O That the Atheist....

[Larniavc]

I'd still say there are many excuses to deny God.

You don’t need to deny something that you don’t believe. Unless you mean “I don’t believe gods or the supernatural exist”: in which case why do you need an excuse?

 

[Larniavc]

The tremendous odds AGAINST everything happening by chance or natural selection,

Those odds are not as high as the chance that it’s your version of the Christian god being THE creator god of all things. That’s mindblowingly more unlikely than it all coming together absent such divine effort.

 

[essentialsaltes]

O that the Atheist would quit questioning

No, I'm not going to quit questioning anything.

Neither should anybody else.

One of the basic principles of communication is to tailor your message to your audience - something this post has failed to do.

Unless the real audience was just fellow Christians. "Look thou upon my virtue! It hath been signalled! Marvel at my martyrdom as the unbelievers say mildly unkind things!"

 

[ViaCrucis]

I suspect the poster hit a nerve here. I pray that it go smoothly .

Generally speaking nobody likes being preached at.

As a Christian I am very rarely going to appreciate being preached at. I absolute love good preaching, it's one of the reasons I go to church, to hear God's word being preached, as a Christian I don't just like it, I need it. I need to hear God's word, I need good preaching.

I suspect the OP wouldn't appreciate being preached at either. It's just not something most people (and it doesn't matter what one's religious beliefs or lack thereof might be) like, being verbally assailed by someone generally doesn't go over well.

At this point is usually when someone is going to tell me that I'm contradicting the Great Commission. But I'm not. I believe in evangelism, I believe in declaring the Gospel to the world. What I don't think is good or useful is just preaching at people.

In the Lutheran tradition we often talk about evangelism in biblical terms, pointing to "Come and see". Evangelism as invitation. Not to be assailed by words; but if I believe that Jesus, the Crucified and Risen and living Jesus Christ, is truly alive and truly present in and through His Church, in and through Word and Sacrament, if there is, indeed real grace to be found here (as I believe there is), then that means there is a real encounter with that same Jesus Christ to be had here. The Gospel should be on my lips, the love of Christ in my heart and in my actions, the Holy Spirit sanctifying me and the whole Church, to be salt and light and a city on a hill.

Jesus doesn't need me to be loud and in anyone's face.
If I really have met Jesus, here in His Church, in His Word, in His Sacraments, then that should reflect out from me in how I live, in words and actions. Of course I'm going to talk about Jesus, talk about my faith, to talk about the hope I have. Of course I'm going to want to love others, of course I'm going to want to serve others. Will it ever be perfectly? No, hardly. But if Jesus really is the center of my world, then that's going to do something to me. God hasn't called me to be a missionary, but He has called me to take up my cross.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Nithavela]

O who lives in a pineapple under the sea?

 

[Paulos23]

At this point, most of my standard replies have already been said.

I will add this: What do you think you are accomplishing here?

 

[Desk trauma]

I'd still say there are many excuses to deny God. Much of it is rationalization. Someone may not think they're doing it intentionally, or deliberately to mock God, as they don't believe in His existence as Tinker Grey stated.
Still to look at the creation: the stars, the planets, the courses of the waters, the intricacies of our biology, life itself. The tremendous odds AGAINST everything happening by chance or natural selection, which would tend more toward chaos than order: these are evidences of Gods existence.
"Did you know there's an actual probability of your existence? It's infinitesimally small: about 1 in 400 trillion, apparently..
What is the chance that we exist?
1 in 10^2,685,000.
the odds are at least 36,000 to one against any random assemblage of ten components into a meaningful system...
The chance of the “simplest” cell forming randomly has been estimated to have no chance of ever occurring even in hundreds of billions of years..."
and so on.

Even Darwin had at least a vague belief in a Creator, though probably from a Deists point of view.

Ultimately, even if one were to accept all this, the reason must be in the heart as well: That is where faith and knowledge comes in. You must believe. People should believe because the Word say's to, but this is where I've said people find excuses not to believe, and consider the Bible just another book, which it is not. It is the written Word of God, and there is stuff woven into it under the surface, especially in the Hebrew that show it to be true, as well as numerous fulfilled prophecies exactly as they were written hundreds even thousands of years before hand.

Hebrews 11:1-6
"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
For by it the elders obtained a good report.
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."

Look at how amazingly the puddle is molded to fit the water.

 

[o_mlly]

What an atheist denies is the statement "[a] god exists."

Nope. The atheist just changes His name from Yahweh to (insert atheist's name here.)

 

[essentialsaltes]

Nope. The atheist just changes His name from Yahweh to (insert atheist's name here.)

There's plenty of us right here to talk to if you're interested in finding out what we actually think. These spiteful falsehoods are unbecoming.

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

Generally speaking nobody likes being preached at.

As a Christian I am very rarely going to appreciate being preached at. I absolute love good preaching, it's one of the reasons I go to church, to hear God's word being preached, as a Christian I don't just like it, I need it. I need to hear God's word, I need good preaching.

I suspect the OP wouldn't appreciate being preached at either. It's just not something most people (and it doesn't matter what one's religious beliefs or lack thereof might be) like, being verbally assailed by someone generally doesn't go over well.

At this point is usually when someone is going to tell me that I'm contradicting the Great Commission. But I'm not. I believe in evangelism, I believe in declaring the Gospel to the world. What I don't think is good or useful is just preaching at people.

In the Lutheran tradition we often talk about evangelism in biblical terms, pointing to "Come and see". Evangelism as invitation. Not to be assailed by words; but if I believe that Jesus, the Crucified and Risen and living Jesus Christ, is truly alive and truly present in and through His Church, in and through Word and Sacrament, if there is, indeed real grace to be found here (as I believe there is), then that means there is a real encounter with that same Jesus Christ to be had here. The Gospel should be on my lips, the love of Christ in my heart and in my actions, the Holy Spirit sanctifying me and the whole Church, to be salt and light and a city on a hill.

Jesus doesn't need me to be loud and in anyone's face.
If I really have met Jesus, here in His Church, in His Word, in His Sacraments, then that should reflect out from me in how I live, in words and actions. Of course I'm going to talk about Jesus, talk about my faith, to talk about the hope I have. Of course I'm going to want to love others, of course I'm going to want to serve others. Will it ever be perfectly? No, hardly. But if Jesus really is the center of my world, then that's going to do something to me. God hasn't called me to be a missionary, but He has called me to take up my cross.

-CryptoLutheran

There are various means of evangelism, prophecy, preaching , etc.
One must speak/write according to the gifts given of God.

Consider John the Baptist, "The Voice of one crying in the wilderness," who said "
In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. (< This said to the people in general)
For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.
And the same John had his raiment of camel's hair, and a leathern girdle about his loins; and his meat was locusts and wild honey.
Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,
And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance: (This said to the religious hypocrites who had a knowledge of God, but not a saving belief, except for Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea who later came to believe.)
And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
Whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."

Consider Malachi 4:5-6, "Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:
And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse."

Now John fulfilled that Elijah prophecy at Christs first coming, but the spirit of Elijah shall also be sent forth in these last days, to anoint and raise up prophets that will call the people to repentance before the great and dreadful day of the LORD that is soon to come. Perhaps those who deny Him now will believe when the LORD comes in the clouds of heaven, with His mighty angels, and great power & glory. But then, for some, it shall be too late. He WILL come again, just as surely as He came the first time. Humble servant to pay for our sins as atoning sacrifice then, Conquering Warrior and Great King who comes in full Authority the second time.

Note the wording of Malachi. The first coming was not the dreadful day of the LORD, nor was the earth smitten with a curse on the level described in prophecy. Isaiah 24:6 proclaims, "Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left."- THIS is what is to come, as is confirmed by the Apostle Peter, "But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men...
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?" (2 Peter 3:7, 10-12)

Didn't Israel become a nation again in 1948, after 1,870 years? The Jews were scattered by the Romans, their nation laid waste, as even Mark Twain said it was like a wasteland back in the 1800s. Very few thought Israel would ever be again, and the Arabs certainly were having none of it either! People wondered if the Bible was true after all because there was no Israel. But now there is, and against all odds Israel also defeated many nations and much stronger ones that came against her in 1948, 1967 & 1973, and Gaza is now the wasteland after Hamas launched it's attack last Oct 7th. All this fulfilled the prophecies of Isaiah and Ezekiel, especially Ezekiel 37.

Jude speaks of two kinds of evangelism, or reaching out. I've always fallen in the second category, though on occasion the Spirit has moved me in special circumstances to the first one. And I am no one, just a messenger being obedient to the Mighty God who saved me from certain death and a hellish eternity.

 

[o_mlly]

There's plenty of us right here to talk to if you're interested in finding out what we actually think. These spiteful falsehoods are unbecoming.

Spiteful? Only God can read the human mind. Atheists only think they can as evidenced by the number of strawman fallacies they throw at Christians.

Falsehood? Either one has a transcendent authority, or they do not. Christians call their transcendent authority "God". What do you call yours?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Falsehood? Either one has a transcendent authority, or they do not. Christians call their transcendent authority "God". What do you call yours?

Your statement is correct. I do not have a transcendent authority.

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

Look at how amazingly the puddle is molded to fit the water.

"When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth" - Proverbs 8:29

"Fear ye not me? saith the Lord: will ye not tremble at my presence, which have placed the sand for the bound of the sea by a perpetual decree, that it cannot pass it: and though the waves thereof toss themselves, yet can they not prevail; though they roar, yet can they not pass over it?" - Jeremiah 5:22

One thing we ARE in total agreement on is the saying under your username:

"Front row at the dumpster fire of the republic"​

Minneapolis 2020 - (The complete destruction of a liquor store probably SAVED LIVES !)
Sorry, that's not a dumpster fire...
THIS is!

Minneapolis May 29, 2020

 

[Desk trauma]

"When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth" - Proverbs 8:29

"Fear ye not me? saith the Lord: will ye not tremble at my presence, which have placed the sand for the bound of the sea by a perpetual decree, that it cannot pass it: and though the waves thereof toss themselves, yet can they not prevail; though they roar, yet can they not pass over it?" - Jeremiah 5:22

One thing we ARE in total agreement on is the saying under your username:

"Front row at the dumpster fire of the republic"​

View attachment 343835

Minneapolis 2020 - (The complete destruction of a liquor store probably SAVED LIVES !)
Sorry, that's not a dumpster fire...
THIS is!

View attachment 343836

Minneapolis May 29, 2020

Was there a point you were trying to make in there somewhere?

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

Was there a point you were trying to make in there somewhere?

Moulding the puddle. God made the bounds for the waters of the sea, to fit the sea and where it should be.

 

[Desk trauma]

Moulding the puddle. God made the bounds for the waters of the sea, to fit the sea and where it should be.

Ah, I see you totally missed the point.

 

[Tinker Grey]

O that the Atheist would quit questioning God, and stop seeking every imaginable excuse to deny Him!

O that the Atheist who has even a miniscule belief that there might be a somewhat intelligent force behind the operations of the Cosmos, hence being somewhat of a Deist, would open their heart to see such utter complexities as the Universe, on down to the smallest known particle, all show plainly the wisdom and knowledge of an intelligent Creator.

O that the Atheist, the Deist, the Unitarian, the Agnostic, all realize there is a Holy Spirit, being part of the Godhead of Father, Son, and Spirit - and that the Holy Spirit is sent into the world to convict of sin, righteousness, and judgment: That the absolute Holiness of God demands the absolute justice of God, because of the absolute love of God, who gave His Son Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for your sin, of which the wages of sin are death!

Question if you may, disbelieve if you will, but none of your surmisings will change the course of God's sovereign will, Who will perform His will despite all your unbelief and questioning. Do not debate with the LORD, for you shall lose!

Thou art a sinner, for you were born in sin, and the only way to be free from the power and the penalty of sin, is to believe upon Jesus Christ, confess your sins to Him, and repent: turn from your sins. For even if you have lived a good moral life by the worlds standards, you are still a sinner, and your denial and unbelief themselves are sin!

O that the Atheist, the Deist, the Unitarian, the Agnostic, come to know the love of God, who is reaching out this time that you might be saved! Get a KJV Bible and begin to read it, and pray mightily for wisdom to receive its truth, that the living Word, who is Jesus Christ our Saviour may awaken your hearts to salvation, that ye die not in your sins and burn in hell: for that is the lot and portion of all unbelievers, and those who embrace sin over the Saviour!

Turn now, for the door is NOW open, and Christ awaits to envelop you with His love, and fill you with His Spirit; for His blood shed on the cross has the power to cleanse you from your sins, and the gift of eternal life shall then be yours. Until you come to Jesus and take Him as the Saviour of your soul, you are pitifully lost, and beneath the dreadful wrath of a Holy God, who is Righteous, and demands Justice, for in unbelief you condemn yourself.
Pray God then, O unbeliever, that He have mercy, and grant you repentance unto life, and saving faith, that ye may believe unto eternal life.
Amen.

O that the theist would question the gods and stop excusing every divine horror.

O that the theist who has even a modicum of doubt that there is any intelligent force behind the operations of the Cosmos would open their heart to see such utter complexities as the Universe, on down to the smallest known particle, all show plainly the utter naturalness of reality.

O that the theist would recognize that the absolute horror of a god that demands absolute love, which unrequited demands absolute and eternal torture, who gave His Son Jesus Christ to appease himself for a system he set up himself.

Believe if you must, but none of your surmises will bring your fantasies into existence and, being non-existent, will accomplish nothing despite your belief and worship. Debate with gods for none shall answer you!

Thou art human and wert born human. There is no penalty of sin for there are no gods to sin against. Live a good life for it is the only one thou hast and shalt ever have.

O that the theist wouldst come to know the non-existence of God, who is doing absolutely nothing that you might be saved (from what?)! (A KJV Bible? Really?) Read philosophers. Understand the vacuousness of the wisdom of the bible. For nothing therein, being profound, is true, and nothing therein, being true, is profound. Knowest thou this: there is no hell from which one might be saved. Awaken thine heart to reality here and now for there is none other.

Turn now from wasteful imaginings. Life is to be lived here and now and if thou doest nothing for which thou couldst be remembered then truly thy life that thou hadst lived was in vain.

 

[Larniavc]

Nope. The atheist just changes His name from Yahweh to (insert atheist's name here.)

You think people who don't believe in the Christian god think that they themselves are a god? What godly powers do they think they have?

 

[Occams Barber]

Ah, I see you totally missed the point.

 

[dlamberth]

There are various means of evangelism, prophecy, preaching , etc.

From where I come from, the most effective means is the "preaching of Love". I've seen none of that in any of your post.