Does Porneia include phone and cyber sex?

[Life2Christ]

Does the greek word used in the New Testament "porneia" include phone and cyber sex? The reason I ask is because if you have phone or cyber sex (assuming you aren't married) you technically are outside of the "one flesh" doctrine. You do not become physical with one another.

Not to beat a dead horse, but by the time I filed for divorce, he only had long-distance "sex" with the mistress. They technically didn't become one flesh (at that point). Yes its considered adutlery but no phyiscality took place.

Any insight?

 

[Peripatetic]

Others may disagree, but I don't think the answers are usually found in strict word definitions. It's all about intent. If a married person is having cyber sex, phone sex, sending racy pictures to each other, or even just heavily flirtatious emails, he or she is committing adultery.

For a single person... well... that's a lot harder to quantify. There's a whole continuum of behaviors that two people can do. From innocent flirting and holding hands to sexual crimes that could land you in jail, and everything in between. Depending on your cultural belief system and how you interpret scripture, there are many different answers to what is and is not sinful in God's eyes.

 

[Kevin_Wright]

Jesus said THINKING about another woman/man (sexually, duh) was porneia. I don't know exactly how you could have cyber or phone sex without doing that. But I guess if you can then, no.

 

[Aibrean]

^ agreed

 

[Peripatetic]

Jesus said THINKING about another woman/man (sexually, duh) was porneia.

I think there is a genuine difference between sexually lusting after someone that you don't love and loving someone (that you may even be planning to marry) and having some sexual thoughts about him/her. Even a kiss or a touch of a hand can be electric. We no longer get married at 12 or 13 like they did in Biblical times. A person may go years of dating during peak hormone times, and we can't expect to turn our sexual instincts completely off like switches.

Is phone sex between an "in love" couple a form of fornication/porneia? A couple probably shouldn't be looking to achieve too high a level of sexual intimacy prior to marriage, so I think it can be. But I still think there is a difference between calling a phone sex hotline and a long-distance couple getting a little frisky on the phone while holding on to their virginity.

 

[Kevin_Wright]

ummm...lol...

In this case the guy having the phone sex was MARRIED.

Yeah I would call that fornication.

 

[Wolvrin704]

For one you are most likely having thoughts about it so yes. But even if not, you are treading a dangerous road flirting with such danger. Any such flirtation will eventually lead to needing more danger to quench the fleshly desires. Where does it end?

 

[Aibrean]

I personally think that it's not something an unmarried (to each other) couple should be doing.

 

[Life2Christ]

Thanks for the replies. There seems to be an Old Testament and New Testment difference in porneia. Before Jesus, if you had sex even with a prostitute you had to marry her or if a rapist had sex with a virgin he had to marry her. This was because they became one flesh with each other. When Jesus came, he said even if you think about it, its wrong. So don't even think about it.

The reason I started the thread is because I'm on a biblical quest to find out if my divorcing my husband was justified, even though he was having an affair that hadn't gotten physical yet but was inappropriate in every other way.

Thanks.

 

[TailOfChrist]

Well, if he is dirty and does not want to clean himself up, then biblically I think you are allowed to divorce him.

But if you are capable of cleaning up your husband, and he is willing to cooperate with you to help himself become clean - then that would solve the problem - with patience and willingness to surrender it to God. But most people dont know how to do that.

People can become healed spiritually from that problem that your husband has. By prayer, fasting and willingness to surrender his body, mind and soul to God, then it is possible to become healed from such problems.

 

[Life2Christ]

But if you are capable of cleaning up your husband, and he is willing to cooperate with you to help himself become clean - then that would solve the problem - with patience and willingness to surrender it to God. But most people dont know how to do that.

I didn't give him a chance to clean himself up. I filed for divorce 13 days after he left us. There was no sign of him coming back. Part of the guilt I feel is that maybe I should have waited for him to come back and we could have reconciled but while we were waiting for the divorce to be finalized, I begged him to come home and leave the mistress. I told him I would have stopped the divorce. It didn't work.

 

[TailOfChrist]

You did excactly what I would have done. But I deleted that part in the text that I wrote, because I did not want to mislead you with my own attitude to men (or women) who make such mistakes as he did.

He probably would not change his way anyway. The sexual force is very strong, and it is difficult to get a person to change his way from that kind of uncleanliness. The person needs to have a willingness to work it out, but many dont even have that, because they love it too much.

I understand that you blame yourself. It is a normal reaction. But he is responcible for what he did, and for leaving too. He should have begged, not you.

 

[Life2Christ]

He should have begged, not you.

After all was said and done, the mistress ended up dumping him for an ex-felon. Even after that I begged him to come home, not sure why I did. We were already legally divorced. I would have tried to make our family work again. My ex-H told me No Thanks. He had already found a new girlfriend. Its like God didn't want me to be married to him. Through out this whole process I became a Christian.

 

[Peripatetic]

ummm...lol...

In this case the guy having the phone sex was MARRIED.

Yeah I would call that fornication.

But that wasn't the question in the original post of this thread. See below (bold added by me):

The reason I ask is because if you have phone or cyber sex (assuming you aren't married) you technically are outside of the "one flesh" doctrine. You do not become physical with one another.

The word fornication is usually used to describe pre-marital sex, while adultery is the word used to describe extra-marital sex.

 

[TailOfChrist]

After all was said and done, the mistress ended up dumping him for an ex-felon. Even after that I begged him to come home, not sure why I did. We were already legally divorced. I would have tried to make our family work again. My ex-H told me No Thanks. He had already found a new girlfriend. Its like God didn't want me to be married to him. Through out this whole process I became a Christian.

Hi again Life to Christ

In the Bible it is said about marriage: What God has joined noone can separate.

It is also said that only in a situation where there is fornication or adultery, only in such case it is accepted to divorce. I think you have not done anything against the advice from God.

There are those who marry because they are brought together by their own will. When they choose to marry and be faithful, God blesses their choice.

Then there are those who marry because they are brought together by God.

I am not trying to tell you anything. Just contemplating a bit loosely about marriage.

Best wishes

Tail of Christ

 

[Hiroyuki]

Does the greek word used in the New Testament "porneia" include phone and cyber sex? The reason I ask is because if you have phone or cyber sex (assuming you aren't married) you technically are outside of the "one flesh" doctrine. You do not become physical with one another.

Not to beat a dead horse, but by the time I filed for divorce, he only had long-distance "sex" with the mistress. They technically didn't become one flesh (at that point). Yes its considered adutlery but no phyiscality took place.

Any insight?

Sounds like "the flesh", one can divorce someone for adultery... but if you can repair the relationship and get his wandering eyes set only on you, do try and do so.


Literal adultery physically connects two bodies, and causes serious internal problems. That is why Paul says, "above all flee fornication".


Repairing a relationship, waking him up is a huge and difficult thing to do, however and one which I rarely see anyone ever ask questions on.

Yes it is adultery... but then again, so is looking at someone else in lust ever.


It just means he is dead/unconscious... physical reactions.

 

[Alphabet1]

Does the greek word used in the New Testament "porneia" include phone and cyber sex? The reason I ask is because if you have phone or cyber sex (assuming you aren't married) you technically are outside of the "one flesh" doctrine. You do not become physical with one another.

Not to beat a dead horse, but by the time I filed for divorce, he only had long-distance "sex" with the mistress. They technically didn't become one flesh (at that point). Yes its considered adutlery but no phyiscality took place.

Any insight?

Get rid of the flake and find someone that actually loves you.

 

[TheDag]

Does the greek word used in the New Testament "porneia" include phone and cyber sex? The reason I ask is because if you have phone or cyber sex (assuming you aren't married) you technically are outside of the "one flesh" doctrine. You do not become physical with one another.

Not to beat a dead horse, but by the time I filed for divorce, he only had long-distance "sex" with the mistress. They technically didn't become one flesh (at that point). Yes its considered adutlery but no phyiscality took place.

Any insight?

yes there are biblical rules and guidelines. I would compare it to walking on a cliff. The idea is not that you walk as close to the cliff edge that you might fall over but rather you stay away from the cliff edge. So with any rule in the bible I think the idea is that we keep a safe distance from the edge just in case a strong gust of wind comes along and pushes us over to our demise.