Daily Office Lectionary vs. Revised Common Lectionary

[benedictine]

I knw that the general convention authorised the Revised Common Lectionary to replace the Prayer Book Lectionary. But, is the Prayer Book's Daily Office Lectionary still in effect?

 

[Fish and Bread]

My understanding is that the Revised Common Lectionary was only authorized as an optional substitution for the BCP lectionary if specifically requested by a parish and approved by the bishop of it's diocese, and that the BCP's lectionary is still in place for most parishes. So, if I understand the general convention's decision correctly, the BCP Daily Office lectionary is still in effect as well.

Personally, I think the general convention's decision to authorize use of the RCL was a mistake. I think the use of the same lectionary throughout the Episcopal Church was a good form of symbolic unity and a nice thing for people who might be on vacation or a business trip out of town who wanted to be assured that they would hear the same readings at the parish they're visiting as they would have heard at home. The RCL also contains no readings from the deutrocanonicals which begs the question of what the good of putting them in the back of our copies of the Old Testament is if we never read from them (I know they're only very occasionally in the BCP, but at least they're there).

Does anyone have any statistics on how many parishes nationwide are taking advantage of the RCL option? Has anyone here had any experience with it being done at their parish or in their diocese? Anyone had their parish discuss changing and ultimately deciding against it? I would be interested in hearing about how this is working out "on the ground".

John

 

[PaladinValer]

Neither of my parishes go by the RCL, thank God.

 

[benedictine]

I don't think mine does, either. A look at the ECUSA Liturgy and Music webpage says it is "ecuminical". hmmmmpf.

 

[Fish and Bread]

Has anyone noticed whether or not there seems like an overall difference in emphasis and/or implied theology between the BCP lectionary and the RCL?

John

 

[PaladinValer]

Other than it kills off the use of the Deuterocanon in the liturgical readings, which has been a mainstay since...well...ever, I'm not sure. But I do not like the idea of dropping these canonical books from the lectionary.

Benedictine,

1. It is "ecumenical" (Don't worry to much; I'm a wretched speller myself)
2. There isn't anything wrong with ecumenicalism so long as it means you don't have to drop doctrine or dogma. The RCL drops the Deuterocanon and seems to imply it isn't useful; that's a bad form of ecumenicalism. I don't see anything wrong with sharing hymns with other Christians (especially with VCs, OCs, OOs, EOs, Lutherans, and Methodists [+John Wesley!]), but put in something that sounds theologically off, and I'll refuse to sing it.

 

[pmcleanj]

Personally, I think the general convention's decision to authorize use of the RCL was a mistake. I think the use of the same lectionary throughout the Episcopal Church was a good form of symbolic unity and a nice thing for people who might be on vacation or a business trip out of town who wanted to be assured that they would hear the same readings at the parish they're visiting as they would have heard at home. The RCL also contains no readings from the deutrocanonicals...

The BCP Lectionary is essentially the Common Lectionary, also in use by the Roman Catholic Church. It is in on most days similar or identical to the readings of the RCL, with the exception that the RCL offers a choice of Old Testament patterns. Furthermore, the RCL does indeed include the deutero-canonicals, giving an alternative reading to the deutero-canonical for use by those churches that do not recognize the deutero-canonicals.

I've been using the Common Lectionary for Sunday School and Bible Study since the late 1970's, and the Revised Common Lectionary since the mid-eighties; and I've used both in ecumenical studies. The RCL is now used by churches as diverse as the Anglican Church and the American Baptist Convention (not all of either, obviously: the one thing in which Baptists and Anglicans are similar is that you can find an exception to nearly every generalization!) The virtue you mention -- of being able to be on vacation or a business trip out of town and hear the same readings as at home -- are now available to those of us who can only find a United Methodist or ELCA church, or a Presbyterian Church, or a United Church -- all of which are predominantly using the RCL. And ecumenical mid-week Bible-studies can follow their church's pattern of readings and all be on the same page.

Regarding the choice of Old Testament patterns, the intent is to choose one pattern or the other, not to swap back and forth between the readings. The old pattern, used in the CL, was to follow the Gospels more or less sequentially, and draw on Epistles and Old Testament readings that illuminated the Gospel lesson. That philosophy led to the Old Testament's being read piecemeal. People with fond Sunday-School memories of OT "Bible Stories" never got to hear them read in sequential order.

The second OT pattern added to the RCL to supplement the "thematic" pattern, puts the OT lessons in more-or-less sequential order.

The Vanderbilt Library is the home of the RCL on line, http://divinity.lib.vanderbilt.edu/lectionary/ and you can go there to observe both the presence of the deuterocanonicals, and the two patterns of readings, for example: http://divinity.lib.vanderbilt.edu/lectionary/BPentecost/bProper20.htm

Incidentally, if there's a particular passage that you're wondering when it will be read, satucket has a "when will it be read" listing: http://www.satucket.com/lectionary/When_Will_It_Be_Read.htm

 

[Timothy]

I think we use the RCL... we've got a massive great big book which has the readings in at our combined pulpit/lectern....

Timothy

 

[benedictine]

I would argue that the Gospels are slightly more important than the Old Testament.

 

[Fish and Bread]

The virtue you mention -- of being able to be on vacation or a business trip out of town and hear the same readings as at home -- are now available to those of us who can only find a United Methodist or ELCA church, or a Presbyterian Church, or a United Church -- all of which are predominantly using the RCL. And ecumenical mid-week Bible-studies can follow their church's pattern of readings and all be on the same page.

It sounds like to me, as long as the RCL is optional in Episcopal churches and not the normative lectionary form in our church organization, that those churches who use it are sacrificing unity within ECUSA for unity with other denominations. It's well-intentioned, but it seems little bit backwards priority wise. If it is decided that we should consider switching to the RCL as a church organization for eccumenical reasons, then let's consider it *as an entire denomination* rather than doing it piecemeal. The present arrangement of some Episcopal parishes using one system and others using another system is the worst of both worlds, in my opinion. It also takes away from the BCP, which is supposed to be the basis of our liturgy and an important sign of our unity. The proper time and the proper way to consider a lectionary change is when a new BCP is being devised so we can address it as a group and have the lectionary available to all in their new BCP editions.

Moreover, the RCL is not even decidely more eccumenical than the BCP lectionary. My ECUSA parish uses the BCP lectionary and the readings match up nearly exactly with the readings my Roman Catholic relatives report being read at their RCC parish (I've only noticed a handful of major differences over the course of a year). The times I've visited the local Lutheran congregation, the lectionary readings have been something completely different. Given the size of the Roman church, our BCP thus matches up more closely with a larger number of Christians' weekly readings than the RCL would.

John

 

[IowaLutheran]

Moreover, the RCL is not even decidely more eccumenical than the BCP lectionary. My ECUSA parish uses the BCP lectionary and the readings match up nearly exactly with the readings my Roman Catholic relatives report being read at their RCC parish (I've only noticed a handful of major differences over the course of a year). The times I've visited the local Lutheran congregation, the lectionary readings have been something completely different. Given the size of the Roman church, our BCP thus matches up more closely with a larger number of Christians' weekly readings than the RCL would.

John

Hmm, my guess is that the Lutheran churches you have attended do not use the RCL (which is fairly common).

Augsburg Fortress (the ELCA publishing house) publishes a commentary on all three lectionaries called New Proclamation. I have been reading it as a devotional since Advent. The BCP/RCL/RC lectionaries are all very, very close. Sometimes there will be a different gospel, and sometimes a different OT lesson, but that is the exception rather than the rule. I regularly go to an Episcopal church on Wednesdays that uses the BCP and the lessons are almost always the same as what I heard the previous Sunday.

The only decidedly theological move I have ever noticed was in an Advent lesson, the BCP and RCL Gospel was Matthew 1:18-25, whereas the RC Gospel was Matthew 1:18-24. Why did the RC leave out verse 25? My guess is so that there would be no confusion over this statement: "But he had no union with her until she gave birth to a son." (The English word "until" implies they had sex after Jesus' birth, Catholic scholars claim the Greek word has no such connotation).

 

[Fish and Bread]

Hmm, my guess is that the Lutheran churches you have attended do not use the RCL (which is fairly common).

Oops. I feel pretty stupid. I guess between my Roman Catholic upbringing and my time in the Episcopal Church, I pretty much internalized the idea that a parish/congregation would almost always stick to it's church's lectionary no matter what and just assumed that all demoninational churches with lectionaries worked that way. Looking at a few sample weeks of lectionaries online, the RCL and the BCP aren't nearly as different as I had thought.

But this brings up an interesting point: Why do some Lutheran churches feel compelled to deviate from their lectionaries? Doesn't that lead to some measure of chaos and situations where the pastor pushes his or her own personal theology through the readings he or she chooses at the expense of readings that might support contrary claims or emphasises?

John

 

[IowaLutheran]

Oops. I feel pretty stupid. I guess between my Roman Catholic upbringing and my time in the Episcopal Church, I pretty much internalized the idea that a parish/congregation would almost always stick to it's church's lectionary no matter what and just assumed that all demoninational churches with lectionaries worked that way. Looking at a few sample weeks of lectionaries online, the RCL and the BCP aren't nearly as different as I had thought.

But this brings up an interesting point: Why do some Lutheran churches feel compelled to deviate from their lectionaries? Doesn't that lead to some measure of chaos and situations where the pastor pushes his or her own personal theology through the readings he or she chooses at the expense of readings that might support contrary claims or emphasises?

John

Don't feel stupid - I didn't realize this either until the subject came up in the class I'm taking at Luther Seminary. My church uses the RCL but when I asked my Pastor, he confirmed that many do not.

I totally agree with you regarding your question. Deviation from the lectionary is not a good thing.

My best explanation is that like there are Anglo-Catholics, Evangelical Anglicans, broad church Anglicans, etc., there is perhaps an even broader spectrum of Lutherans within the ELCA itself (not to mention our differences with Missouri and Wisconsin Synods). ELCA pastors who would not be inclined to use the RCL would be from either anti-authoritarian backgounds and would be suspicious of a mandatory lectionary, and the "church growth" Lutherans, who have chucked tradition out the window, use no liturgy, and use all praise music.

 

[Fish and Bread]

I hope this doesn't sound hopelessly secular, but I feel one of the benefits of having a denomination is being able to go to a church anywhere in the country and be surrounded by familar liturgies and songs and such just like folks might be comforted by finding a McDonalds in a strange town and knowing exactly what they want to order. There's a degree familairity and consistancy there that one comes to expect from a "name brand" church. I wouldn't want to walk into church one day or visit a church in another city and find out they've done away with weekly communion so they can sing extra Amy Grant songs (No offense to Amy Grant, who I actually think is an excellent musician). It seems like if I visit a Lutheran church in another town I'm liable to find variations exactly like that. In the Episcopal Church, obviously, there's a certain tradition of divergent thought, but also a tradition of uniform liturgy thanks to the Book of Common Prayer. I've really found it to be a perfect fit for me -- freedom of belief, uniformity of the basic liturgy. There's a spirtual comfort and sense of communion with generations past that comes from doing the same thing over and over again in a way that is universal from city to city, it's part of where the "catholic" part of the Nicene Creed comes in.

It's not a moral issue, but for me in discerning what denomination to join, the congregationalism of Lutheranism was a big mark against it. Martin Luther is probably my favorite theologian and in theory a church that follows Luther should be perfect for me, but I just never felt comfortable with the lack of universality. I checked out two different Lutheran churches and neither used the creed at the services I attended and one basically had no coherent liturgy at all and just tossed songs up on a projection screen and had a 25 minute long set of announcements that compromised nearly half of the liturgy. I also really wanted weekly communion, which was something that Martin Luther himself was in favor of! As it happened, my local Lutheran congregation did have weekly communion, but just knowing I could move somewhere where they wouldn't or drop by a congregation if I were out of town and miss communing was a very difficult idea. The anarchy of the whole setup was very disconcerting for me given my Roman Catholic background.

You can imagine what happened when I visited a Methodist church for a couple weeks! The time they put the gospel before the Old Testament reading just about drove me to drink, which is of course doubly a sinful thought if you're a Methodist (Who traditionally don't drink, though that is changing). ;-)

I'm probably mildly OCD, but I seem to fit right in with Episcopalians. We had a fun conversation a few weeks ago after a traditional service about how much it annoyed us that people kept wandering in and out of the contemporary service slamming doors during the sermon and how distracting it was (When someone brought it up it was like she read my mind, because that had been a pet peeve of mine for a while). I really love the beauty of the liturgies we have and the reverent and respectful way that they are conducted with such attention to detail -- even the contemporary service. ;-)

John

 

[IowaLutheran]

John, you and I have a lot of common, except that I was born Lutheran and fortunately, I am in a Lutheran church that has weekly communion and respects the liturgy. While on vacation recently, I ended up in an Episcopal church because, like you, I'd rather go someplace where I know what I am going to get.

The only part of your post I disagree with is about Amy Grant. She may be an excellent musician, but I dislike happy, sickly-sweet saccharine Christian pop. I think Lent is my favorite time of year because of the prevalent use of minor chords.

 

[Fish and Bread]

John, you and I have a lot of common, except that I was born Lutheran and fortunately, I am in a Lutheran church that has weekly communion and respects the liturgy. While on vacation recently, I ended up in an Episcopal church because, like you, I'd rather go someplace where I know what I am going to get.

It does seem as though we have a lot in common. I find myself agreeing with your posts very frequently.

The only part of your post I disagree with is about Amy Grant. She may be an excellent musician, but I dislike happy, sickly-sweet saccharine Christian pop.

I like Christian pop for home listening purposes, in large part because I grew up being exposed to a lot of it. In the context of communal worship, though, I much prefer traditional hymns, partly because I simply like that type of music better at times due to a greater spirtual depth in the lyrics and a better sense of the history of the Church, but primarily due to the fact that I can actually handle mummering along with it. I know folks may laugh at this, but I think an important part of selecting a church hymn is finding something that people with very limited musical abilities (Such as myself) can handle singing softly without embarassing themselves overly much. I've never been able to master such subtleties as "tone" and "melody". ;-) I may be an extreme case, but it's a very noticeable amongst the wider congregation during contemporary services when the choir tries to turn the Kyrie and the Our Father into some sort of a musically complex pop songs and almost no one except the choir feels comfortable trying to wrap their vocal cords around singing them. A communion song or something is one thing, but the Kryie and Our Father really needs to allow for audience participation (I try to sing them anyway, but trust me, it isn't pretty ;-)).

Anyhow, I can remember being really excited on the occasions where they played "Lift High the Cross" and "A Mighty Fortress is Our God" for the first time since I start attending my parish. It's nice to catch up on all the classic Protestant songs that my Roman Catholic parish refused to play when I was growing up. I'm still waiting for "Amazing Grace", which is probably my favorite traditional Protestant hymn and which I have yet to hear sung at a service, though I did once go to a Lutheran service where they did an instrumental version of it with wind chimes. ;-) I spoke with someone in our choir and he promises they'll get around to playing it eventually...

John

 

[IowaLutheran]

Anyhow, I can remember being really excited on the occasions where they played "Lift High the Cross" and "A Mighty Fortress is Our God" for the first time since I start attending my parish. It's nice to catch up on all the classic Protestant songs that my Roman Catholic parish refused to play when I was growing up. I'm still waiting for "Amazing Grace", which is probably my favorite traditional Protestant hymn and which I have yet to hear sung at a service, though I did once go to a Lutheran service where they did an instrumental version of it with wind chimes. ;-) I spoke with someone in our choir and he promises they'll get around to playing it eventually...

John

When I was in a Catholic church one time, I checked and "A Mighty Fortress" is in their songbook, but I've never heard it sung there. That didn't terribly surprise me because a Lutheran composed many of the tunes used in modern Catholic masses (Marty Haugen).

I usually have a stiff upper lip (that's my 1/2 English ancestral background) but I get a tear in my eye whenever I hear Scotty play "Amazing Grace" on the bagpipes at Spock's funeral in Star Trek II.

 

[Fish and Bread]

When I was in a Catholic church one time, I checked and "A Mighty Fortress" is in their songbook, but I've never heard it sung there.

One of my relatives actually reported to me that she had heard "A Mighty Fortress" in a Roman Catholic church. I tried to point out to her the inconsistency of excommunicating someone and then singing his songs in church, but sometimes trying to reason with my relatives is like trying to reason with a brick wall. It's hard being the token Protestant in a large Roman Catholic extended family. ;-)

I usually have a stiff upper lip (that's my 1/2 English ancestral background) but I get a tear in my eye whenever I hear Scotty play "Amazing Grace" on the bagpipes at Spock's funeral in Star Trek II.

Bringing back Spock was one of the few times a fictional character has died and been reborn on film where it didn't feel like a cheat. They did a wonderful job with the whole story arc in Star Trek 2, 3, and 4.

John

 

[Timothy]

I'm still waiting for "Amazing Grace", which is probably my favorite traditional Protestant hymn and which I have yet to hear sung at a service

Amazing Grace was written by an Anglican/Episcopalian chaplain! We should do it more often at our church too...

Timothy