenant, He writes them in the hearts and minds of His New Covenant believers.

Yes, if we are to do His will and not our own, it its obvious we must obey His commandments, both old and new. So much for the politicization of Christianity during the last century that self justified all sorts of evil self serving deeds at the hands of man.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Yes, if we are to do His will and not our own, it its obvious we must obey His commandments, both old and new. So much for the politicization of Christianity during the last century that self justified all sorts of evil self serving deeds at the hands of man.

The devil has been hard at work deceiving as many as he can, fulfilling the prophecy that he deceives the whole world. The solution is to be sanctified by the Truth of God's Word John 17:17 and all of God's commandments are Truth Psalms 119:151 and God's will for us Psalms 40:8 Hebrews 8:10

 

[timothyu]

In other words, as He told A&E and all through the Bible, put His will before our own will which tends to be self centered.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

In other words, as He told A&E and all through the Bible, put His will before our own will which tends to be self centered.

Selfishness is the reason behind all sin our will above God's.

 

[Chaleb]

Gal 5:4 You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.

None of your verses are connected to anything.

This last one, is the deceived believer, who Paul said is "bewitched" and "does not obey the truth".
Paul said they started in Faith, then became law keepers. "Legalists" = "fallen from Grace".

 

[Chaleb]

Jer 31
31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,

Try to use the NT when talking about the "Time of the Gentiles' where we find Paul's Gospel, in effect.

Paul's Gospel is "the preaching of the Cross", "Is the power of God unto Salvation".

One of the things to know is that "Christ is the End of the Law for Righteousness" (Regarding the born again).

If. you're not actually born again, but are just a water baptized hyper religious Law Keeper, then what Paul teaches wont help, as Paul's doctrine is for the born again body of Christ only.

 

[BobRyan]

More Bible - less supposition when addressing the topic of the NEW Covenant

Start by actually quoting the NEW Covenant rather than holding the details of it at such a great distance.

Jer 31
31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord. 33 “But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord, “I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the Lord, “for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”

It is the exact same- unchanged - verbatim - in the New Testament - Heb 8:6-12

Rom 3:31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.

Try to use the NT when talking about the "Time of the Gentiles' where we find Paul's Gospel, in effect.

My post above -- we find this

"It is the exact same- unchanged - verbatim - in the New Testament - Heb 8:6-12"

1. Paul writes Hebrews
2. Paul points to the New Covenant as unchanged by quoting it verbatim in his NT letter.

So that makes it pretty easy.

Paul's Gospel is "the preaching of the Cross", "Is the power of God unto Salvation".

Paul says in Gal 1:6-9 there is only ONE Gospel
Paul says in Gal 3:8 that the one and only Gospel - was "preached to Abraham"
Paul says in Heb 4 "The Gospel was preached to US just as it was to THEM also"
Peter says "10 As to this salvation, the prophets who prophesied of the grace that would come to you made careful searches and inquiries, 11 seeking to know what person or time the Spirit of Christ within them was indicating as He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow." 1 Pet 1:10-11

So there is really no reason to ignore the text of the NEW Covenant when talking about it. In fact I embrace that text as did Paul.

One of the things to know is that "Christ is the End of the Law for Righteousness" (Regarding the born again).

It is the goal of the law to lead the lost sinner to know that they are guilty of sin and to then embrace the Gospel of Christ. That is the work of the law for the lost. But for the saved the New Covenant says it is written on the heart.

So then Paul says of the saved -- "31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? Far from it! On the contrary, we establish the Law." Rom 3:31

 

[Chaleb]

Paul says in Gal 3:8 that the one and only Gospel - was "preached to Abraham"


So then Paul says of the saved -- "31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? Far from it! On the contrary, we establish the Law." Rom 3:31

But its not established as SALVATiON.
As the LAW is not Salvation.
And Paul's Gospel is not "Law" or "Commandments".

Legalism, is a person who is this.... "i can't talk about the Cross, or the Blood of Jesus, or what it means to be in Christ, made righteous, but i can talk till 4 Sunday's from now about LAW LAW LAW LAW LAW and LAW".

The Gospel of the Grace of God, is Paul's Gospel.

Not "law", or law keeping., as its Paul who wrote....>"you are not under the dominion of the law" because "Christ has redeemed you from the CURSE of the LAW"

"you are not UNDER THE LAW.........(the born again) but Under GRACE"..

 

[timothyu]

Paul says in Gal 3:8 that the one and only Gospel - was "preached to Abraham"

The same one Jesus taught.. put the will of God ahead of our own (and He tested him on it).

 

[Soyeong]

-
What is the difference between a Christian, and an unbeliever?
There are a few.

You, if you are born again, and not just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious) are going to heaven, and they are not.
You are born again, and they are not.
They have their sin, and Christ has all of yours.

2 Corinthians 5:21

Hebrews 10:14


Listen,

When you are working out your salvation, you are learning how to exist within it.
This is how you "work out". You work out, what you already possess. = "The Gift of Salvation".
Only The BORN Again have received this Gift, that is the "Gift of Righteousness".

Jesus said : ""You MUST be born.........again">........and water can't do that for you.


If you are born agian, then you HAVE Salvation.....You are not tryng to keep it, you are trying to learn how to exist within its particular rules....
= "work out your salvation".""...

Law Keeping and Commandment keeping are not involved., as this is the NEW Covenant.

The 1st rule, and most important, is to learn how to see yourself only as God sees you after you are born again.
This is a must do. As if you don't, you will never understand the New Testament, and you will never walk in the Spirit.
So, you have to get that "renewed mind" as Paul teaches.

Now, before you were born again, you had a "body that is dead because of sin".. and you still do..... and you were what Paul defines as the "old man". and your mind is Carnal. ("in the Flesh").
The carnal nature that is "flesh", is actually the nature of the devil. The devil's nature is "sin", and you were a sinner, before you were "saved" from this situation., as To be a sinner, is to have the devil's nature., and that is why Jesus said.."You are of YOUR Father, the devil, and the lusts of YOUR Father, you will do".
See that?? That is the SIN NATURE. That is the "fallen Adamic nature".
And THAT, is the "old man", or the carnal "Mind of the flesh.""

When you are born again, this carnal flesh old man dies with Christ. It , this flesh nature, the "old man" is "crucified with Christ" and is dead.
Paul tells you to understand that and to never again see yourself as that which is "dead". You are to "reckon it Dead".
And.....When you believe this, and you exist in the mind of this understanding, you faith is correct, and you are working out your salvation according to this Truth regarding who you have become as a born again, "New Creation" "In Christ".
You are learning to SEE YOURSELF as only God sees you, and THAT is how you learn to walk in the Spirit.
If you are just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious, then you are not working anything out. You are in fact, ... Lost.

Now where are you sins, if you are born again?
They are all gone.
You have no sin. None. ... See, If you had any, you would be the same as an unbeliever, and Christ would not have them, and you would still be damned.
However, because you are born again, this has happened.

2nd Corinthians 5:21
"For God made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, and we have become the righteousness of God in Him.""

Notice who has your sin.
Christ has your sin. He actually became and bore all your sin. He has them all, and you have ZERO.
When Jesus came out of the Grave, your sin stayed there., dead.
You are "the righteousness of God", because Jesus became your sin.
See that? That is SALVATION.

And because you have no sin , you are become these verses....

Romans 6:6....""For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the carnal nature (the old man) that was previously ruled by sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin-- and......

6:7 .."For he who has died has been freed from sin."""

So, Saint.. that is you now., if you are born again, and not just water baptized (sprinkled) and religious.
Christ has all you sin, died for them all, and you are made free from them, because they are on HIM.
He's already been JUDGED for them all, 2000 yrs ago.
And your carnal nature, that was your previous SELF, is now DEAD, and you have become a "new Creation". = Born again... And this New Creation is sinless. Your born again SPIRIT has no sin in you or on you, and your previous carnal nature is DEAD, DEAD, DEAD.

You are FREED.
You are freed from sin, because your old "sinning self is DEAD" and all your sin is taken by Christ, and you are no longer "under the Law" that previously defined you as a sinner.
You now remain, RIGHTEOUS, SINLESS, and born again.,, as a "new Creation" "In Christ"...."made righteous", as "the righteousness of GOD, in Christ".

That's the REAL You, if you are born again., and there is no other that GOD sees or knows.
He's only sees you as that SON/Daughter of God, at all times....."made righteous", "in Christ"...>"seated in Heavenly places"...>"ONE with God".

So, when you read verses that talk about having sin, and sinning, and confessing... then recognize that these verses are not directed at the born again.
The born again are :

1 John 3:9

The Born again are "complete in Him",... The BORN AGAIN are become the Righteousness of God, with no sin in us, and no sin on us.
We are "made righteous", "blood bought", and remain as pure as the Blood of Jesus for as long as God lives, as we live IN HIM....."One with God, and Christ".

That is our :

= ETERNAL LIFE

Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers how to obey God's law by word and by example and he said that faith is one of the weightier matters of the law, so the difference between a follower of Christ and an unbeliever is whether they have repented and and are following God's law in accordance with the Gospel.

In 1 John 3:4-10, those who do not practice righteousness in obedience to God's law are not born again, so someone who speaks against doing that has no grounds to consider themselves to be born again. In Romans 8:4-14, those who are born of the Spirit are contracted with those who have carnal minds, who are enemies of God, who refuse to submit to His law.

You were almost on the right track by saying that we have to exist within its particular rules, but then you contradicted yourself by saying that those rules are not involved because of the New Covenant even though Jeremiah 31:33 says that the New Covenant involves following God's law.

Sin is the transgression of God's law, so if we have no sin, then that means that we are living in obedience to it. Jesus gave himself to pay the penalty for our sin so that we would go and sin no more, not so that we would consider ourselves free to do what God has revealed to be sin.

 

[timothyu]

How about saying God's will instead of law

 

[BobRyan]

Paul says in Gal 1:6-9 there is only ONE Gospel
Paul says in Gal 3:8 that the one and only Gospel - was "preached to Abraham"
Paul says in Heb 4 "The Gospel was preached to US just as it was to THEM also"
Peter says "10 As to this salvation, the prophets who prophesied of the grace that would come to you made careful searches and inquiries, 11 seeking to know what person or time the Spirit of Christ within them was indicating as He predicted the sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow." 1 Pet 1:10-11

So there is really no reason to ignore the text of the NEW Covenant when talking about it. In fact I embrace that text as did Paul.

It is the goal of the law to lead the lost sinner to know that they are guilty of sin and to then embrace the Gospel of Christ. That is the work of the law for the lost. But for the saved the New Covenant says it is written on the heart.

So then Paul says of the saved -- "31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? Far from it! On the contrary, we establish the Law." Rom 3:31

But its not established as SALVATiON.

It is established. period.

Interesting that you only quote that one snip from my post given the volume of texts in that post that you apparently struggle with.

The fact that we don't earn salvation by works does not change that fact. Which means bashing the Law is not going to ever be "inline with ESTABLISHING it".

This is irrefutable.

Paul COMMANDs obedience to the LAW in Eph 6:2 this is irrefutable.

But he never claims that obedience - earns salvation. Still that is a far cry from condemning the LAW of God.

1 John 5:3 - this IS The LOVE of God that we KEEP His Commandments.
Ex 20:6 "LOVE Me and KEEP My Commandments"