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Why can hyenas/cheetahs live in deserts, but lions and leopards cant?

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Sammy-San

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Lions and leopards do live in some deserts and arid areas (kalahri and namib deserts in africa, and arabian dry areas near mountains), but if you check out a map of their historical ranges, lions and leopards (even when they were once historically widespread all over north africa and the middle east) have never lived in the Sahara or Arabian deserts, which are two of the most dry hot lifeless deserts in the world, with sand dunes, etc. However, according to a map of cheetah historical range, they once lived in the sahara and arabian deserts. According to a map of hyena range, they do live in the arabian and sahara deserts.





How can hyenas (and formerly cheetahs) live in those dry deserts like the Sahara? There is very little water there except for oasises-so it makes little sense that large animals were once widespread there, as the map claims. Even though some large animals live there, there are very few of them-because of the scarcity of water in the Sahara. Also, if hyenas and cheetahs can live in even the worst of deserts, (presumably because of some water sources and prey) why cant lions and leopards do it?
 

Shemjaza

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Their hunting techniques are different and their bodies operate a little differently... I don't see the mystery.

Each species has adapted to their particular environment. Leopards are terrifyingly effective in trees (the can even hunt humans), but have you ever seen a cheetah climb a tree? It's hilariously inept.
 
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Sammy-San

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A little different? Living in the Sahara/Arabian desert, an arid desert, takes a body that operates very differently. It's a mystery because living in such a harsh climate implies that the animals are totally different in some way.
 
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Superhero Sam said:
A little different? Living in the Sahara/Arabian desert, an arid desert, takes a body that operates very differently. It's a mystery because living in such a harsh climate implies that the animals are totally different in some way.
Click to expand...
The Inuit people of Northern Canada and Alaska have some physical differences from the Aborigines of Australia or the Ju/'hoansi of Africa but they are all still humans.
 
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PsychoSarah

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Superhero Sam said:
A little different? Living in the Sahara/Arabian desert, an arid desert, takes a body that operates very differently. It's a mystery because living in such a harsh climate implies that the animals are totally different in some way.
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They are different animals
 
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Shemjaza

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Superhero Sam said:
A little different? Living in the Sahara/Arabian desert, an arid desert, takes a body that operates very differently. It's a mystery because living in such a harsh climate implies that the animals are totally different in some way.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they live in different environments. But they also spend a lot of time near the water sources.
 
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Sammy-San

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Shemjaza said:
Yeah, they live in different environments. But they also spend a lot of time near the water sources.
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If sahara and arabian desert hyenas spend a lot of time near water sources (which explains how they can survive there), why couldn't leopards and lions ever historically live in those areas, if they also can use water sources?
 
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Shemjaza

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Superhero Sam said:
If sahara and arabian desert hyenas spend a lot of time near water sources (which explains how they can survive there), why couldn't leopards and lions ever historically live in those areas, if they also can use water sources?
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Because the populations split and further adapted to those environments.

What is the point you are trying to make?
 
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Sammy-San

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Strathos said:
It would also help to know over what period of time those maps represent. Environments and climates can change over time, so what might be a desert today might have been a jungle when a certain animal populated it.
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The Sahara desert was once a lush grassland. But about 5000 years ago it became a desert due to climate changes. Sahara Desert Was Greener In Ancient Times - Science News - redOrbit

If Cheetahs never lived in the Sahara Desert and only lived in that area when it was a lush forest millenia ago, why would the map include what is now the sahara desert in the cheetahs historical range, when it historically went extinct in that area five thousand years ago? History started being recorded about 6000 years ago, and the sahara desert dried up until about a thousand years later after that. For most of historical time period, cheetahs never lived in the area that is now the sahara desert.

According to wikipedia, even nowadays, some cheetahs live in the Sahel, a semi arid area near the sahara desert. But the Sahara Desert is a very arid desert. I could see how some animals could live and hunt big animals in a semi arid area. But the sand dunes of the Sahara? A totally different ball park.

Almost all maps of historic cheetah ranges in google images show the sahara desert. Heres another example, besides wikipedia. This doesnt make any sense to me. I dont think its logical to say a big cat to live in the sahara. A big cat could live on the outskirts of the sahara, maybe.

 
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Superhero Sam said:
How did I miss the point of your analogy? You were comparing two totally different things.
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First off, it wasn't my analogy. My analogy from several days ago was about the physical differences between humans in the Arctic and humans in the Australian Outback yet they are still both humans. You ignored that one.

Second, the point wasn't that ostriches live in conditions of the Sahara but that ostriches live in significantly different conditions than penguins but both are still birds.
 
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Sammy-San

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Shemjaza said:
Because the populations split and further adapted to those environments.

What is the point you are trying to make?
Click to expand...

I can understand why cheetahs could live in the outskirts of the sahara and a few isolated outskirt areas with oases (sahel), but it makes no sense for cheetahs to have lived everywhere in the Sahara, as the map shows.

If they did live there, why did people wipe them out almost all out from the region? There are only a few hundred cheetahs still living in the Sahel-sahara outskirts, in northwest africa. Cheetahs are a threat to livestock, but there are very few people living in the Sahara-only about four million-very low population density. So why are cheetahs almost all extinct in that huge area, despite, according to the map, having once lived everywhere there? For example, wolves have been wiped out historically from many regions because they are a threat to livestock, but there are still many huge wolf populations living in the low populated wilderness areas of Russia and Canada. Why isnt the same true of Sahara cheetahs?
 
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Sammy-San

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Ostriches actually do not live within the Sahara Desert itself. They only live in the Sahel-the outskirts and semi arid regions of the Sahara, which has a more moderate climate than the actual sahara desert itself. Sahel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Ostrich - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 
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