Willful Sin, is this even forgivable?

[Cippy]

Just wondering

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

Yes. Jesus said:

"And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven." (Matt. 12:31)

ALL sin can and will be forgiven on those who confess Christ as Saviour, that leads to another question though: what is the unforgivable sin, there is one. Personally I do not believe a Christian can commit this sin.

 

[Leonfrost]

I've been thinking a lot about the whole sinning against the spirit thing. I could be wrong, but I've concluded that the "blasphemy against the holy spirit" thing could be interpreted as "rejection of the holy spirit," ergo rejection of Christ. That's the only reason the sin can't be forgiven: Because you won't let Christ forgive you, because you reject Him. It's like, when you stumble, and He reaches His hand out to help you up, you slap it away. Does that sound right to any of you more experienced Christians on the board?

 

[Cippy]

I've been thinking a lot about the whole sinning against the spirit thing. I could be wrong, but I've concluded that the "blasphemy against the holy spirit" thing could be interpreted as "rejection of the holy spirit," ergo rejection of Christ. That's the only reason the sin can't be forgiven: Because you won't let Christ forgive you, because you reject Him. It's like, when you stumble, and He reaches His hand out to help you up, you slap it away. Does that sound right to any of you more experienced Christians on the board?

to me its when you are close god, and the holy spirit, and your in touch with it than when you do a 360 on the holy spirit im sure that is not forgivable

 

[TheDag]

What do you mean by wilfull sin?
I believe that if you sin and you are not repentant (sorry) then you will not be forgiven. I once sinned and asked for forgiveness yet I had every intention of comitting that sin again. I do not believe I was forgiven. I had to get God to get me to the stage where I could truly say I don't want to do that sin anymore. This is different to being sorry for comitting a sin and then falling to temptation again. I had no intention of stopping the sin and God will not be mocked. This is what is partly meant when Paul asks in Romans 6 "Should we sin more so God's grace abounds?" The answer is "By no means".

 

[Avniel]

to me its when you are close god, and the holy spirit, and your in touch with it than when you do a 360 on the holy spirit im sure that is not forgivable

What???? That is the most unbiblical statement on this site

 

[JRSut1000]

In following the theme of the topic, can I throw this into the mix:

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

~Hebrews 6:4-6

 

[elenore]

in a word, yes.

unless you're perfect, I think it's pretty hard not to commit a willful sin at some point or other.

those who deliberatly turn away after tasting the fullness of God (as mentioned above) - is a deliberate turning away. different to mistake or slip up, or lack of willpower at a certain time in a certain area.

faith is a journey. being a christian is a process of following christ and allowing him to change us. if we were already perfect, or would never commit a sin, because we could simply choose not to - we wouldn't need him, or that process.

Christ was sacrificed for our sins. That means we can be forgiven. We take a step, we learn, we grow, we fall, we hurt, we get angry, we forgive, we get back up. It goes on and on. A journey is a journey. Perfection is perfection. And we're human.

 

[elenore]

(if you want to know a secret for a powerful christian journey and life - it's sacrifice. letting God be God in your life, and laying down your own right to rule it. It's like having jet powered rollerskates.)

(it's not easy, - very hard and expensive at times in fact - but it'll get you light years ahead of many others in the faith.)

 

[bsd31]

There is absolutely nothing in the Word of God that indicates one must live perfect from the moment of salvation onward or lose it (salvation). But agents of the devil speak words of death to people's souls and tell the weak minded that if one sins they can not be forgiven. Do not pay them heed. They are, as I said agents of the devil. And the father of lies stalks among us to kill, to steal, and to destroy.

In Matthew 16:16 Peter confesses with his mouth what he believes in his heart about Jesus

"You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God."

At that moment he is saved

(Romans 10:9)If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

But after his confession he tries to stand against God's plans

From that time on Jesus began to explain to his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, the chief priests and the teachers of the law, and that he must be killed and on the third day be raised to life.
Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. “Never, Lord!” he said. “This shall never happen to you!”

Jesus turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.”

He committed a deliberate sin against God but would anyone questions Peter's salvation?

 

[Buzzy]

Willful sin is sin done with full knowledge and no temptation or deception. I would liken it to killing someone for pure sport and fun, it is that bad, there is no excuse possible. At that point Hebrews tells us that (exactly like in the OT) there is no sacrifice to cover this sin. Jesus did not die so that you should spit on his sacrifice but even then God's mercy is there for those that honestly repent and beg his mercy and love.

 

[forGod1]

Just wondering

We all know when we're sinning. I understand your question.. if you think about swearing and then swear, is that forgivable? And the answer is yes. All sin is easily vanquished by Christ. We're all weak, God knows this. It's fighting this temptation with ease that we all strive for.. in our daily walk with Christ.

 

[Avniel]

We all know when we're sinning. I understand your question.. if you think about swearing and then swear, is that forgivable? And the answer is yes. All sin is easily vanquished by Christ. We're all weak, God knows this. It's fighting this temptation with ease that we all strive for.. in our daily walk with Christ.

Not just weak but fleshly beings our character is weak and our nature is worldly and sinnful.

Fact is no sin goes unpunished but we dont have to burn in hell for our nature

 

[MasterpieceMesias]

isn't sin willful in the first place? It's not like an accident like if you accidentally shot your 3 year old in the head when you tripped, you intentionally killed her.

 

[bsd31]

Willful sin is sin done with full knowledge and no temptation or deception. I would liken it to killing someone for pure sport and fun, it is that bad, there is no excuse possible. At that point Hebrews tells us that (exactly like in the OT) there is no sacrifice to cover this sin. Jesus did not die so that you should spit on his sacrifice but even then God's mercy is there for those that honestly repent and beg his mercy and love.

Really?

We need to beg God's mercy? And here I was believing 1 John 1:9 this whole time.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.

 

[Buzzy]

I'd suggest you pay more attentionto Hebrews 10 where it says " 26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[d] and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”[e] 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God"

 

[forGod1]

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left..

what does that mean exactly?

 

[bsd31]

I'd suggest you pay more attentionto Hebrews 10 where it says " 26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[d] and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”[e] 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God"

Why do you believe Hebrews 10 is more relevant to this situation? Seems both scriptures, on their surface, stand in opposition to one another. We know that this is not possible so how do you reconcile the two?

 

[bsd31]

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left..

what does that mean exactly?

It means if you've heard the Gospel message, accepted Christ as your Lord and Savior and then turn around and totally reject what you know to be true the sacrifice of Christ does not cover your sins. It means you did not have a saving faith.

It has nothing to do with day to day sins, because scripture clearly tells us that we are sinners even after salvation and anyone who claims otherwise is a liar (1 John 1:8,10). Paul puts it this way in Romans 7:15

I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.

There's nothing in the Word that makes any indication that we stop sinning once we are saved. We should strive for it and desire it, but the reality is that according to God we are not a completed work at the time of salvation, on our human timeline.

 

[JRSut1000]

My husband could testify that he was indeed saved for years and truly loved God and wanted to learn about Him and know Him. There was definitely relationship, it was genuine.

BUT he was led astray and totally rebelled against the Lord and His ways. He was definitely in that place of frightening rebellion. He was in deep sin, not caring about God, but forgetting Him.

But he came back to God, repented, and made a complete 180 change. Soon after this change was made, he met me and we've been married 2+ years and I can tell ya he's the real deal! He leads our family in the ways of the Lord so well and GOd has really redeemed the time that was lost. I learned forgiveness through his testimony.