God Hates Divorce

[BigDaddy4]

As one who seems to be nearing this eventuality, I am curious how others feel about this passage from Malachi 2:16 -

"I hate divorce," says the LORD God of Israel, "and I hate a man's covering himself with violence as well as with his garment," says the LORD Almighty. So guard yourself in your spirit, and do not break faith.

Two things to ponder:

1) There are numerous other things God hates. At least 43 or so according to this website (with Scripture references):

At Least 43 Things God Hates

Reading from the list and the associated Scriptures, no one is exempt from what God hates. Who hasn't at one time or another lied, been prideful, or been guilty of idolatry?


2) It is interesting (to me at least) that the Hebrew used in Malachi (shalach) is more used for "sending away" or "seperate" than for divorce. It is a different word (keriythuwth) than the "certificate of divorce" mentioned in Deuteronomy 24 and other places. In fact, Deut. 24:1 says to give her the certificate of divorce (keriythuwth) and then send her away (shalach).

It's almost as if God hates the sending away of the wife without giving her the certificate of divorce in Malachi 2:16, rather than the act of divorce itself.

Comments?

 

[HCrossth2012]

Peace to you


This Good one.

What did Jesus say? Matthew 19; 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so

Notice?
I do not believe in divorce, as God in the beginning intended it to be so be it and Jesus said it himself.

Peace and God bless

 

[LinkH]

It's almost as if God hates the sending away of the wife without giving her the certificate of divorce in Malachi 2:16, rather than the act of divorce itself.

Comments?

I've read arguments that Christ was condemning separating without a writing of divorcement in Matthew 19, though, but you can look up that passage and read it carefully and see that He is against both.

What was the point of giving a woman a writing of divorcement and then not sending her away and keeping her around? Of course they sent them away if they were going to do that. Apparently, God still hates divorce-- the putting away of the wife. The man who did this without the writing of divorcement was breaking another law on top of that.

In Malachi's time, men may have been rather free to dump their wives. I assume they were dumping wives who hadn't committed adultery and things like that, but this is my assumption.

Men can also be the victim of divorce, especially in today's legal system. God spoke through Jeremiah that just as a wife treacherously departs from her husband, so Israel had departed from God. So wives dumping their husbands can also be an act of treachery.

 

[ImaginaryDay]

As one who seems to be nearing this eventuality, I am curious how others feel about this passage from Malachi 2:16 -

"I hate divorce," says the LORD God of Israel, "and I hate a man's covering himself with violence as well as with his garment," says the LORD Almighty. So guard yourself in your spirit, and do not break faith.

Two things to ponder:

1) There are numerous other things God hates. At least 43 or so according to this website (with Scripture references):

At Least 43 Things God Hates

Reading from the list and the associated Scriptures, no one is exempt from what God hates. Who hasn't at one time or another lied, been prideful, or been guilty of idolatry?


2) It is interesting (to me at least) that the Hebrew used in Malachi (shalach) is more used for "sending away" or "seperate" than for divorce. It is a different word (keriythuwth) than the "certificate of divorce" mentioned in Deuteronomy 24 and other places. In fact, Deut. 24:1 says to give her the certificate of divorce (keriythuwth) and then send her away (shalach).

It's almost as if God hates the sending away of the wife without giving her the certificate of divorce in Malachi 2:16, rather than the act of divorce itself.

Comments?

Your understanding is correct, and I agree that the larger issue was with the 'sending away' without the accompanying certificate of divorce. Culturally at the time, I believe this was the norm (sending away without a certificate of divorce) and what the prophet was alluding to that God 'hated'.

 

[LinkH]

Apostolic34,

In Matthew 19, Jesus shows us that a man can commit adultery by divorcing and remarrying, even if he has a writing of divorcement.

3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

Notice the contrast between verses 8 and 9. Allowing a divorce according to the law of Moses (with a writing of divorcement) was not the plan from the beginning. Christ's words in verse 9 apply to divorces given with a writing of divorcement also.

A man who just decides to dump his faithful wife because she's old, or he doesn't love her, or they don't get along, or because someone better looking came along, and gives her the proper paperwork, then marries another, is still committing adultery.

Also, look at the reaction of the disciples. If he were just saying that a writing of divorcement was necessary like mainstream Judaism taught, then why would the apostles say it is better not to marry? They couldnt' dump their wives and expect to remarry in monogamous post-exhilic Judaism and have the blessings of the religious leaders either.

 

[ImaginaryDay]

The OP is addressing the context of Malachi 2:16 which concerns itself with 'sending away' without a 'writing of divorce'. In context, that is what God 'hates' in the passage. That is what careful study will do-you become informed, rather than have an opinion.

 

[LinkH]

The OP is addressing the context of Malachi 2:16 which concerns itself with 'sending away' without a 'writing of divorce'. In context, that is what God 'hates' in the passage.

That's your opinion. What do you have to back it up with? Why would God's hatred only be toward 'divorces' that are done without a writing of divorcement. Men who divorce with a writing of divorcement still sent their women away.

You do consider Christ to be an authoritative Commentator on the Old Testament don't you?

According to His words, putting a way one's wife with a writing of divorcement fits into the category of putting away one's wife. Even with the writing of divorcement, he still puts her away. If a man divorces his wife and sends her away, he still sends her away. (That is basic logic.)

That is what careful study will do-you become informed, rather than have an opinion.

I have shown other scripture that supports what I am saying. What is your opinion based on?

 

[BigDaddy4]

Apostolic34,

In Matthew 19, Jesus shows us that a man can commit adultery by divorcing and remarrying, even if he has a writing of divorcement.

3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

Notice the contrast between verses 8 and 9. Allowing a divorce according to the law of Moses (with a writing of divorcement) was not the plan from the beginning. Christ's words in verse 9 apply to divorces given with a writing of divorcement also.

A man who just decides to dump his faithful wife because she's old, or he doesn't love her, or they don't get along, or because someone better looking came along, and gives her the proper paperwork, then marries another, is still committing adultery.

Also, look at the reaction of the disciples. If he were just saying that a writing of divorcement was necessary like mainstream Judaism taught, then why would the apostles say it is better not to marry? They couldnt' dump their wives and expect to remarry in monogamous post-exhilic Judaism and have the blessings of the religious leaders either.

Link,

In verses 8 and 9, the Greek uses the word for sending (putting) away (apolyo), not certificate of divorce (apostasion) as in verse 7.

My understanding is adultry is only committed when either the certificate of divorce or the sending away is not completed and then the man tries to remarry.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Peace to you


This Good one.

What did Jesus say? Matthew 19; 8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so

Notice?
I do not believe in divorce, as God in the beginning intended it to be so be it and Jesus said it himself.

Peace and God bless

But we are not living in the beginning. Otherwise, Jesus would not be necessary because no one would be sinning. So, let's put that aside and deal with the reality we live in.

We are sinners, living in a fallen world. In Deut. 24, God gave permission to divorce as long as there was a certificate and a sending away (leaving her).

Divorce may not be God's perfect will, but it appears to be his permissive will.

 

[JohnDB]

As one who seems to be nearing this eventuality, I am curious how others feel about this passage from Malachi 2:16 -

"I hate divorce," says the LORD God of Israel, "and I hate a man's covering himself with violence as well as with his garment," says the LORD Almighty. So guard yourself in your spirit, and do not break faith.

Two things to ponder:

1) There are numerous other things God hates. At least 43 or so according to this website (with Scripture references):

At Least 43 Things God Hates

Reading from the list and the associated Scriptures, no one is exempt from what God hates. Who hasn't at one time or another lied, been prideful, or been guilty of idolatry?


2) It is interesting (to me at least) that the Hebrew used in Malachi (shalach) is more used for "sending away" or "seperate" than for divorce. It is a different word (keriythuwth) than the "certificate of divorce" mentioned in Deuteronomy 24 and other places. In fact, Deut. 24:1 says to give her the certificate of divorce (keriythuwth) and then send her away (shalach).

It's almost as if God hates the sending away of the wife without giving her the certificate of divorce in Malachi 2:16, rather than the act of divorce itself.

Comments?

Because God hates abuse more than divorce. And sending away of a wife (often translated as "put away" ) without any kind of support to where she has to remarry and become an adulterer is a form of abuse. She would either starve or commit a sin. God would rather a couple become divorced than a person abuse another.

 

[LinkH]

Link,

In verses 8 and 9, the Greek uses the word for sending (putting) away (apolyo), not certificate of divorce (apostasion) as in verse 7.

My understanding is adultry is only committed when either the certificate of divorce or the sending away is not completed and then the man tries to remarry.

In context, Jesus is commenting on the practice of doing apolyo with a writing of divorcement. That was the type of divorce Moses allowed referred to in verse 7. Christ said, 'but from the beginning it was not so' and then made his comments about adultery.

Wouldn't you agree that apostasion is a category of apolyo? Putting a wife away with paperwork is still putting her away. It is clear that is how the one's asking the question in verse 7 used the word.

 

[LinkH]

This passage uses apolyo.

Matthew 5
31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.


In verse 31, putting a wife away with a writing of divorcement is apolyo. 'Putting away' includes putting away with the proper legal paperwork. Notice the contrast between what Moses had said and the higher standard Christ gave. Verse 32 applies to putting away wives, even in the case described in verse 31 where there is a writing of divorcement. The one exception mentioned is for fornication.

 

[JohnDB]

This passage uses apolyo.

Matthew 5
31 It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.


In verse 31, putting a wife away with a writing of divorcement is apolyo. 'Putting away' includes putting away with the proper legal paperwork. Notice the contrast between what Moses had said and the higher standard Christ gave. Verse 32 applies to putting away wives, even in the case described in verse 31 where there is a writing of divorcement. The one exception mentioned is for fornication.

One other little remembered detail.

Matthew 13 Where Jesus said that he was not going to speak clearly and without parables or stories or poetry when speaking to the general public (aside from disciples and Apostles).

Jesus used metaphors a lot from the point in Matthew 13 forward.

 

[LinkH]

One other little remembered detail.

Matthew 13 Where Jesus said that he was not going to speak clearly and without parables or stories or poetry when speaking to the general public (aside from disciples and Apostles).

Jesus used metaphors a lot from the point in Matthew 13 forward.

At the time he was teaching in Matthew 13, He was only using parables. Matthew 5 comes before Matthew 13.

When I read commentaries on the issue, the question was what was Moses talking about when he said if a man founds some uncleanness-- or however you translate it-- in his wife, he could give her a writing of divorcement. There were two schools of law at the time, one that allowed for a liberal interpretation and divorce for almost anything, and another with a narrow interpretation. Some Jewish men may have sent their wives away without support and without a writing of divorcement, but that was against the Law, and that is not the issue anyone raises in this passage. The issue is the causes for which God allows divorce, and Jesus' answer was more conservative than the conservatives on the issue.

Has anyone ever heard of this interpretation of Jesus only talking about divorces without legal paperwork being held by anyone before say 100 years ago? Did anyone in the early church or even centuries later hold to it? Does anyone who knows how to read Greek interpret it that way? Has anyone for whom divorce has not been a part of their own personal experience or that of their spouses ever held to this interpretation? Maybe you can find someone for that last category, but it seems like people who've divorced or have been personally impacted by it and have some 'skin in the game' are the ones who hold to this interpretation.

 

[ImaginaryDay]

That's your opinion. What do you have to back it up with? Why would God's hatred only be toward 'divorces' that are done without a writing of divorcement. Men who divorce with a writing of divorcement still sent their women away.

Read the OP, Link. It makes the distinction between the original Hebrew for "sending away" (Shalach) and the "certificate of divorce" (keriythuwth). The King James is a mistranslation of the word. What God hated, in context, was the putting away of the wife without a certificate of divorce. We can go in circles on this all you want, but it doesn't change the meaning of words.

You do consider Christ to be an authoritative Commentator on the Old Testament don't you?

According to His words, putting a way one's wife with a writing of divorcement fits into the category of putting away one's wife.

Yes, I do consider Him to be Authoritative. But if you will look closely at Matthew 19 (which you quoted to me) what does He say?

"And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

Here, the KJV is correct in the term it uses. The Pharisees were asking Him about a specific question. The act of putting away one's wife without a writing of divorcement was still going on. It was still common practice. THAT is what they were asking Him about, NOT divorce. The word for 'put away' is used in the same way as when Jesus 'sent away' the 70. We are talking about a practice where women are being sent away without a writing of divorcement and husbands are remarrying. The Pharisees are asking Jesus if this is lawful.

I have shown other scripture that supports what I am saying. What is your opinion based on?

Scripture and careful study. I'll get back to you, hang tight.

 

[ImaginaryDay]

but it seems like people who've divorced or have been personally impacted by it and have some 'skin in the game' are the ones who hold to this interpretation.

Save the jabs for another time, ok? God forbid you ever have some 'skin in the game'...

 

[BigDaddy4]

In context, Jesus is commenting on the practice of doing apolyo with a writing of divorcement. That was the type of divorce Moses allowed referred to in verse 7. Christ said, 'but from the beginning it was not so' and then made his comments about adultery.

Wouldn't you agree that apostasion is a category of apolyo? Putting a wife away with paperwork is still putting her away. It is clear that is how the one's asking the question in verse 7 used the word.

No I would not agree. They are 2 seperate actions. That's why there are 2 seperate words for them. In modern days, "putting away" (apolyo) with a certificate of divorce (apostasion) could be like seperating but not filing for divorce. IOW, you can seperate, but not divorce. Conversely, it's possible to divorce but not seperate (if you continue to live together - but why would you??).

 

[ImaginaryDay]

No I would not agree. They are 2 seperate actions. That's why there are 2 seperate words for them. In modern days, "putting away" (apolyo) with a certificate of divorce (apostasion) could be like seperating but not filing for divorce. IOW, you can seperate, but not divorce. Conversely, it's possible to divorce but not seperate (if you continue to live together - but why would you??).

Wow, separate but not divorce? Then shack up with the new girl without telling her you're still married? Who does that these days? And it surely couldn't have happened back then....

 

[BigDaddy4]

Has anyone ever heard of this interpretation of Jesus only talking about divorces without legal paperwork being held by anyone before say 100 years ago? Did anyone in the early church or even centuries later hold to it? Does anyone who knows how to read Greek interpret it that way? Has anyone for whom divorce has not been a part of their own personal experience or that of their spouses ever held to this interpretation? Maybe you can find someone for that last category, but it seems like people who've divorced or have been personally impacted by it and have some 'skin in the game' are the ones who hold to this interpretation.

I have a "skin in the game" and didn't care for much of the advice given to other believers about divorce. God will not heal a relationship that does not want to be healed. So I "searched the Scriptures" and tried to come to a better understanding about the issue.

The Malachi verse in the OP in particular seems to be the be all, end all Christian advice for those comtemplating divorce. "Don't divorce because the Bible says God hates divorce!" So men and women are stuck in unhappy, fruitless marriages for fear of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ing off God.

Well, I'm not afraid of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ing off God on this issue. As referenced in the OP, God "hates" other things too. Without His grace and mercy, we are all doomed. But that's the great thing about Jesus Christ! He came to die for me, to take my punishment for the things I've done in the past, things that are on His list of "hates", and may do in the future. I am human. I am a sinner.

When I confess my sins, I am forgiven. So why would I be afraid of His wrath if I divorce my wife, especially after all I've tried to do to make it better? I'm not. So, I'm about to shake the dust off and move on.

 

[HCrossth2012]

But we are not living in the beginning. Otherwise, Jesus would not be necessary because no one would be sinning. So, let's put that aside and deal with the reality we live in.

We are sinners, living in a fallen world. In Deut. 24, God gave permission to divorce as long as there was a certificate and a sending away (leaving her).

Divorce may not be God's perfect will, but it appears to be his permissive will.

Peace to you.

Why would Jesus say it? Because he came to for fill the law. So we can and will live in the spirit. This Is going to get me in hot waters but anyone who say they know God and get divorced does not know Gods spirit. God has perfect will for everyone of his children. That's Good news.

OT people lived without spirit, but under flesh, now we go under and in the Spirit..so everyone that lives in the spirit of GOD( perfect will ) will be doing it like God intended it.

And everyone that live under flesh 23But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

I thought of Divorce from my husband, but came to see, not Gods will. We should be free in his Spirit and be light of patience and love and every single thing that is from the holy one.

Jesus came to give us everything that is perfect will of God.


Peace to you all
And God bless