Source of Quotes from St John Chrysostom

[All4Christ]

I am trying to find the specific writing / location of the following quote from St. John Chrysostom:

But if a man and a woman marry in order to be companions on the journey from earth to heaven, then their union will bring great joy to themselves and to others…. In the providence of God, when a husband is spiritually weak, his wife is spiritually strong; and when a wife is weak, her husband is strong.

Do any of you know in which writing this quote can be found? It is from “On Living Simply,” which is a compilation of quotes from St. John Chrysostom, but the book doesn’t cite the source for the quotes.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Is this it? On Christian Marriage- St. John Chrysostom (347-407 AD) – St. George Orthodox Church

 

[All4Christ]

Is this it? On Christian Marriage- St. John Chrysostom (347-407 AD) – St. George Orthodox Church

Yes - but that doesn’t have the source directly from St John Chrysostom.

 

[All4Christ]

Yes - but that doesn’t have the source directly from St John Chrysostom.

I found the quote all over the Internet - but I haven’t found anything referencing the specific writing (directly written by St. John Chrysostom) that it comes from.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Yes - but that doesn’t have the source directly from St John Chrysostom.

Yes, they were having the same issue.

Catholic fact check: St. John Chrysostom on wifely obedience | Sharon Kabel

The following quotation, attributed to St. John Chrysostom, is extremely popular in Catholic and Orthodox circles: When we speak of the wife obeying the husband we normally think of obedience in military or political terms, the husband giving orders and the wife obeying them. But while this type...

sharonkabel.com

 

[All4Christ]

Yes, they were having the same issue.

Catholic fact check: St. John Chrysostom on wifely obedience | Sharon Kabel

The following quotation, attributed to St. John Chrysostom, is extremely popular in Catholic and Orthodox circles: When we speak of the wife obeying the husband we normally think of obedience in military or political terms, the husband giving orders and the wife obeying them. But while this type...

sharonkabel.com

As someone who hasn’t been blessed with children (I still pray for that, but it has been a long time), I find it to be a beautiful description of marriage - but I never have been confident in the authenticity of attribution to St. John due to the reasons listed in the above link. It sounds like I am not alone on that concern.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Based on a lead I found in a discussion group I downloaded a copy of On Marriage and Family Life, but could not locate the quote.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Do any of you know in which writing this quote can be found? It is from “On Living Simply,” which is a compilation of quotes from St. John Chrysostom, but the book doesn’t cite the source for the quotes.

a common issue I have heard with that work is it doesn’t have any references. a priest friend doesn’t recommend that book precisely because there’s no way to verify the quotes as legit.

 

[All4Christ]

Based on a lead I found in a discussion group I downloaded a copy of On Marriage and Family Life, but could not locate the quote.

I was reading that book multiple times for the past two hours and came to the same conclusion. That said - there are some good pieces of information in the book.

a common issue I have heard with that work is it doesn’t have any references. a priest friend doesn’t recommend that book precisely because there’s no way to verify the quotes as legit.

That makes sense. I see so many quotes online that do not have references to the original source. I would love to see the actual citations of the original work for them!

 

[ArmyMatt]

That makes sense. I see so many quotes online that do not have references to the original source. I would love to see the actual citations of the original work for them!

Dr David Ford, whose dissertation was on St John, is also skeptical about that work.

 

[All4Christ]

Dr David Ford, whose dissertation was on St John, is also skeptical about that work.

I definitely trust his opinion on topics like this (and in general)!

 

[ArmyMatt]

I definitely trust his opinion on topics like this (and in general)!

same here

 

[gzt]

I am trying to find the specific writing / location of the following quote from St. John Chrysostom:



Do any of you know in which writing this quote can be found? It is from “On Living Simply,” which is a compilation of quotes from St. John Chrysostom, but the book doesn’t cite the source for the quotes.

That book should be avoided for this reason, since people have tried to find several of the more interesting quotes in that volume in the actual works of St John and don't quite find what they're looking for. That one may exist, but some of the economic ones have not been found.

cf: Facebook and digital bumper stickers

EDIT: and In which St. John Chrysostom shows up on another digital bumper sticker which is more to this point

 

[rusmeister]

On the topic in general, I’d like to verify what the saint had to say about remarriage.
Specifically, I read a story about a widow, who asked his advice and his response, basically asking why she would share her bed with another man now that her husband is sitting at the right hand of glory when she wouldn’t do it while he was on earth.

 

[prodromos]

Only about 1/3 of St John Chrysostom's works have been translated into English (it may be less than that), and it is possible that someone has translated directly from one of those works which only exist in Greek., and considering gzt's post, it may even be a loose paraphrase.

 

[All4Christ]

On the topic in general, I’d like to verify what the saint had to say about remarriage.
Specifically, I read a story about a widow, who asked his advice and his response, basically asking why she would share her bed with another man now that her husband is sitting at the right hand of glory when she wouldn’t do it while he was on earth.

I was reading his homily on Ephesians 5:33 when looking at this topic - and this comment was interesting to me.

But what will they say, who are knit together in second marriages? I speak not at all in condemnation of them, God forbid; for the Apostle himself permits them, though indeed by way of condescension.

John Chrysostom on Ephesians 5:33 - Catena Bible & Commentaries

For indeed, in very deed, a mystery it is, yea, a great mystery, that a man should leave him that gave him being, him that begot him, and that brought him up, and her that travailed with him and had sorrow, those that have bestowed upon him so many and great benefits, those with whom he has been...

catenabible.com

Perhaps the condescension St. John references is along the lines of St. Paul’s admonition to the unmarried and widows in 1 Corinthians 7:

8 But I say to the unmarried and to the widows: It is good for them if they remain even as I am; 9 but if they cannot exercise self-control, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.

 

[All4Christ]

Only about 1/3 of St John Chrysostom's works have been translated into English (it may be less than that), and it is possible that someone has translated directly from one of those works which only exist in Greek., and considering gzt's post, it may even be a loose paraphrase.

This is one of many times when I wish I was able to read Greek texts.

 

[rusmeister]

I was reading his homily on Ephesians 5:33 when looking at this topic - and this comment was interesting to me.

John Chrysostom on Ephesians 5:33 - Catena Bible & Commentaries

For indeed, in very deed, a mystery it is, yea, a great mystery, that a man should leave him that gave him being, him that begot him, and that brought him up, and her that travailed with him and had sorrow, those that have bestowed upon him so many and great benefits, those with whom he has been...

catenabible.com

Perhaps the condescension St. John references is along the lines of St. Paul’s admonition to the unmarried and widows in 1 Corinthians 7:

I think it’s the same thing as Christ talking about what God allowed because ofbthe hardness of our hearts. And that’s really a result of fallenness. All kinds of things that should not be are allowed because we are in some ways closed off to God, but if we were to open up, we would see that those things we think we ought to have a right to are not really necessary or even desirable. But we are broken, and want what we want, and God puts up with some things that are not really best for us.