Is it okay to eat pork?

[tonychanyt]

See Is it okay to eat pork?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Yes, Mark 7:


Paul confirmed that in Romans 14:


More generally, Colossians 2:


Eating pork is fine but you don't have to.

It doesn't seem to reconcile with God's Words...

Isaiah 66:17 “Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall be consumed together,” says the Lord.

God gave us plenty of healthy foods to eat, why would anyone want to eat foods God deemed an abomination to Him.

 

[tonychanyt]

Not according to God.

Isaiah 66:17 “Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall be consumed together,” says the Lord.

God gave us plenty of healthy foods to eat, why would anyone want to eat foods God deemed an abomination to Him.

Mark 7:19
For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)

Feel free not to eat pork

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Mark 7:19
For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)

Feel free not to eat pork

The context of Mark 7:19, it is not about food. Jesus tells us what its about, it is about eating with unwashed hands Mark 7:1-2

Jesus tells us how one is defiled (not about food)

Mark 7:20 And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”


The parenthesis was added by man, not in the original manuscript and they will need to face the consequences of adding to God's Word come Judgement Day. Proverbs 30:5-6 Rev 22:18-19

 

[tonychanyt]

The context of Mark 7:19, it is not about food. Jesus tells us what its about, it is about eating with unwashed hands Mark 7:1-2

Jesus tells us how one is defiled (not about food)

Mark 7:20 And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”


The parenthesis was added by man, not in the original manuscript and they will need to face the consequences of adding to God's Word come Judgement Day. Proverbs 30:5-6 Rev 22:18-19

Let proposition P1 = Eating pork is a sin.

True?

 

[B Griffin]

Yes, BBQ pork ribs cooked over charcoal is the best!

 

[tonychanyt]

Yes, BBQ pork ribs cooked over charcoal is the best!

Right. Don't forget crispy bacon. Also, try Japanese black pig if you have the chance

 

[B Griffin]

It doesn't seem to reconcile with God's Words...

Isaiah 66:17 “Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall be consumed together,” says the Lord.

God gave us plenty of healthy foods to eat, why would anyone want to eat foods God deemed an abomination to Him.

Peter had a dream in which he was told, "Rise, Peter, kill and eat". His response was, "Not so Lord, I have never eaten anything common or unclean". As an asside, can the Lord be his Lord if he says, "No Lord"? Anyway, the Lord's response was, "Do not call anything unclean which I have cleansed". After this happened 3 times, Peter changed his mind. I can only imagine that pigs must have been in that sheet.

 

[B Griffin]

The context of Mark 7:19, it is not about food. Jesus tells us what its about, it is about eating with unwashed hands Mark 7:1-2

Jesus tells us how one is defiled (not about food)

Mark 7:20 And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. 23 All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”


The parenthesis was added by man, not in the original manuscript and they will need to face the consequences of adding to God's Word come Judgement Day. Proverbs 30:5-6 Rev 22:18-19

It's the principle of the thing. It is not possible for food or drink that enters the mouth and is expelled on the other end of the body to make a person defiled. The reason is simple, those foods and drinks do not enter their hearts. It only enters their digestive system. Evil desires come from an evil heart/soul/psyche (whatever you want to call it). That's why you must be born again, born by the Spirit to enter the kingdom of God.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

It's the principle of the thing. It is not possible for food or drink that enters the mouth and is expelled on the other end of the body to make a person defiled.

Tell that to Eve.

The reason is simple, those foods and drinks do not enter their hearts. It only enters their digestive system. Evil desires come from an evil heart/soul/psyche (whatever you want to call it). That's why you must be born again, born by the Spirit to enter the kingdom of God.

You're using your logic and not God's, and with this logic we can eat anything and be healthy and we know that's not the case with the plethora of health issues due to bad eating habits. Eating something God deems an abomination can't be good.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Peter had a dream in which he was told, "Rise, Peter, kill and eat". His response was, "Not so Lord, I have never eaten anything common or unclean". As an asside, can the Lord be his Lord if he says, "No Lord"? Anyway, the Lord's response was, "Do not call anything unclean which I have cleansed". After this happened 3 times, Peter changed his mind. I can only imagine that pigs must have been in that sheet.

If we read what the vision is about, you will see it is not about food. Originally Peter thought it was about food which he said he has never eaten anything unclean, showing foods were never deemed clean and the vision if read in context is about people not being unclean, not food. If Peter thought the vision was about food, there would be no reason to keep pondering it.

Acts 10:
9 The next day, as they went on their journey and drew near the city, Peter went up on the housetop to pray, about the sixth hour. 10 Then he became very hungry and wanted to eat; but while they made ready, he fell into a trance 11 and saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth. 12 In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air. 13 And a voice came to him, “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.”

14 But Peter said, “Not so, Lord! For I have never eaten anything common or unclean.”

15 And a voice spoke to him again the second time, “What God has cleansed you must not call common.” 16 This was done three times. And the object was taken up into heaven again.

​

Acts 10:17 Now while Peter wondered within himself what this vision which he had seen meant, behold, the men who had been sent from Cornelius had made inquiry for Simon’s house, and stood before the gate. 18 And they called and asked whether Simon, whose surname was Peter, was lodging there.

19 While Peter thought about the vision, the Spirit said to him, “Behold, three men are seeking you. 20 Arise therefore, go down and go with them, doubting nothing; for I have sent them.”

21 Then Peter went down to the men who had been sent to him from Cornelius, and said, “Yes, I am he whom you seek. For what reason have you come?”

22 And they said, “Cornelius the centurion, a just man, one who fears God and has a good reputation among all the nation of the Jews, was divinely instructed by a holy angel to summon you to his house, and to hear words from you.” 23 Then he invited them in and lodged them.

On the next day Peter went away with them, and some brethren from Joppa accompanied him.
24 And the following day they entered Caesarea. Now Cornelius was waiting for them, and had called together his relatives and close friends. 25 As Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him and fell down at his feet and worshiped him. 26 But Peter lifted him up, saying, “Stand up; I myself am also a man.” 27 And as he talked with him, he went in and found many who had come together. 28 Then he said to them, “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with or go to one of another nation. But God has shown me that I should not call any man common or unclean. 29 Therefore I came without objection as soon as I was sent for. I ask, then, for what reason have you sent for me?”

 

[B Griffin]

If we read what the vision is about, you will see it is not about food. Originally Peter thought it was about food which he said he has never eaten anything unclean, showing foods were never deemed clean and the vision if read in context is about people not being unclean, not food. If Peter thought the vision was about food, there would be no reason to keep pondering it.

Acts 10:
9 The next day, as they went on their journey and drew near the city, Peter went up on the housetop to pray, about the sixth hour. 10 Then he became very hungry and wanted to eat; but while they made ready, he fell into a trance 11 and saw heaven opened and an object like a great sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the earth. 12 In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air. 13 And a voice came to him, “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.”

14 But Peter said, “Not so, Lord! For I have never eaten anything common or unclean.”

15 And a voice spoke to him again the second time, “What God has cleansed you must not call common.” 16 This was done three times. And the object was taken up into heaven again.

​

Acts 10:17 Now while Peter wondered within himself what this vision which he had seen meant, behold, the men who had been sent from Cornelius had made inquiry for Simon’s house, and stood before the gate. 18 And they called and asked whether Simon, whose surname was Peter, was lodging there.

19 While Peter thought about the vision, the Spirit said to him, “Behold, three men are seeking you. 20 Arise therefore, go down and go with them, doubting nothing; for I have sent them.”

21 Then Peter went down to the men who had been sent to him from Cornelius, and said, “Yes, I am he whom you seek. For what reason have you come?”

22 And they said, “Cornelius the centurion, a just man, one who fears God and has a good reputation among all the nation of the Jews, was divinely instructed by a holy angel to summon you to his house, and to hear words from you.” 23 Then he invited them in and lodged them.

On the next day Peter went away with them, and some brethren from Joppa accompanied him.
24 And the following day they entered Caesarea. Now Cornelius was waiting for them, and had called together his relatives and close friends. 25 As Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him and fell down at his feet and worshiped him. 26 But Peter lifted him up, saying, “Stand up; I myself am also a man.” 27 And as he talked with him, he went in and found many who had come together. 28 Then he said to them, “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with or go to one of another nation. But God has shown me that I should not call any man common or unclean. 29 Therefore I came without objection as soon as I was sent for. I ask, then, for what reason have you sent for me?”

Never mind. Sorry to have bothered you. I didn't realize this was against your religion. I'll leave you alone now.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Never mind. Sorry to have bothered you. I didn't realize this was against your religion. I'll leave you alone now.

Thanks, its not just about my religion, its what the scriptures say.

 

[Soyeong]

Yes, Mark 7

It should not make sense to you to interpret God's word as speaking against obeying what God has commanded, but rather if you do that, then you should conclude that you must have misunderstood it. Please read this thread:

We Must Obey God Rather than Man

If we read what man has written and think that they were speaking against obeying what God has commanded, then we have three options: (1) Think that we have correctly understood them, that what they said is false, and that what they said is not Scripture. (2) Think that we have correctly...

www.christianforums.com

There is no "thus he declared" in the Greek, so it is questionable whether that is the correct transaction, however, even if that were the correct translation, it wouldn't mean that we should eat pork. The things that count as food vary from culture to culture, such most Americans might think that animals like cows, chickens, and pigs should be eaten as food while being appalled at eating animals likes horses, dogs, cats, vultures, rats, bats, or octopi, as food, so while it is not universal to American culture, there exists something is analogous to the division between clean and unclean animals. Most of Americans grew up eating animal cows, chickens, and pigs, so that is normal and we don't see anything wrong with it, but if someone grew up in a different culture where it is normal for them to eat those other animals, then it would be incorrect for them to interpret most Americans speaking about eating food as referring to eating those other animals.

So in regard to conversation in Mark 7 of what Jew speaking to other Jews about food, then we should understand them as speaking about eating the things that they considered to be food, namely, the things that God said are food in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14, not insert the things that we consider to be food. We should consider Jews to be just as appalled at the thought of eating pork as we are of eating those other animals. Jews did not even raise pigs, so the thought of eating pork would have never even crossed their minds, especially when it had nothing to do with the topic that they were discussing. Likewise, a cannibal should not interpret Mark 7:19 as saying that human flesh is good to eat.

Jesus had just finished criticizing the Pharisees a being hypocrites for setting aside the commands of God in order to follow their own traditions, so he should not be interpreted as turning around and even more hypocritically doing what he just finished criticized them as being hypocrites for doing.

Paul confirmed that in Romans 14:

The topic of Romans 14 stated in the first verse is in regard to how to handle disputable matters of opinion, not in regard to whether followers of God should follow God. Where God has given a command, human opinion must yield, but where God has given no commands, then we are free to have our own opinions. For example, God gave no command to eat only vegetables, but in Romans 14:2-3, they were judging and resenting each other based on whether or not someone chose to do that, so that was a disputable matter of opinion that Paul was addressing in this chapter. Paul was not suggesting that we are free to commit adultery, theft, murder, idolatry, rape, incest, kidnapping, favoritism, break the Sabbath, or disobey any of God's other commands just as long as we are convinced in our own minds that it is ok to do, but rather that was said only in regard to disputable matters of opinion, so nothing in the chapter should be interpreted as saying that it is ok to rebel against God.

More generally, Colossians 2:

Eating pork is fine but you don't have to.

Colossians 2:16 leaves room for two possibilities:

1.) The Colossians were not keeping God's holy days, they were being judged by Jews because they were not keeping them, and Paul was encouraging them not to let anyone judge them for doing that.

2.) The Colossians were keeping God's holy days, they were being judged by pagans because they were keeping them, and Paul was encouraging them not to let any man judge them and stop them from obeying God.

In Colossians 2:16-23, Paul described the people who were judging them as promoting human teachings and traditions, self-made region, asceticism, and severity to the body, which means that they were being judged by pagans and that 2.) is the case. So it is ironic when people try to use a verse where Paul was encouraging people not to let anyone stop them from obeying God in order to justify their refusal to obey God. You should be more careful not to mistake what was only said against following the teachings or traditions as being spoke against obeying God.

Let proposition P1 = Eating pork is a sin.

True?

Sin is the transgression of God's law (1 John 3:4) and God's law prohibits eating pork (Leviticus 11, Deuteronomy 14), therefore it is a sin to eat pork. Moreover, Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from the law, so it is also a sin for anyone to claim that it is not a sin to eat pork.

 

[tonychanyt]

therefore it is a sin to eat pork.

Let proposition P1 = Eating pork is a sin.
P2 = Eating pork is not a sin.

Between 0 and 10, how much weight do you put on each of the above propositions?

 

[Soyeong]

Peter had a dream in which he was told, "Rise, Peter, kill and eat". His response was, "Not so Lord, I have never eaten anything common or unclean". As an asside, can the Lord be his Lord if he says, "No Lord"? Anyway, the Lord's response was, "Do not call anything unclean which I have cleansed". After this happened 3 times, Peter changed his mind. I can only imagine that pigs must have been in that sheet.

There were all kinds of animals let down in Peter's vision, so he could have obeying God's commands in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14 and God's command in his vision by simply killing and eating one of the clean animals, so understanding why he refuse to do what the Torah permitted him to do is the key to correctly understanding his vision. It should be noted that Peter did not just object by saying that he had never eaten anything that was unclean, but also added that he had never eaten anything that was common, these words are not used interchangeably by the Bible, and God only rebuked Peter for his use of the word "common", but did not rebuke him for his use of the word "unclean". In other words, Peter had correctly identified the unclean animals as unclean and had correct declined to eat them in obedience to the Torah, but he had incorrectly identified the clean animals as common and had incorrectly declined to eat them in disobedience to God's command to kill at eat. Peter interpreted his vision three times as being in regard to incorrectly identifying Gentiles without saying a word about now being able to eat unclean animals, so his vision had nothing to do with a change in their status. You should be more careful not to mistake what was only said against following the traditions of men as being against obeying the commands of God.

 

[Soyeong]

Let proposition P1 = Eating pork is a sin.
P2 = Eating pork is not a sin.

Between 0 and 10, how much weight do you put on each of the above propositions?

I have a high degree of confidence that eating pork is a sin based on the verses that I cited.

 

[Akjv]

It doesn't seem to reconcile with God's Words...

Isaiah 66:17 “Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall be consumed together,” says the Lord.

God gave us plenty of healthy foods to eat, why would anyone want to eat foods God deemed an abomination to Him.

After an idol in the midst, Seems to be the key here. Not the swine meat.
God does not go back on his word. Gen 9: 3

Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

After an idol in the midst, Seems to be the key here. Not the swine meat.
God does not go back on his word. Gen 9: 3

Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.

I'm not of the belief that we only look at one sentence and ignore the other. God would not have put eating swine is an abomination if He didn't mean it. Same thing He said in Lev. 11 He does not go back on His Word- agreed. Once He deems something an abomination, it stays that way. Not worth the risk, imho.

 

[Sabertooth]

Yes, Mark 7:


Paul confirmed that in Romans 14:


More generally, Colossians 2:


Eating pork is fine but you don't have to. Personally, I enjoy crispy bacon and Japanese black pig

See also Dietary laws from Adam to the apostles.

As all of the verses in the OP point out, it is not a spiritual requirement (at least for Gentile Believers).
I am of the opinion, however, that the OT Jewish diet & hygiene laws are beneficial for Gentiles if we observe them in the context of optimizing our health, on the same level as

• hand-washing &
• prophylactic male circumcision.

Nobody will go to Hell for failing to wash their hands, but it remains beneficial to do so. It saved the Jews from getting the Black Plague long before Louis Pasteur discovered germs.