Dostoevsky on Tolerance, does this describe our milieu?

[Pavel Mosko]

 

[The Barbarian]

(supposition that "tolerance" means people shouldn't be rational, to avoid upsetting imbeciles)

Kinda like the way it was in the Trump White House.

Tolerance means no one gets to impose on anyone else.

Tolerance doesn't mean you have to approve of anyone else, or help them.

Tolerance doesn't mean that if your religion says you should abuse some other people, we have to tolerate your behavior.

Tolerance means that if you get depressed and angry if a (KKK follower, black guy, homosexual, Trump fan, Christian, Jew, Muslim, whatever) lives in your neighborhood, you'll just have to deal with it.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

(supposition that "tolerance" means people shouldn't be rational, to avoid upsetting imbeciles)



Tolerance means no one gets to impose on anyone else.

Tolerance doesn't mean you have to approve of anyone else, or help them.

That would be the classic definition, but not the political definition now being put forth.

Professors are being driven out of their jobs at colleges and universities by leftist students
who cause riots and shout down anyone who speaks in support of the professor.

Here's one example;

In late May 2017, student protests—focused in part on the comments by Weinstein—disrupted the campus and called for a number of changes to the college. Weinstein was told by campus police that it was not safe for him to be on campus, which caused Weinstein to hold his biology class in a public park.

 

[The Barbarian]

That would be the classic definition, but not the political definition now being put forth.

Yes, Jan 6, for example. As you indicate, the radical left is often as intolerant as Trump followers.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Yes, Jan 6, for example. As you indicate, the radical left is often as intolerant as Trump followers.

Change the subject when you want to change the argument. I never mentioned Jan 6, nor Trump.

Weinstein whom I showed as an example, was a classic liberal all through his professional career, and still considers himself as a liberal. I agree with people like him more than conservatives, whom most are not Trump supporters. Those who supported Trump Jan 6 are of the radical right. They're as bad as the radical left. Extremist on both sides are being heard, while the silent majority are in the middle just trying to keep the bill collectors at bay.

 

[The Barbarian]

Change the subject when you want to change the argument. I never mentioned Jan 6, nor Trump.

You wrote:

That would be the classic definition, but not the political definition now being put forth.

I merely noted that the radical left can be as intolerant as Trump and his followers.

Weinstein whom I showed as an example, was a classic liberal all through his professional career, and still considers himself as a liberal.

Yes, liberals and moderate conservatives are the targets of intolerance these days.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

You wrote:


I merely noted that the radical left can be as intolerant as Trump and his followers.



Yes, liberals and moderate conservatives are the targets of intolerance these days.

Again, I never mentioned Trump or his followers.

Trump supporter is the default accusation by leftist toward people they're intolerant of.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Dostoevsky was largely correct.

Tolerance for moral degeneration in particular within society has only increased. To the point where we see movements like the fat acceptance movement or how we must celebrate women being as promiscuous as men or a variety of social contagion.

It's not even as if there isn't intolerance, it's just that the intolerance has moved against what we once previously thought of as good in society. We've confused liberty with libertinism.

 

[The Barbarian]

Tolerance for moral degeneration in particular within society has only increased.

Not as of last November.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Not as of last November.

Do you actually think Biden being elected is a reversal the moral degeneration of the West?

 

[The Barbarian]

Do you actually think Biden being elected is a reversal the moral degeneration of the West?

You're being way too optimistic. Just a big improvement. It's the reversal of the moral degeneration in the WH.

A good sign that the American public's patience with moral dengerates is wearing thin.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

You're being way too optimistic. Just a big improvement. It's the reversal of the moral degeneration in the WH.

How does that help the West in general? What action, if any, can anyone in Washington do to reverse moral degradation and decline of the West?

 

[The Barbarian]

How does that help the West in general? What action, if any, can anyone in Washington do to reverse moral degradation and decline of the West?

That's not a bad question. Biden doesn't pander to dictators and praise them. Good start there. He doesn't cheat on his wife, he doesn't compulsively lie.

Does that matter? Yes, I think it does.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

That's not a bad question. Biden doesn't pander to dictators and praise them. Good start there. He doesn't cheat on his wife, he doesn't compulsively lie.

Does that matter? Yes, I think it does.

What's Biden going to do that increases the moral quality of life in America and the world? Him being honest or not cheating on his wife will not necessarily bring about the best consequences for the world. With his position of power and influence, what law is he doing that will aid people being better?

There have been plenty of immoral rulers who never the less aided the people under them and imposed good laws. What in the end will Biden do that actually reverses moral degradation?

 

[The Barbarian]

What's Biden going to do that increases the moral quality of life in America and the world?

I would have thought being faithful to his wife, not lying constantly, and following the laws of the county would be a step in the right direction.

Leadership matters.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I would have thought being faithful to his wife, not lying constantly, and following the laws of the county would be a step in the right direction.

Leadership matters.

Leadership only matters if you get results and are able to accomplish a task. If as Christians we view it as necessary to bring the Kingdom of God about while on earth (to the limited degree we are able to), how is the Biden administration going to actually aid that? Will the culture of pornography end under Biden? Will people be less likely to get divorced under Biden? Will people get less or more abortions under Biden? Will people go to Church more? In twenty years time, will Biden have achieved anything of merit or will be be but one more President before the eventual decline of the American Empire?

His personal actions have no bearing on anything. Constantine was a literal murderer but he left the Roman Empire off in a better state.

 

[The Barbarian]

Leadership only matters if you get results and are able to accomplish a task.

That's what leadership is.

 

[Jesus is my Superhero]

Am I losing my mind? Biden doesn't even know that he's President. All of this is elder abuse.

 

[The Barbarian]

Am I losing my mind?

That would be one possibility. Biden, who outsmarted a large field of other democratic candidates and embarrassed Donald Trump in the debates, clearly has a better grasp of the presidency than the last occupant of the oval office, who often needed to be assisted in drinking water and walking down ramps.

It is true that Trump, when tested for dementia, was able to identify a picture of an elephant, so he wasn't as impaired as many people thought.

Biden doesn't even know that he's President.

Americans disagree with you. His job approval is currently higher than Trump ever achieved. Which is a pretty low bar, yes. But still.

All of this is elder abuse.

Verbal abuse from the losers doesn't seem to bother him much.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

That's what leadership is.

What result does Biden want? He wants a more liberal America and he's likely going to be successful in accomplishing this goal.

This will not result in anything good for Christianity mind you.