Texas woman with ectopic pregnancy denied abortion

Belk said:

Yes. Why would parents or medical doctors know about a child they deal with. Much better we have complete strangers make decisions about what is right for them based off their religious beliefs.

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Politicians know better than parents, amirite?

Belk said:

Yes. Why would parents or medical doctors know about a child they deal with. Much better we have complete strangers make decisions about what is right for them based off their religious beliefs.

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That question deserves a serious answer. Without one, I think this conversation is finished.

MMXX said:

An ectopic pregnancy can go unnoticed for 16 weeks.

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Gonna be hard to obtain an abortion at that point if the GOP has their way.

Jamdoc said:

They kicked and screamed when partial birth abortions were banned

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There is no such thing as partial birth abortion.

and when third trimester abortions were banned.

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Nobody is pursuing elective third trimester abortion, so any such legislation served only to endanger women.

MMXX said:

[Staff Edit]

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Then tell me, if life begins at conception, as both the Church and GOP legislature claim, at what point is ending it not "murder"?

For the purposes of this discussion, let's stay between conception and birth...

NxNW said:

Gonna be hard to obtain an abortion at that point if the GOP has their way.

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That'll be when the fetal heartbeat takes priority over the woman's...

ximmix said:

So the zygote is a person?

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Yes, the zygote is a person but in his or her earliest days.

TLK Valentine said:

It can be expanded to include abortion, can it not?

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Probably not. Again, some state laws that ban things being imported from another state are based on possessing something that's illegal, it actually doesn't matter where you get your weed from, if you're in Idaho possessing it, it's illegal.
Nothing like that involved in a woman traveling for a procedure and coming back.... not possessing anything.
The groomed kids going for puberty blockers outside of Idaho come into Idaho.... possessing the puberty blocking drugs, that's something that can be prosecuted.
This is all different, because a woman who goes for that procedure doesn't come back with anything banned. It's simply not the origin state's jurisdiction to prosecute something that happened in another state where it's legal.
So it'd be challenged.

How about loading and firing?

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Well I can tell you'd do a bang up job by not even mentioning working the action.

Now, granted, an unmaintained weapon is going to be horribly inaccurate, but at 800 rounds a minute, the law of averages makes up for that.

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Unmaintained weapon will jam and have stoppages, and not fire, and that is another thing that can complicate modern firearms, knowing how to clear stoppages

[Staff Edit] The founding fathers thought it right for the free people of the state to possess the same kinds of armaments that militaries would have, because they thought it important that our people were not simply outgunned by being limited in the types of arms they had vs a foreign professional military that invades us... or
or...
a professional military of a future tyrannical US government. That has always been part of the rationale. The country was created by violent revolution against a tyrant. It was always seen as a possibility that the people might need to do that again.

How about the modern use of firearms? How about the modern use of society?

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Irrelevant, the original purposes of the 2nd Amendment are still true.

As you said, however, it's an armed populous supporting a professional (Ukrainian) military.

Care to see what happens when an armed populous has to replace a professional military? I don't.

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Care to see what happens when you don't have an armed populace and get invaded by a country like Russia or China? I don't.
If China were to invade Australia it'd go very poorly for the Australians Unlike what Russia is dealing with in Ukraine they'd be able to take and hold territory because the populace is disarmed. Actually in Ukraine they were able to take and hold territory in the rural areas until the cities (where they were distributing arms to civilians and teaching them to use them) repelled the invasion and they withdrew. That's why all the war crimes against civilians are in rural areas, those rural civilians were not armed in time.
But those in the cities got guns, so they could help the military.

Texas is the last place in the country I expect to see a "GUN FREE" anything... But I could be wrong.

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The Gun Free School Zones act of 1990 is federal law. It affects every single state.
It is why schools are a popular target for mass shooters. They know nobody can shoot back.

We don't protect them with guns... They protect themselves with guns... And by hiring people with guns.

Who can the children afford to hire?

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The public hires the police, but we don't have armed police officers at school, it's a public school, why shouldn't we have armed police paid for by the public at our public schools also paid for by the public?

Hvizsgyak said:

Yes, the zygote is a person but in his or her earliest days.

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Even when it's going to result in identical twins, it's just one person?

ximmix said:

How about toddler?

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Look, the world is starting to see the evil in abortion so the laws are finally correcting the mistake of Roe v Wade. This is the end of the line for this bad law. You can agonize over it all you want but it's not going to change the outcome. I pray your heart will someday know the Truth.

ottawak said:

You never heard of the "morning after" pill? Anyway, the fetus stage does not begin until about 8 weeks, by which time about 2/3 of abortions have already been performed.

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Morning after pill isn't an abortion, it's an "emergency contraceptive"
they work by preventing implantation.
before implantation the woman is not pregnant, so a pregnancy was not terminated or aborted, a pregnancy was prevented. It can take days between fertilization and implantation.

and I'm comfortable even with that, as most eggs, even fertilized ones, don't implant. I don't think God is putting souls into fertilized ovum that just.... pass out of the body without implanting because it was fertilized too far down the fallopian tubes or in the uterus itself

Biblically conception is in the womb. and fertilization is in the fallopian tubes, implantation is in the womb.. so a conception, requires both fertilization and implantation.

NxNW said:

Do you have an argument or data, is just an emotional reaction?

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decades of ultrasounds 3D ultrasounds, and thousands of years of mothers experiencing fetal movements kicking, and responding to stimuli suggests they are quite alive, and having experiences, before born.

Jamdoc said:

The public hires the police, but we don't have armed police officers at school, it's a public school, why shouldn't we have armed police paid for by the public at our public schools also paid for by the public?

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I teach at a public school; we have armed police.

TLK Valentine said:

I teach at a public school; we have armed police.

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Good, but a lot of schools don't.
Armed police on campus could deter a shooter. Unless your armed officer is a coward like the one in Florida.
That guy was a disgrace.

NxNW said:

Gonna be hard to obtain an abortion at that point if the GOP has their way.

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The procedure used to remove a nonviable fetus from a fallopian tube isn't an abortion.

MMXX said:

The procedure used to remove a nonviable fetus from a fallopian tube isn't an abortion..

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It's alive, isn't it?

TLK Valentine said:

It's alive, isn't it?

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Yes, it is. It is killing
but not all killings are murder.
This is an act of defense because the mother's life is in danger.

Elective abortions because of a pregnancy resulting from a one night stand are not.

Jamdoc said:

Yes, it is. It is killing
but not all killings are murder.
This is an act of defense because the mother's life is in danger.

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Are you absolutely sure there's no hope that an ectopic pregnancy can't sort itself out?

This is a human life you're playing with; seems to be the sort of question best left to our elected legislature.

Elective abortions because of a pregnancy resulting from a one night stand are not.

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You misspelled "rape."

"Unfortunately, an ectopic pregnancy is fatal for the fetus. It cannot survive outside of the uterus. Quick treatment for an ectopic pregnancy is important to protect the mother's life. If the egg has implanted in the fallopian tube and the tube bursts, there can be severe internal bleeding."

Ectopic Pregnancy: Symptoms, Causes, Treatments & Tests.

TLK Valentine said:

Are you absolutely sure there's no hope that an ectopic pregnancy can't sort itself out?

This is a human life you're playing with; seems to be the sort of question best left to our elected legislature.

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Nope, no chance of the embryo surviving, and if it ruptures, it'll kill the woman.
internal bleeding.

You misspelled "rape."

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Rapes should be dealt with through morning after pills, preventing pregnancy rather than aborting one.
and they are the minority of abortions.