Letting Go - and Letting God

[Hazelelponi]

A common saying is letting go, and letting God.

It's just a reference to submission to God's authority over our lives, specifically in reference to trusting him in the areas we can't change.

But I'm wondering, is there a sense where it is a sin to desire to control our circumstances, is there such a thing as being too reliant on self?

I'm going with a definite yes here. But I suppose, when and how do we know when we have crossed a line from doing what is right and Godly type of "controlling" our circumstances to not trusting in God enough?

Are there some good Bible verses to get to the heart of this?

Where's the line between just being a lazy servant and being a sinner not trusting God enough where we should be, and how do we know we are in that right spot?

 

[fm107]

We should not only trust God in areas of our lives that we can't change (that is quite easy to do), but to trust God in the areas we can change.

It is natural to man to want to control his own circumstances. In fact, natural man who lives his life without regard to God lives his life in fullfilment of his own will:

Isaiah 53:6
All we like sheep have gone astray, we have turned every one to his own way; and Jehovah hath laid upon him the iniquity of us all.

A christian's proper response to God would be one whereby they put their whole life into God's hand to do with as He wills. God does not demand this off us, it is voluntary thing to become the Lord's bondservant, done out of gratitude and devotion to One who has done so much for us.

That means always looking to God for direction in our lives, not just over the big things, but also the small things.

There is not a balancing act to be had, where you stay in control of some aspects of your life and give God control over other parts.

Some people know Jesus Christ as their savior, but do not give Him the place of Lord in and of their lives.

Our whole lives should be controlled by God's will, and for that, you need to be familiar with His Word and daily in communion with the Lord.

Psalm 119:105
Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

We read in the gospels of how the Lord, would get up early in the morning and pray to His Father, to seek His will and to do it.

Psalm 40:8
To do thy good pleasure, my God, is my delight, and thy law is within my heart.

 

[Hazelelponi]

We should not only trust God in areas of our lives that we can't change (that is quite easy to do), but to trust God in the areas we can change.

It is natural to man to want to control his own circumstances. In fact, natural man who lives his life without regard to God lives his life in fullfilment of his own will:

Isaiah 53:6
All we like sheep have gone astray, we have turned every one to his own way; and Jehovah hath laid upon him the iniquity of us all.

A christian's proper response to God would be one whereby they put their whole life into God's hand to do with as He wills. God does not demand this off us, it is voluntary thing to become the Lord's bondservant, done out of gratitude and devotion to One who has done so much for us.

That means always looking to God for direction in our lives, not just over the big things, but also the small things.

There is not a balancing act to be had, where you stay in control of some aspects of your life and give God control over other parts.

Some people know Jesus Christ as their savior, but do not give Him the place of Lord in and of their lives.

Our whole lives should be controlled by God's will, and for that, you need to be familiar with His Word and daily in communion with the Lord.

Psalm 119:105
Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

We read in the gospels of how the Lord, would get up early in the morning and pray to His Father, to seek His will and to do it.

Psalm 40:8
To do thy good pleasure, my God, is my delight, and thy law is within my heart.

I think your going in a slightly different direction than I'm thinking of.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Are there some good Bible verses to get to the heart of this?

In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths. (Proverbs 3:6)

 

[timothyu]

Sin is nothing more than putting our will ahead of God's will. In doing so we put the focus on self and all of its faces such as self interest, self servitude, selfishness etc. When Eve (and Adam) put their will ahead of the will of God, they committed the original sin. What made it worse was the fact she opened the knowledge of good and evil, which in the hands of the wrong being, becomes fuel for sin, as sinners will self justify their deeds seeking gain at the expense of others ( theft, adultery, greed etc) by self determining what is good or evil to suit their own desires, ignoring others contrary to what the second commandment says. Worst of all it ignores what God, the ultimate Truth says is good or evil, whenever man want to create loopholes in His system (contrary to the first commandment).

Should we not let go of our self serving ways?

 

[Hazelelponi]

Sin is nothing more than putting our will ahead of God's will. In doing so we put the focus on self and all of its faces such as self interest, self servitude, selfishness etc. When Eve (and Adam) put their will ahead of the will of God, they committed the original sin. What made it worse was the fact she opened the knowledge of good and evil, which in the hands of the wrong being, becomes fuel for sin, as sinners will self justify their deeds seeking gain at the expense of others ( theft, adultery, greed etc) by self determining what is good or evil to suit their own desires, ignoring others contrary to what the second commandment says. Worst of all it ignores what God, the ultimate Truth says is good or evil, whenever man want to create loopholes in His system (contrary to the first commandment).

Should we not let go of our self serving ways?

Okay... So then maybe how do we know we are putting our will first?

There's something out of my control that I don't want to see happen. But it's going to happen.

The thing is bad. It's against what Scripture says is good in every respect.

Scripture says it will happen. I am watching it occur, slowly over time.

It breaks my heart. How do I self examine my own will in this?

How do we separate out everything so we aren't doing the wrong thing in front of God. How do we want the good, and watch the bad?

At what point do we know we are being willful, as opposed to trusting Him while doing His work?

 

[timothyu]

At what point do we know we are being willful

What's in it for you.. to put it simply.

 

[Hazelelponi]

What's in it for you.. to put it simply.

God's approval

I desire to have the right heart, the one He wants me to have.

I want to be God facing.

 

[timothyu]

I desire to have the right heart, the one He wants me to have.

He has always been clear on this.. even right from the time of the Garden. Do not put self interest first.
My favourite example is how do we deal with someone underserving wanting to cut in line be it in traffic or otherwise

 

[com7fy8]

It can be like a love dance. You are in the arms of the one you trust and who loves you dearly; so you are flowing along with how he leads. At each moment, you do not need to talk about every step, but you flow with each other, sharing this personally.

You are connected so you can sense which way he takes you for each step, when you take a break for refreshments, who you might talk to who is near you . . . all in connection with him.

And yes, God's word says we are connected with Him >

"But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him." (1 Corinthians 6:17)

And Jesus says >

"'Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.'" (Matthew 11:29)

So, a "yoke" has an ox in personal connection with the person who is guiding and controlling the ox.

Even in the yoke, by the way, that ox still needs to learn how to relate with and submit to the one in charge who gives the ox various personal signals for what the ox is to do. I saw a video on this; if I remember right, there might not be reins for controlling the ox. But there is sensitive touching with the whip . . . not smashing and gashing and yelling . . . but also vocal commands. For all I know, it could have worked differently in Jesus' time, but I think this can help give us an idea.

So, yes God's word means, I would offer, that in salvation through Jesus we become spiritually connected with Him in us, so that now He affects how we are spiritually, while He personally takes us along in all He has us doing in sensitive and personal sharing with Him in His own love's "rest for your souls" > He loves us, indeed, by correcting us into such submission and giving us this soul-soothing rest while personally guiding us.

Another item > yes, God might use people speaking to us, and He can use circumstances; however, we are wise to see how He in us actually guides us in relation to what we hear and see around us. And in case someone is telling us a message of God, He is the One to guide us so we do what He knows He means! ***And trust Him to make sure we get His guiding and His signals right***; He knows we can't do this on our own; He is pleased and committed to having us succeed in sharing with Him. There is correction needed, and guaranteed > Hebrews 12:4-14 < we are encouraged to actively seek God for His real correction so we truly are submitting to Him in His very own love.

God corrects our character to be submissive to Him, and He tunes us.

This is how Jesus loves us, indeed, by truly and deeply correcting us so we submit to Him and how He has us pleasing our Father, praying, and loving each and every person. But do we obey how Jesus loves and cares for us? And how do we? And how can we know we are obeying in the "yoke" of Jesus? Below, I will offer things which I have learned.

A common saying is letting go, and letting God.

Yes > "Let go and let God."

I think it is possible for a person to get one's self to let go and let God . . . but it is only in the person's own control. The person is only hoping for God to take care of a circumstance, but the person is not obeying God, only trying to use Him.

But there is a deeper meaning > how God in us changes us so we are submissive to Him.

You also said > "It's just a reference to submission to God's authority over our lives, specifically in reference to trusting him in the areas we can't change."

Well, I guess there is submission to God, meaning we do what we understand He is telling us to do. But it does not mean that in us God is personally guiding us. You making yourself a puppet of what you suppose God wants, this is not really being submissive to Him. It is you controlling the choosing, when God can be personally guiding you >

"for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure." (Philippians 2:13)

According to this scripture, I understand Paul means God works our willing and our doing. He in us, then, initiates our willing to do something and then He in us works us to do it. So, this is very sharing with God in us. And how does this apply to managing things in our circumstances? >

But I'm wondering, is there a sense where it is a sin to desire to control our circumstances, is there such a thing as being too reliant on self?

What we can do is submit to how God in us works to have us dealing with a circumstance. He can guide, in each situation, if and how much we act to control a circumstance. Often, I find, He will have me do things that are good, but maybe without controlling what others do. And rely on Him in me to move, guide me even by the moment . . . flowing, then, with Him taking me along.

I think of how I can be still, and not try to get anything to happen. Be quiet and trust Him, and discover what happens in His control.

Jesus says, don't rehearse before you go before the judges, right? And what will happen? In that hour our Father will give you what to say. Like this, I consider, I can be wise not to try in advance to premeditate what I will do in a situation, but be ready to discover how God creates, in the moment, while He has me seeing and doing.

"Therefore submit to God." (in James 4:7)

If you submit to Him, you are with Him in you, not just "under" Him theoretically figuring out what He wants. But He in you is able to have you do what He desires at every moment. And this is in the ruling of His peace in our hearts >

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

So, we are not only "under", but living in His peace ruling in our *hearts*. And God works this > He changes us to become sensitive to Him and submissive to how He personally rules us inside ourselves. This peace rules in our emotions and feelings and thinking, and this is God's own peace with His creativity being shared with us, for how to love any person the way God knows is good.

I'm going with a definite yes here. But I suppose, when and how do we know when we have crossed a line from doing what is right and Godly type of "controlling" our circumstances to not trusting in God enough?

Are there some good Bible verses to get to the heart of this?

"Do all things without complaining and disputing," (Philippians 2:14)

When we give in to arguing and complaining, we are in trouble . . . not obeying how God's peace in us would have us be and relate in His love.

"rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is very precious in the sight of God." (1 Peter 3:4)

This is how to be. So, we need to not give in to bitterness and stress and nasty anger and unforgiveness and demands and dictatorial drives for pleasure and security. But >

"be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath; for the wrath of man does not produce the righteousness of God." (in James 1:19-20)

Where's the line between just being a lazy servant and being a sinner not trusting God enough where we should be, and how do we know we are in that right spot?

We grow in being worked in by God in our wills, and as we discover being submissive to Him, He has us resting as He pleases, and He has us doing things as He pleases. He will have everything worked out in His timing, how much we go easy alone, and how much we are busy and can be in the middle of all kinds of things, but pleasantly and creatively patient staying attentive and submissive to Him leading. We trust Him at any moment to have us be still or busy. As we grow in experiencing His peace and love and joy, we can tell He has us the right way.

But there are certain sorts of "free will" people who will say you are a puppet if God is guiding every thing you do. But God in us is not dead!! So, in God's love with His leading we have become alive in HIs love with His ingenuity and guiding for how He knows it is good to love any person. Because our Creator is the One so creative for how to love. So, ones with truly free and wise wills will choose this . . . which God works us "to will" (Philippians 2:13).

For relating, I feed on 1 Peter 5:3 >

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

"submitting to one another in the fear of God." (Ephesians 5:21)

To me, "in the fear of God", here, can include that right while I am relating with you I am staying attentive to God, submitting to how He in me is guiding how I relate and communicate with you. I fear Him, I honor Him in how I relate with you, including what I am thinking and my attitude humble and gentle and caring and not self-righteously criticizing you even if somehow you are wrong or mistaken or not perfectly mature and humble.

 

[David Lamb]

A common saying is letting go, and letting God.

It's just a reference to submission to God's authority over our lives, specifically in reference to trusting him in the areas we can't change.

But I'm wondering, is there a sense where it is a sin to desire to control our circumstances, is there such a thing as being too reliant on self?

I'm going with a definite yes here. But I suppose, when and how do we know when we have crossed a line from doing what is right and Godly type of "controlling" our circumstances to not trusting in God enough?

Are there some good Bible verses to get to the heart of this?

Where's the line between just being a lazy servant and being a sinner not trusting God enough where we should be, and how do we know we are in that right spot?

"Letting go and letting God" is an idea that has its roots in what is called "Keswick Theology" (From the Keswick Convention, held in the Lake District town of Keswick, England). I came across this from Andrew Naselli:

"Keswick theology, however, is not biblically sound. Here are just a few of the reasons why:

1. Disjunction: It creates two categories of Christians. This is the fundamental, linchpin issue.
2. Perfectionism: It portrays a shallow and incomplete view of sin in the Christian life.
3. Quietism: It tends to emphasize passivity, not activity.
4. Pelagianism: It tends to portray the Christian’s free will as autonomously starting and stopping sanctification.
5. Methodology: It tends to use superficial formulas for instantaneous sanctification.
6. Impossibility: It tends to result in disillusionment and frustration for the “have-nots.”
7. Spin: It tends to misinterpret personal experiences."

 

[timf]

Where's the line between just being a lazy servant and being a sinner not trusting God enough where we should be, and how do we know we are in that right spot?

Pro 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
Pro 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.

These two apparently contradictory verses are differentiated by your assessment of a situation. In general the saying "let go and let God", is usually given to encourage someone to stop struggling with something in the flesh. This is for someone who may not have made a correct assessment about a situation.

 

[com7fy8]

Okay... So then maybe how do we know we are putting our will first?

By seeing we are doing anything the Bible says no to > including >

Nasty and negative anger and frustration > James 1:19-20, Ephesians 4:31-32

Unforgiveness > Mark 11:25

Arguing and complaining > Philippians 2:13-16

Fear and worry > hurrying to act instead of first being in prayer > 1 John 4:17-18, Philippians 4:6-7

I think you are mature and wise enough to know about these things.

So - - when we do not have obvious signals that we are being self-guided . . . how can we know we are tricking ourselves into thinking God is guiding us when He isn't??

On our own, it is impossible > but Jesus does say,

"The things which are impossible with men are possible with God." (in Luke 18:27)

And God knows how we need Him, and He is committed to having us get into His personal leading and ongoing communication; so trust Him to take care of this >

"casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you." (1 Peter 5:7)

There's something out of my control that I don't want to see happen. But it's going to happen.

The thing is bad. It's against what Scripture says is good in every respect.

Scripture says it will happen. I am watching it occur, slowly over time.

It breaks my heart. How do I self examine my own will in this?

How do we separate out everything so we aren't doing the wrong thing in front of God. How do we want the good, and watch the bad?

At what point do we know we are being willful, as opposed to trusting Him while doing His work?

Something horrible, guaranteed to happen, what to do? - - sounds like Jesus being hated and whipped and nailed to a cross.

And how did He handle it?

Jesus did not one thing to try to change what evil people did, it seems to me. But all that time Jesus *was* doing things to love and bless people. He saved that criminal next to Him. He pronounced Mary and John his mother and her son.

So, Jesus stayed busy with reaching lost souls and ministering our Father's family caring and sharing love. And evil did nothing to stop Him from doing all that He did on Calvary.

"And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

Jesus on the cross was "a sweet-smelling aroma" > He was sweet about it, pleasantly pleasing out Father. So, this is our basic: to stay attentive to being pleasanly pleasing to our Father while going through things; and in His love we are pleasantly patient with our Creator's creativity for how to love any person.